Inspect my re-man brake caliper & critique my work

Bumbo · Feb 8, 2017

First time doing my own brake job... but I noticed some things that kind of concern me... looking for an experienced eye.

I noticed a lot of pitting on one of the pistons of my new / re-manufactured caliper and want to know if I should be concerned about the rough cup. It almost doesn't look like its perfectly centered in the caliper either.

Am I over thinking this? Note, I haven't got a chance to road test the truck yet... Still working on my rears and still need to bleed.

Here are the pictures of the caliper in question... also included a picture of the pad which I removed just to take the picture. (notice the marks on the anti-squeal plate from the pitted piston)

Note: This is the brand new pad... I tried to bleed the system before I got to the rears and was told by a friend I applied too much grease... so I removed it to clean and saw that the piston has actually made some marks/indentations into the new pads already... All the other pistons are clean and smooth circles.

Notice the other side (driver) looks nice and clean on all 4 pistons.

Some before and after shots of the caliper and line... feel free to comment.

07V8 · Feb 8, 2017

Notice any difference in pedal feel with the SS lines?

ZebRuaj · Feb 8, 2017

Where'd you get the caliper from? Little stuff like that would add to my paranoia knowing the quirks of our braking system.

I always check parts before I leave if I bought them locally .. different story if bought online.

Bumbo · Feb 8, 2017

07V8 said:
Notice any difference in pedal feel with the SS lines?

Bumbo said:
Note, I haven't got a chance to road test the truck yet... Still working on my rears and still need to bleed.

So... No, not yet. I will report back when I get a chance to. I'm really looking forward to seeing if there is a difference. I am doing all 6 lines in the truck so if there is a difference to be felt, ill feel it.

That said I really didn't need to do lines, nor did I do it in hopes to get a firmer pedal feel... mine were still in really good condition even after 200k.

For $150 DIY I figure I treat myself to a more complicated install with additional frustration and swearing.

Ill let you know if it was worth it.

Bumbo · Feb 8, 2017

ZebRuaj said:
Where'd you get the caliper from? Little stuff like that would add to my paranoia knowing the quirks of our braking system.

I always check parts before I leave if I bought them locally .. different story if bought online.

I agree... now that I know one of those pistons are "not perfect"... is on the brain and pokes at me a bit. If I road test and it all feels good-to-go, ill probably call it good.

My real question is:
1) Is that OK / does it look OK
2) Is that normal to see in a re-man?
3) Should I be anal and go though the trouble/time/irritation of changing it out.

I get all my parts from RockAuto

Caliper Part #
CENTRIC 14144245
CENTRIC 14144246

Pads#
AKEBONO ACT976

Rotors#
CENTRIC 12044129

ZebRuaj · Feb 8, 2017

The inside of the cup doesn't really matter. It's what's inside the boot and caliper that matter (the outside of the piston). I hope that isn't pitted.

Hopefully after bleeding the brakes the two piston's contact points even themselves out on the pad.

Bumbo · Feb 8, 2017

ZebRuaj said:
The inside of the cup doesn't really matter. It's what's inside the boot and caliper that matter (the outside of the piston). I hope that isn't pitted.

Hopefully after bleeding the brakes the two piston's contact points even themselves out on the pad.

Ya I dont care about the inside of it...

If you look at the photos, its clear that the outside rings of the piston is pitted.

In fact it's already transferred its pitting imprint onto the anti-squeal shim on the pad, also pictured...

Its probably fine, it just irritates me that its there. I don't have enough experience with this stuff to say...
"ya its totally fine"
"naw, get that changed out"
"its probably fine, but I wouldn't want it on my own truck"

I was hoping to catch a professional mechanic around here that has seen enough re-man calipers to help me with that...

KingPrat · Feb 8, 2017

Bumbo said:
I was hoping to catch a professional mechanic around here that has seen enough re-man calipers to help me with that...

Sounds like a job for [MENTION=66389]BlackWorksInc[/MENTION]

BlackWorksInc · Feb 8, 2017

I mean it doesn't look pretty, but it's functional. The important part is the seal between the bore and the piston and the dust boot that protects that. As long as those look good (if the seal was bad it'd leak fluid), which it seems to be; I wouldn't be concerned as everything will work. But if it that bothersome you could always see if they'll exchange it.

Bumbo · Feb 8, 2017

BlackWorksInc said:
I mean it doesn't look pretty, but it's functional. The important part is the seal between the bore and the piston and the dust boot that protects that. As long as those look good (if the seal was bad it'd leak fluid), which it seems to be; I wouldn't be concerned as everything will work. But if it that bothersome you could always see if they'll exchange it.

Thanks for the response.

As long as its functional, i'll be a happy camper. I prefer not to have to do work twice, or even go though the hassle of a return/reinstall.

The seals between the piston and bore seem to be holding up fine as I have already tried bleeding the fronts. I don't see any fluid seeping out of any critical areas.

As much as I prefer things to be "perfect" I also understand that if someone did the work for me I wouldn't know or care one way or another, assuming it works correctly.

Bumbo · Feb 8, 2017

Last question if anyone has time to confirm...

After I do my rear lines I am going to bleed the system... from my reading and research this is what I have planned for the process:

Do the bleed with the ignition on, but engine not running.
Top the MC and close the cap (or do I leave it open)?
Bleed Rear Passenger
Bleed Rear Driver
Bleed Front Passenger
Bleed Front Driver

During that process keeping an eye on the level of the MC.

I also read that the rear has some type of brake booster pump... so just having someone hold the brake peddle down will constantly feed brake fluid to the rears using some type of pump assist. Is that true for a 2004 v6 SR5 4x4?

Any tips or tricks for a first time DIYer?

blackoutt · Feb 8, 2017

key on engine off, top MC off with fluid, leave cap off, have assistant press brake pedal firmly, go to rear and crack a bleeder, the pedal will settle a little bit but you'll hear the pump running and the pedal will attempt to maintain feel. Bleed til there's no air or dirty old fluid coming out (assuming you're trying to flush it all for this job) but also make sure the MC doesn't go too low and suck air, DO NOT SUCK AIR, close the bleeder when clear and air free, let assistant take foot off pedal, top off MC again, press pedal, bleed other side. Front doesn't have the pump so you'll have to have assistant pump the pedal and hold, crack bleeder til pedal kits floor, close bleeder, assistant pump, repeat for both sides til clear and air free. Again DON'T let the mc suck air, top off and put cap back on. Then go run in the pads nice and hot without complete stops and enjoy the new firm pedal feel. Also for your pitted pistons, it's crappy but as commented earlier it will work as long as the outer bore of the piston is smooth where the radial seal is in contact with it.

catrains · Feb 8, 2017

your rock auto caliper has 2 pistons . one piston looks new . the other extremely corroded. I am sure its not from CA....looks like a rust belt piston that was in the scrap yard a few years .

my advice is buy these at local auto part stores...these parts are not tested and may fail at an early time. If they look bad on the store counter reject them...go to another store.

both pistons should be in the same condition. lets say that piston begins to leak out brake fluid gets on your tires/paint .. is rock auto gonna pay for all the damage...

the pitted piston may also stick , then you will get poor breaking and uneven pad wear. many have had issues with re-manufactured calipers including me .. very poor QC.........

lbhsbz · Feb 8, 2017

Nothing to worry about. I work for Centric.

When we do a run of a certain part number, we tear down a few hundred caliper. All the parts go to their respective cleaning/sorting/inspection stations. We inspect used pistons for defects that would affect their ability to work correctly...chipped/pitted plating on the sealing surfaces, damage to the face of the piston (have seen lots that made contact with the brake rotor), etc...The good ones go over the build tables, the bad ones are scrapped and replaced with other good used, or if we don't have any used, we will use new.

The 142 line of calipers gets all new pistons, the 141s are a more economical caliper and one of the ways we keep the price down is to reuse certain components if they're in serviceable condition. Of course, all the seals/boots/bleeders/wear parts get replaced...but if the piston is round and the sealing surface is in good shape, it'll work as well as a new one so there's no point in changing it. Phenolic pistons are a different story...we replace those on every build.

Bumbo · Feb 8, 2017

lbhsbz said:
Nothing to worry about. I work for Centric.

When we do a run of a certain part number, we tear down a few hundred caliper. All the parts go to their respective cleaning/sorting/inspection stations. We inspect used pistons for defects that would affect their ability to work correctly...chipped/pitted plating on the sealing surfaces, damage to the face of the piston (have seen lots that made contact with the brake rotor), etc...The good ones go over the build tables, the bad ones are scrapped and replaced with other good used, or if we don't have any used, we will use new.

The 142 line of calipers gets all new pistons, the 141s are a more economical caliper and one of the ways we keep the price down is to reuse certain components if they're in serviceable condition. Of course, all the seals/boots/bleeders/wear parts get replaced...but if the piston is round and the sealing surface is in good shape, it'll work as well as a new one so there's no point in changing it. Phenolic pistons are a different story...we replace those on every build.

Awesome post... thanks for checking in. I really appreciate insight like that into the process and part #.

They say loaded with pads for the 142, which pads do you use, just some OEM spec equivalent?

Also, thanks for the heads up on the 142 line... they definitely look like they are worth the small increase in cost.

Either way, for $50-60 per caliper after the core return for the 141 line isn't bad... its affordable and easy enough that I would do it again in a couple years with the 142, but if I knew up front I would have went that route anyways... I probably ended up sending more because I went with some more expensive pads.

lbhsbz · Feb 8, 2017

Bumbo said:
Awesome post... thanks for checking in. I really appreciate insight like that into the process and part #.

They say loaded with pads for the 142, which pads do you use, just some OEM spec equivalent?

Also, thanks for the heads up on the 142 line... they definitely look like they are worth the small increase in cost.

Either way, for $50-60 per caliper after the core return for the 141 line isn't bad... its affordable and easy enough that I would do it again in a couple years with the 142, but if I knew up front I would have went that route anyways... I probably ended up sending more because I went with some more expensive pads.

142 caliper include the posiquiet pads...in this case, our Posiquiet Ceramic. These are the pads I use on my 4runners.

Also, you might wanna pull the wheels and get some paint on those calipers after a few heat cycles. There's no long term rust protection on the 141 calipers. They are bare iron, run through a dip to keep them from rusting during assembly/handling/shelf life, but it washes off with water and they will rust...won't affect performance, but they end up looking like shit.

catrains · Feb 8, 2017

Bumbo said:
Awesome post... thanks for checking in. I really appreciate insight like that into the process and part #.

They say loaded with pads for the 142, which pads do you use, just some OEM spec equivalent?

Also, thanks for the heads up on the 142 line... they definitely look like they are worth the small increase in cost.

Either way, for $50-60 per caliper after the core return for the 141 line isn't bad... its affordable and easy enough that I would do it again in a couple years with the 142, but if I knew up front I would have went that route anyways... I probably ended up sending more because I went with some more expensive pads.

this may sound weird but I have been to the scrap yards up here and have found some almost new brake parts on scrap vehicles.. save a lot . even the rotors .. the vehicle looks like a rusted out vehicle all the other components really bad but the brakes on many are looking good. probably to pass inspection..

Bumbo · Feb 17, 2017

07V8 said:
Notice any difference in pedal feel with the SS lines?

Now that I am done with the project...

In all honesty I don't know yet if the lines were worth doing... I only say this because of the amount of time and effort that was involved to get it done right. It was just a lot of effort to get everything buttoned up right without leaks and avoid weird bends.

My brakes just felt so different that I it wasn't really what I was expecting. The pedal throw felt like it required more input to do the amount of work as before, but it was very linear though the stroke.

In addition to that with new pads and rotors didn't help me isolate what I was feeling... New calipers, new lines, new pads, new fluid...

It didn't produce a race car level of pedal feel... perhaps my expectations were on in line with what I was thinking. But it just changed how everything felt.

I dont know if its better yet, I just know its different... I really need to let everything settle in before I can say for sure if it was "worth it".

If I could do this again... I would have probably just did the calipers only. And if I still wanted lines, I would have did it at a separate time so I can actually see what types of differences it made.

The part that I am getting used to is how the truck feels like it needs more input that before to get that braking force, but if I do apply real pressure, like a panic or emergency stop, the truck locks up pretty good and I come to a screeching stop, but I really have to let it know that is what I want it to do...

Hope that helps, but it probably doesn't.

DT04R · Mar 2, 2017

lbhsbz said:
142 caliper include the posiquiet pads...in this case, our Posiquiet Ceramic. These are the pads I use on my 4runners.

Also, you might wanna pull the wheels and get some paint on those calipers after a few heat cycles. There's no long term rust protection on the 141 calipers. They are bare iron, run through a dip to keep them from rusting during assembly/handling/shelf life, but it washes off with water and they will rust...won't affect performance, but they end up looking like shit.

Howdy!

I'm getting ready for some new front calipers for an '08 Limited (so the smaller, non-sport size).

Does Centric have a caliper that's pre-coated/painted? If so, do you know the part number for the R/L fronts? I'll probably order from Rock Auto.

TIA.

Maineiac · Mar 2, 2017

Sounds like you need to do more work on bleeding the system. I only did the front lines and it was a pretty big difference. What method did you use to bleed?
Maineiac

Inspect my re-man brake caliper & critique my work

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