User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 02-27-2019, 02:53 PM #1
rorikk's Avatar
rorikk rorikk is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Ventura, CA
Posts: 23
rorikk is on a distinguished road
rorikk rorikk is offline
Junior Member
rorikk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Ventura, CA
Posts: 23
rorikk is on a distinguished road
Warm Start Issue(5-20 min after stopping) 1997 3.4L V6

Hello all,

I have been browsing around the forum for a ton of info the last few years and it's been so helpful! Lately though, the other posts haven't quite had my specific problem. I am working through the fixes they used to try and isolate the issue.

I have been chasing an issue on my Runner for the past week or two, but the problem has been around for the past several months. The truck will not hold idle(it cranks, fires up and then dies) when it has been running for about 30 minutes and then tried to start up again 5-10 minutes later, say stopping for gas or grabbing groceries on the way home from work. If it's fired up right after turning off, it will work fine, the longer you wait, the lower the idle sits at when fired up, or it dies because it can't hold it. If the idle starts low but doesn't shut off, but holds, driving around will bring it back up to normal. If you wait about 45 minutes or so it will work just fine or from a cold start. If the truck turns on and holds idle, it will drive no issues at all until I stop and turn it off again.

I'm thinking it has to do with the computer thinking it still has fuel in the system, so it shuts it off, or that being warm, it doesn't pump anymore fuel in thinking there should be residual fuel and it dies. Seems to be less efficient recently

No CEL has come on for this issue at all. I thought it had culminated and finally gone to crap when I got a misfire code. I limped home and started troubleshooting that. New plugs, no fix, and then new wires, no more misfire, no more CEL. Warm start problem still there.

I've been poking around and cleaning things as I have time. It gets me to work and back, but multi-stop trips make me not want to use it haha.

What I've done:
- new TPS (swapped spur of the moment when I couldn't get it to start for an hour and we were stranded. Started up, but we'd sat long enough to cool down)
- new spark plugs
- new spark plug wires
- bottle of Techron injector cleaner in a tank of gas
- measured correct resistance on all 3 coils
- measured correct resistance on passenger side injectors(other 3 injectors inaccessible without removing both plenums)
- cleaned TB
- cleaned MAF


Yesterday:
- measured correct resistance IAC contacts
- cleaned IAC (idle moves around a tad more, was solid at 700/750, but will lower down to 600 occasionally. Too soon to tell, but I don't think it solved it)
- measured EFI relay for continuity (got 93ohms)
--may be a red flag, will measure it cold to see if different. It works fine all other times.


I'm going to be measuring COR and other relays or hopefully while warm and cold the next several days to get readings that might tell something. Probably check the coolant temp sensor readings in the ECU terminals.

Does anyone have any other simple suggestions to check that don't require throwing parts at it or ripping too much apart?? It's my daily driver, so major time apart would have to be the weekend.

(Sorry for the long description, but it's a pretty specific thing and wanted to share the most info I had available)

Thanks!
__________________
Ď97 4Runner SR5 4WD 5spd Manual
rorikk is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 02-27-2019, 04:51 PM #2
Kanoe's Avatar
Kanoe Kanoe is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Yukon
Posts: 1,233
Kanoe is a jewel in the rough Kanoe is a jewel in the rough Kanoe is a jewel in the rough Kanoe is a jewel in the rough
Kanoe Kanoe is offline
Senior Member
Kanoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Yukon
Posts: 1,233
Kanoe is a jewel in the rough Kanoe is a jewel in the rough Kanoe is a jewel in the rough Kanoe is a jewel in the rough
A good cleaning of the TB and particularly IAC has always fixed this issue for me. Have done it on several toyotas. By cleaning I mean IAC off, cleaned well on the bench.

Maybe your issue too??
__________________
-1996 4Runner. 3RZ 5-Spd. 4x4 Base model. OME2906 rears with 2004 Tacoma Dual Rate Fronts on Bilstien 4600s.
-1993 Corolla Wagon 7AFE
-2001 Echo D.D.
Kanoe is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 02-27-2019, 05:18 PM #3
rorikk's Avatar
rorikk rorikk is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Ventura, CA
Posts: 23
rorikk is on a distinguished road
rorikk rorikk is offline
Junior Member
rorikk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Ventura, CA
Posts: 23
rorikk is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanoe View Post
A good cleaning of the TB and particularly IAC has always fixed this issue for me. Have done it on several toyotas. By cleaning I mean IAC off, cleaned well on the bench.



Maybe your issue too??


Thanks so much for throwing that out there. I had cleaned the throttle body a few weeks back without really removing it. I went for the IAC last night, unbolted it from the throttle body, sprayed and cleaned it up(although it looked really clean having replaced it two years back) and put it all back together. Havenít extensively tested it, but going to check again when I drive back from work tonight to see if itís still an issue. I would love if that fixed it since thatís an easy one, but Iím not confident thatís it.

Will keep you updated on that, but looking for other things to check in the meantime.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Ď97 4Runner SR5 4WD 5spd Manual
rorikk is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 02-27-2019, 05:56 PM #4
norcalassassin's Avatar
norcalassassin norcalassassin is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 90
Real Name: Zac
norcalassassin will become famous soon enough
norcalassassin norcalassassin is offline
Member
norcalassassin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 90
Real Name: Zac
norcalassassin will become famous soon enough
When was the fuel filter last replaced?

Had the exact same issue and the fuel filter fixed this!
__________________
1998 SR5 5 spd 4x4 3.4L + some other stuff
1985 Tercel 4WD SR5 6spd, 4A swap
2006 Saab 9-2x Aero 5spd (saabaru)
IG: r0amerr
https://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-g...ce-thread.html
norcalassassin is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 02-27-2019, 06:01 PM #5
gamefreakgc's Avatar
gamefreakgc gamefreakgc is offline
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Citrus Heights, California
Posts: 6,214
Real Name: Jerod
gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold
gamefreakgc gamefreakgc is offline
Elite Member
gamefreakgc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Citrus Heights, California
Posts: 6,214
Real Name: Jerod
gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold
If it's not the fuel filter, then replace the entire throttle body assembly. For the 96-98 years they are cheap enough to find on Ebay or at a junkyard. Or at least the IAC, but normally it's not that much from a junk yard to snag the whole thing and then you've got a spare.
__________________
'98 4Runner SR5 - 4x4 JDM 5VZ-FE Supercharged - 233K miles.
326WHP 347TQ

AEM F/IC 6 Piggyback, 2.1" pulley at 11 PSI, Go-Fast Parts
Jerod's Supercharged T[u]RD Build
gamefreakgc is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 02-27-2019, 06:26 PM #6
rorikk's Avatar
rorikk rorikk is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Ventura, CA
Posts: 23
rorikk is on a distinguished road
rorikk rorikk is offline
Junior Member
rorikk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Ventura, CA
Posts: 23
rorikk is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by norcalassassin View Post
When was the fuel filter last replaced?



Had the exact same issue and the fuel filter fixed this!

Ok! Thatís on my list.
Iíve got a fuel filter on hand that I should get to by this weekend. Curious how that stops things up when warm, maybe it just settles and then wonít go?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gamefreakgc View Post
If it's not the fuel filter, then replace the entire throttle body assembly. For the 96-98 years they are cheap enough to find on Ebay or at a junkyard. Or at least the IAC, but normally it's not that much from a junk yard to snag the whole thing and then you've got a spare.

The IAC checks out electrically and I replaced it with a brand new one two years back. That looked much better than the throttle body. If it keeps coming up, I may look into that.

Some people have mentioned coolant sensors? Fuel pump relay?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Ď97 4Runner SR5 4WD 5spd Manual
rorikk is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 02-27-2019, 06:43 PM #7
LittleCaesar's Avatar
LittleCaesar LittleCaesar is offline
Elite Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: OBX, NC and Obamaville
Posts: 6,758
LittleCaesar is a jewel in the rough LittleCaesar is a jewel in the rough LittleCaesar is a jewel in the rough
LittleCaesar LittleCaesar is offline
Elite Member
LittleCaesar's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: OBX, NC and Obamaville
Posts: 6,758
LittleCaesar is a jewel in the rough LittleCaesar is a jewel in the rough LittleCaesar is a jewel in the rough
Maybe a fuel pump? Also check grounds and for vacuum leaks.

The EFI fuse, if it has continuity, will just give you a beep from your DVM, stating that there is no break. Just pop off the top cover for a close inspection.
LittleCaesar is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 02-27-2019, 07:38 PM #8
rorikk's Avatar
rorikk rorikk is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Ventura, CA
Posts: 23
rorikk is on a distinguished road
rorikk rorikk is offline
Junior Member
rorikk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Ventura, CA
Posts: 23
rorikk is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleCaesar View Post
Maybe a fuel pump? Also check grounds and for vacuum leaks.

The EFI fuse, if it has continuity, will just give you a beep from your DVM, stating that there is no break. Just pop off the top cover for a close inspection.
Thanks for the input.

Iíve checked for vacuum leaks, but Iíll keep an eye out. Where would be the grounds Iím looking for?

The EFI fuse I got 93ohms, not beeping and showing continuity. Iím going to check when itís cold/sitting all day to see if thereís any difference. But I may swap one from the auto parts store just to check as that would be a real easy solution.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Ď97 4Runner SR5 4WD 5spd Manual
rorikk is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 02-27-2019, 08:27 PM #9
gamefreakgc's Avatar
gamefreakgc gamefreakgc is offline
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Citrus Heights, California
Posts: 6,214
Real Name: Jerod
gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold
gamefreakgc gamefreakgc is offline
Elite Member
gamefreakgc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Citrus Heights, California
Posts: 6,214
Real Name: Jerod
gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold gamefreakgc is a splendid one to behold
Quote:
Originally Posted by rorikk View Post
Ok! That’s on my list.
I’ve got a fuel filter on hand that I should get to by this weekend. Curious how that stops things up when warm, maybe it just settles and then won’t go?




The IAC checks out electrically and I replaced it with a brand new one two years back. That looked much better than the throttle body. If it keeps coming up, I may look into that.

Some people have mentioned coolant sensors? Fuel pump relay?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Brand new Toyota IAC valve? I tried a reman'd unit a few years ago and it was garbage, made it idle super high since it was put together wrong. What you are describing is a classic IAC valve issue. However, idling between 600-700 is completely within spec. It should idle around 700-800 when warm and in park, and 600 when in drive (turning transmission lowers engine RPM) so that part checks out.

Coolant sensors do affect fueling but cannot pull fuel completely though. They do add more fuel to startup when cold but they don't take away much when warm. Mine on startup when real nice and hot will run in the 16's for Air/fuel ratio (stoich is 14.7) but has no affect on idle speed. The sensor that can pull fuel completely so it dies at idle is the MAF sensor. If the wiring is damaged internally (it has super thin exposed wires) or the harness itself is damaged that might cause it.

It still sounds exactly like a bad IAC valve though... The fact that the hotter the engine bay gets the worse the idle gets just screams IAC to me.
__________________
'98 4Runner SR5 - 4x4 JDM 5VZ-FE Supercharged - 233K miles.
326WHP 347TQ

AEM F/IC 6 Piggyback, 2.1" pulley at 11 PSI, Go-Fast Parts
Jerod's Supercharged T[u]RD Build
gamefreakgc is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 02-27-2019, 08:31 PM #10
MaineRunna's Avatar
MaineRunna MaineRunna is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Eliot, Maine USA
Posts: 316
Real Name: Mike
MaineRunna will become famous soon enough MaineRunna will become famous soon enough
MaineRunna MaineRunna is offline
Member
MaineRunna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Eliot, Maine USA
Posts: 316
Real Name: Mike
MaineRunna will become famous soon enough MaineRunna will become famous soon enough
Does it start and stay running if you hold the gas pedal down? I've had many Toyota's do this and if I held the gas part or all the way down it would start like an old flooded carbureted car, but stall when I let off. After keeping them running with the gas pedal for a bit they would idle on their own. It always turned out to be a dirty or faulty IAC.
MaineRunna is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 02-27-2019, 09:28 PM #11
rorikk's Avatar
rorikk rorikk is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Ventura, CA
Posts: 23
rorikk is on a distinguished road
rorikk rorikk is offline
Junior Member
rorikk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Ventura, CA
Posts: 23
rorikk is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by gamefreakgc View Post
It still sounds exactly like a bad IAC valve though... The fact that the hotter the engine bay gets the worse the idle gets just screams IAC to me.

The car runs fine no problem on a cold start and as long as you want to drive it. It only has issues on the warm start.

Itís not that itís hotter and hotter that makes the issue. If I start up a minute after shutting off itíll stay, but maybe at 500rpm, but waiting 2 or 3 minutes after shutting off itíll hover at 3-400rpm. If you drive it then this will even back out to normal rpm. May be itís gummed up when itís been hot and then sat for a few minutes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaineRunna View Post
Does it start and stay running if you hold the gas pedal down? I've had many Toyota's do this and if I held the gas part or all the way down it would start like an old flooded carbureted car, but stall when I let off. After keeping them running with the gas pedal for a bit they would idle on their own. It always turned out to be a dirty or faulty IAC.

And yep, itíll drive fine if I stay on the gas, eventually the idle will even back out to normal. Going to test drive it tonight and see if cleaning the IAC valve cleaning last night solved the issue. The resistance on the contacts was perfect, but I guess it couldíve been getting gummed up. Seemed pretty clean to me when I removed it, but I took throttle body cleaner and went at it anyways.

Thanks for the input! I will update if that cleaning helped anything.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Ď97 4Runner SR5 4WD 5spd Manual
rorikk is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 02-27-2019, 11:21 PM #12
onemanarmy onemanarmy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 248
onemanarmy is on a distinguished road
onemanarmy onemanarmy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 248
onemanarmy is on a distinguished road
I know you have the V6, but 3rz (4 cylinder Tacomas and 4 runners of the same era) have this issue. With the 3rz, there is a coolant/engine temp sensor near the back of the engine that feeds the computer (not the gauge)....and when it's hot and parked with the engine off, that sensor heat soaks and malfunctions and won't let the engine start. Either a complete no start or it tries to fire but stutters and backfires and shuts off. Only thing to do is to wait it out, it will eventually start.

Maybe something similar is happening with yours?
__________________
96 4runner 4wd 5 speed
77 FJ55
03 Z71

www.slowswerve.com
onemanarmy is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 02-28-2019, 12:45 AM #13
AntleredRuin AntleredRuin is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: TX
Posts: 1,192
Real Name: Daniel
AntleredRuin will become famous soon enough
AntleredRuin AntleredRuin is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: TX
Posts: 1,192
Real Name: Daniel
AntleredRuin will become famous soon enough
I just went through the EXACT same thing a few weeks ago. Turned out to be my fuel pump.
There's a check valve in it that is supposed to keep the fuel in the fuel lines when the truck is shut off, to avoid slow starts.
When warm (like after driving for a bit) and then shut off for 10-20 minutes, this check valve slowly fails and completely closes (not just one-way like a check valve should), which lowers fuel pressure. This makes it hard to start, and keeps the idle real low and sketchy for a minute or so, until the valve opens again (due to actual fuel flow, I'm guessing).
Let it cool down for 45 minutes and the check valve fully releases and you get easy starts again.

FYI keep a can of starter fluid on you. If it stalls and dies after a quick errand, you might not be able to restart it without waiting the 45 minutes. Ask me how I know.
I successfully recreated this 'no start' issue in my driveway, and a spritz of starter fluid got it going again.

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

Last edited by AntleredRuin; 02-28-2019 at 01:01 AM.
AntleredRuin is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 02-28-2019, 01:14 AM #14
wcjeep's Avatar
wcjeep wcjeep is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Earth
Posts: 795
wcjeep will become famous soon enough wcjeep will become famous soon enough
wcjeep wcjeep is offline
Member
wcjeep's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Earth
Posts: 795
wcjeep will become famous soon enough wcjeep will become famous soon enough
What is your fuel pressure when cold? Hot? Age of fuel filter? You could have water in the fuel filter from bad fuel. When you turn the vehicle off the water settles in the filter, blocking it. This can also ruin the fuel pump pushing against water blocked filter.

Carry a gasoline approved pressure gauge, rubber gloves and some towels.
__________________
2018 Offroad Premium w/KDSS

1993 Jeep YJ w/stuff
wcjeep is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 02-28-2019, 11:58 AM #15
huski's Avatar
huski huski is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Dallas
Posts: 80
huski is on a distinguished road
huski huski is offline
Member
huski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Dallas
Posts: 80
huski is on a distinguished road
Glad i found this. I'm experiencing something similar, though mine is very intermittent. New fuel filter, TB was cleaned maybe a year ago, IAC hasn't been changed or cleaned, i know i possibly have some vacuum leaks.

I have a jumping off point now. I'll report back with findings.

Thanks!
__________________
99 Limited, Locked, 5 Speed swap, frame swap.
huski is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Reply

Tags
idle , measured , start , warm , work

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
1997 warm start problems tobers 3rd gen T4Rs 6 07-08-2015 08:52 PM
2007 v8 sr5 4wd issue when stopping please read 07sarasotav8 4th Gen T4Rs 2 10-22-2010 07:14 PM
Dies after start/low idle on warm start Hogmoss 3rd gen T4Rs 3 10-19-2009 11:36 AM
1997 4Runner (3.4L V6) Warm Start Stall Problem? axhoaxho 3rd gen T4Rs 4 02-28-2006 07:14 PM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.2

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:27 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
***This site is an unofficial Toyota site, and is not officially endorsed, supported, authorized by or affiliated with Toyota. All company, product, or service names references in this web site are used for identification purposes only and may be trademarks of their respective owners. The Toyota name, marks, designs and logos, as well as Toyota model names, are registered trademarks of Toyota Motor Corporation***Ad Management plugin by RedTyger
 
Copyright © 2020