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-   3rd gen T4Rs (https://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/)
-   -   **Rear Coil Spring Discussion - The Perfect 3rd Gen Rear Spring** (https://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/281374-**rear-coil-spring-discussion-perfect-3rd-gen-rear-spring**.html)

TCMach 01-08-2020 06:27 PM

I need a 1" lift coil that holds weight like an 861 and has enough free height not to fall out..... :crazy:

UnderFire 01-09-2020 05:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4runnerfiend (Post 3420856)
Sorry I don' have specific data. But..



I've been happy with LC 8 wraps with no internal cone bumpstop.

I always run with about 100+ lbs in the rear and it sits at just above 24" so about 3" lift.



When I'm fully weighted with camping gear and people shoot probably 300 lbs with all the cooler ice and water/gear.. maybe more. it sits about level with the front 23"



Just got out a did a good flex test. Grabbed the coil springs and they were not going anywhere, no chance of them falling out.

Running FJ/4th gen 5100, no sway bar, and Rokmen offraod lower links.



For me, I don't need any more travel in the rear, I need to concentrate on the front travel.



Now if I was running a 200 lbs rear bumper plus all this stuff. It would be to much weight.

A big problem I've seen with using used FJ80 coils is that the variance can be huge. I originally ran 8 wraps in the rear of my first 4Runner and found them to be way taller than a lot of other member's sets. I was sitting about 4.5" of lift unloaded or with moderate load. Once I stuck an extra 400lbs in the back it was closer to level, but still not perfectly even with the 3" up front. About 3.5" with the 400lbs directly over the rear axle in the cargo area.

I will say though, I had it paired with OEM Tokico FJ80 rears and the ride quality was superb for a budget oriented setup. Much better than running a budget aftermarket shock like rough country, pro comp, etc. Similar experience with off the shelf stock replacements from Napa paired with Superflex coils, Highly recommend it to anyone looking for a cheap shock ~75$ for the pair.

Sent from my JSN-L23 using Tapatalk

eimkeith 01-09-2020 08:34 AM

I just got a Slinky/Icon setup for our FZJ80 - the coils are designed to have multiple dead loops at ride height that work as a helper spring to keep the coil from falling out when drooped. Perhaps the Australian company that makes them would be interested in rolling a 3rd gen solution as well?

80 series Slinky/ICON Long Travel Suspension officially coming to the U.S.A. | IH8MUD Forum

https://forum.ih8mud.com/proxy.php?i...2c9d7610d488e5

https://forum.ih8mud.com/proxy.php?i...17d73336c58ff3

TCMach 01-09-2020 05:17 PM

FWIW in my search for a shorter coil I got this from Dobinson.
C59-137V - 170lbs open -245lbs ride height - 331lbs collapsed - 420mm FH. The 70 mm difference in free height from an 861 or superflex might be an issue.

CT135 01-09-2020 06:37 PM

So is there a difference between the Dobsinson 210V and the OEM LC springs? WHy would I want to buy one vs the other? Can it handle weight better than the oem but isn't as crazy tall/heavy duty as the OME 861. Cause if that is the case I may be buying them.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Taylor20 (Post 3418096)
Thanks Rick for starting this.
Just to throw some more info out there from my searching.

The Dobinson 675v is a LT 4th gen rear coil. It provides the 4th gen's 2.5" of lift on average in stock form. That would provide us with 3.5" of lift due to the OE 4th gen spring providing about 1" of lift to start with. With extra weight it would bring that down some.
The Dobinson 210v is the stock height extra weight LC front spring, and from what @Black798 has told me it offers about 3.5" of lift with the extra weight.

I did have 861's, rear swingout and drawer system, but almost 5" of lift, it was just too much for me. I will probably order the 675v and see what those provide in the next couple months.

Free height is key for a spring not falling out, it would have to be at least 480mm to not leave a worry of them doing so.


HiMiles 01-09-2020 07:57 PM

I've had about 6 different rear spring pairs in my 4Runner, with many more sub-combos of packers and air bags. I have both high and variable weight in the back, since I have a 4XI swingout bumper and tow a light car trailer from time to time.

I ended up with the Superflex coils, simply because they have the highest "final" rate of any of the heavily progressive coils and prevent big rake changes with variable weight. This is a huge selling point, especially when they still ride very nicely sans trailer.

Unfortunately, air bags aren't quite the silver bullet they'd seem to be for variable weight, since you can't safely run them at 0psi. I always found them a bit harsh unladen, even inside soft coil springs.

CT135 01-09-2020 10:19 PM

So with your bumper/swing out. Roughly how much lift are you getting from the super flex? Hub to fender would be awesome to know.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HiMiles (Post 3421632)
I've had about 6 different rear spring pairs in my 4Runner, with many more sub-combos of packers and air bags. I have both high and variable weight in the back, since I have a 4XI swingout bumper and tow a light car trailer from time to time.

I ended up with the Superflex coils, simply because they have the highest "final" rate of any of the heavily progressive coils and prevent big rake changes with variable weight. This is a huge selling point, especially when they still ride very nicely sans trailer.

Unfortunately, air bags aren't quite the silver bullet they'd seem to be for variable weight, since you can't safely run them at 0psi. I always found them a bit harsh unladen, even inside soft coil springs.


Fishwerks 01-10-2020 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickashay (Post 3418074)
I for one, would love a LT rear spring capable of staying in the coil buckets at full droop, capable of supporting 200-250lbs of rear weight (over stock) and sitting at 2.5-3Ē of lift. My ideal spring may be different than yours, but thatís where we can start to collect some data and see if there are some common themes to approach a vendor about a custom spring potentially.

I'm glad you started this thread. I've been talking to Tyler about rear springs a good bit lately. I like the 861s when I have the swingout on and the truck loaded for a camping trip or something, but most of the time I wish they sat 1-2" lower. Like @AZBub mentioned, you really need a lot of weight to get them down to a reasonable height.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4-Ripcord (Post 3420785)
I went through the same process on my last 4runner, actually had most of these springs on it at one point or another trying to find the right one I liked.

I used some OME chart to fill in spring rates for most of them, and confirming free heights by hand measurements. The superflex and 891 are progressive so hard to give an exact value for, but superflex definitely felt softer than the 861. IMO the 861 were too stiff.

In the end I was most happy with the superflex, and would get that again if I built another t4r.





My requirements were very similar to yours: +250ish lbs, less than 3" lift, long enough to not fall out when drooped.

Good to know, I've been considering superflex or one of the dobinsons variations as options.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TCMach (Post 3421074)
I need a 1" lift coil that holds weight like an 861 and has enough free height not to fall out..... :crazy:

Take a sawzall to the 861s and let us know how much to cut.

Dieselchessy 01-10-2020 08:53 PM

I was thinking more along the lines of what we did in high school to lower rigs. Take a torch and apply heat at the right point until the spring relaxes to the desired height.

Taylor20 01-10-2020 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AZBub (Post 3421040)
OME 861. You either love em or hate em. The thing is if you have a lot of gear all the time or an actual overland rig buildout in back is where these springs shine the most. Yes unloaded they sit high. No they are not for a rig that doesn’t have a ton of weight in back. A ton of weight would be along the lines of a fridge, slide, storage, support gear, rear tire swing out with fuel etc.... Just like you would re-gear to gain back performance from weight and tire size etc you add these springs to deal with....weight.

I have those now, and those that I have talked to with them agree its too much lift and too stiff. This sparked the quest, for me at least, to find a more suitable spring.


Quote:

Originally Posted by eimkeith (Post 3421289)
I just got a Slinky/Icon setup for our FZJ80 - the coils are designed to have multiple dead loops at ride height that work as a helper spring to keep the coil from falling out when drooped. Perhaps the Australian company that makes them would be interested in rolling a 3rd gen solution as well?

Slinky is good stuff, I'm just leaning more towards Dobinson because I have been in contact with someone about a creating a new option for the 3rd gen's...and I have just heard more about Dobinson.


Quote:

Originally Posted by TCMach (Post 3421531)
FWIW in my search for a shorter coil I got this from Dobinson.
C59-137V - 170lbs open -245lbs ride height - 331lbs collapsed - 420mm FH. The 70 mm difference in free height from an 861 or superflex might be an issue.

If the free height was there, these would be an excellent option with say under 150 extra lbs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CT135 (Post 3421576)
So is there a difference between the Dobsinson 210V and the OEM LC springs? WHy would I want to buy one vs the other? Can it handle weight better than the oem but isn't as crazy tall/heavy duty as the OME 861. Cause if that is the case I may be buying them.

Spring rate and coil diameter for the most part. The difference in minimal, only about .5" between the two.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HiMiles (Post 3421632)
I've had about 6 different rear spring pairs in my 4Runner, with many more sub-combos of packers and air bags. I have both high and variable weight in the back, since I have a 4XI swingout bumper and tow a light car trailer from time to time.
I ended up with the Superflex coils, simply because they have the highest "final" rate of any of the heavily progressive coils and prevent big rake changes with variable weight. This is a huge selling point, especially when they still ride very nicely sans trailer.
Unfortunately, air bags aren't quite the silver bullet they'd seem to be for variable weight, since you can't safely run them at 0psi. I always found them a bit harsh unladen, even inside soft coil springs.

I had Superflex before the 861's and swingout, drawer system. Amazing springs, but with extra weight, they sagged.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fishwerks (Post 3422209)
I'm glad you started this thread. I've been talking to Tyler about rear springs a good bit lately. I like the 861s when I have the swingout on and the truck loaded for a camping trip or something, but most of the time I wish they sat 1-2" lower. Like @AZBub mentioned, you really need a lot of weight to get them down to a reasonable height.

Ya, they are a good option, just not the right option for most.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dieselchessy (Post 3422248)
I was thinking more along the lines of what we did in high school to lower rigs. Take a torch and apply heat at the right point until the spring relaxes to the desired height.

Horrible idea

Dieselchessy 01-11-2020 01:40 AM

Tough crowd. LOL!

rickashay 01-11-2020 02:22 AM

Good discussion. I might have to try the superflex's but I am worried I will be too heavy for them too...

I am just waiting for someone to try the Dobinsons 675V before I make a move.... any takers? lol

Mark_BC 01-11-2020 09:50 PM

Is there a front version of this thread? I'm going to get a coastal offroad front bumper (100 lb) plus winch so i want to know which coil and shock to get for about maybe 1" of lift and overlanding with gear in the back.
3rd Gen 4Runner Closed Top Front Bumper Kit - Coastal Offroad
I know there's tons of threads on suspension but it changes from year to year and there's too much information overload.

Taylor20 01-13-2020 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickashay (Post 3422403)
Good discussion. I might have to try the superflex's but I am worried I will be too heavy for them too...

I am just waiting for someone to try the Dobinsons 675V before I make a move.... any takers? lol

I will be as soon as my 861's sell

Dieselchessy 01-17-2020 12:37 AM

Stumbled across this site. Itís got a pretty good list of specs.

Cruiser Outfitters


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