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Old 04-24-2020, 09:39 PM #1
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Now with noise! Any idea what would cause this? (timing tensioner pulley)

New, supposedly OEM part from the Amazon kit that a lot of people recommend here. Has 12,680 miles on it.

Any ideas?
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Now with noise! Any idea what would cause this? (timing tensioner pulley)-tensioner_pulley1-jpg 
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Old 04-24-2020, 11:21 PM #2
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It's obvious some rubber from the belt transferred to the pulley like the belt wasn't rolling smoothly on the pulley and it sometimes dragged across rather than rolled across. Does the pulley bearing feel ok?
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Old 04-24-2020, 11:28 PM #3
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It looks like your engine is kind of oily. Any sign of oil contamination on the backside of the belt? I could see that causing gunk to accumulate.
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Old 04-24-2020, 11:51 PM #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbtim View Post
It's obvious some rubber from the belt transferred to the pulley like the belt wasn't rolling smoothly on the pulley and it sometimes dragged across rather than rolled across. Does the pulley bearing feel ok?
Are you THE Tim who has all the awesome YouTube videos? Gotta say thanks for all you've contributed to the community!

I have a few ideas but I don't want to taint the problem-solving process.

The pulley bearing is loose from side to side. Here's a video: YouTube - you can see the play towards the middle/end of the clip . The thing is, I ordered a new genuine tensioner pulley from a Toyota dealer, and it also has play - although not as much as the bearing in the photo. How much play is acceptable in a new bearing? The top idler (between the camshaft sprockets) has zero play in my fingers, for example. It was also completely clean aside from one small speck of rubber.

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It looks like your engine is kind of oily. Any sign of oil contamination on the backside of the belt? I could see that causing gunk to accumulate.
It does look like that, but that fresh wet area was actually caused by a leaking hood scoop. It rained and dripped onto the block after I tore into the engine. No gunk or contamination anywhere near vital parts. The belt looks good as new but as Tim said it's obviously been transferring some rubber onto the pulley.
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Old 04-25-2020, 01:15 AM #5
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Originally Posted by SigSaucer View Post
Are you THE Tim who has all the awesome YouTube videos? Gotta say thanks for all you've contributed to the community!

I have a few ideas but I don't want to taint the problem-solving process.

The pulley bearing is loose from side to side. Here's a video: YouTube - you can see the play towards the middle/end of the clip . The thing is, I ordered a new genuine tensioner pulley from a Toyota dealer, and it also has play - although not as much as the bearing in the photo. How much play is acceptable in a new bearing? The top idler (between the camshaft sprockets) has zero play in my fingers, for example. It was also completely clean aside from one small speck of rubber.

It does look like that, but that fresh wet area was actually caused by a leaking hood scoop. It rained and dripped onto the block after I tore into the engine. No gunk or contamination anywhere near vital parts. The belt looks good as new but as Tim said it's obviously been transferring some rubber onto the pulley.
Yes, I'm Timmy the Toolman. Thanks for being a fan and you're welcome.

Maybe the rubber transfer is from the belt shimmying on the pulley from the bearing movement. But, why would the belt move a bunch unless something is instigating the belt to move in and out? I've experienced one 3.4 liter engine that had gross in and out crankshaft play due to the thrust washers giving way. If the crankshaft was able to move in and out, that would also drag the timing belt with it in and out causing the dragging on the lower idler pulley.

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Old 04-25-2020, 03:34 AM #6
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Why is the timing belt off and you inspecting the pulley at 12k of use?

Did you replace the tensioner 12k in the past?

Is the bearing smooth when rotated?
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Old 04-25-2020, 06:49 AM #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dieselchessy View Post
Why is the timing belt off and you inspecting the pulley at 12k of use?
I'd rather not say just yet as I do not want to introduce bias. I am going to check the crank per Tim's advice first. The vehicle has no rough idle or rough running and no misfires/codes.

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Did you replace the tensioner 12k in the past?
Yes, everything was replaced with parts from the Amazon "OEM" timing kit. Timing belt, idler pulley, tensioner pulley, tensioner, water pump, etc. All done correctly and had no issues for 12,000 miles. No loose bolts, missing washers, etc.

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Is the bearing smooth when rotated?
Yes, it just has the side-to-side play as seen in the video.

Here are two more photos. Not sure if that mark was on the back of the pulley when I originally installed it.
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Now with noise! Any idea what would cause this? (timing tensioner pulley)-img_9569-jpg  Now with noise! Any idea what would cause this? (timing tensioner pulley)-img_9571-2-jpg 
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Old 04-25-2020, 11:34 AM #8
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I donít understand the cat and mouse withholding info bit.
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Old 04-25-2020, 01:08 PM #9
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I donít understand the cat and mouse withholding info bit.
I understand what he's doing. He doesn't want to get people tunneled in on one possibility because maybe there's something he hasn't considered yet that he can learn from us, The Peanut Gallery.
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Old 04-25-2020, 07:48 PM #10
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I understand what he's doing. He doesn't want to get people tunneled in on one possibility because maybe there's something he hasn't considered yet that he can learn from us, The Peanut Gallery.
Exactly, couldn't have worded it better myself. Thanks for understanding, Tim. Not trying to play games or anything. It seems this approach already might be bearing rotten fruit, lol.

I came across one of your videos a few weeks ago that showed the crankshaft move forward upon startup. I checked this on mine and the crank didn't move at all. But... I did push and pull on the crankshaft today and found this:

YouTube

YouTube

What do you guys think?
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Old 04-25-2020, 08:03 PM #11
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Originally Posted by SigSaucer View Post
Exactly, couldn't have worded it better myself. Thanks for understanding, Tim. Not trying to play games or anything. It seems this approach already might be bearing rotten fruit, lol.

I came across one of your videos a few weeks ago that showed the crankshaft move forward upon startup. I checked this on mine and the crank didn't move at all. But... I did push and pull on the crankshaft today and found this:

YouTube

YouTube

What do you guys think?
Uh oh. I think one of your thrust washers may be on it's way out. That play is not normal. That little bit of movement in the crankshaft is causing the belt to move a tiny bit in and out causing the belt to rub on the pulley.
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Old 04-25-2020, 10:56 PM #12
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There is a normal slight amount of crankshaft thrust clearance . Only way to be sure is to put a dial indicator on it and take a measurement.
Standard clearance: 0.020-0.220 mm (0.0008-0.0087 in.)
Maximum thrust clearance: 0.300 mm (0.0118 in.)
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Old 04-25-2020, 11:01 PM #13
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There is a normal slight amount of crankshaft thrust clearance . Only way to be sure is to put a dial indicator on it and take a measurement.
Standard clearance: 0.020-0.220 mm (0.0008-0.0087 in.)
Maximum thrust clearance: 0.300 mm (0.0118 in.)
What we saw in that video looked like at least a 1 mm of play. I'd say it's out of spec but maybe my eyes are deceiving me.
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Old 04-26-2020, 12:21 AM #14
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What we saw in that video looked like at least a 1 mm of play. I'd say it's out of spec but maybe my eyes are deceiving me.
Not disagreeing with you that it didn't look in spec.
I usually talk to a machine shop owner that was also a friend of mines. From our after hours talks at his shop I learned that some of our eyes are good but, not a calibrated tool.
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Old 04-26-2020, 10:21 AM #15
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Not disagreeing with you that it didn't look in spec.
I usually talk to a machine shop owner that was also a friend of mines. From our after hours talks at his shop I learned that some of our eyes are good but, not a calibrated tool.
I can't argue with that.
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