07-09-2020, 09:25 PM
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#31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sweet88gt
So you have the alternator removed and everyone is just changing the brushes?? No diode or regulator replacement ?
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The brushes fail first. It’s a ware part.
Normally if a diode block or voltage regulator fails you got some serious problems or a manufacturing defect.
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07-10-2020, 02:08 PM
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#32
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Sounds like a bad alternator, but now that your brake lights and alarm don't work I'd start checking fuses too. I'd also have the battery tested, a bad cell can kill your alternator as well. Don't want you to replace a alt only to have it die again.
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07-10-2020, 02:27 PM
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#33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sweet88gt
So you have the alternator removed and everyone is just changing the brushes?? No diode or regulator replacement ?
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Over the years, I've had one regulator failure (likely cause was failure of aftermarket remote start), and no diode failures. Not sure how one would be able to tell if either of those was nearing a failure point.
I've had one brush failure at 240k which I should have avoided, and replaced 4 sets preventively around 200k miles. I was first turned on to the brush replacement by my dealership parts guy when my 1988 4Runner was approaching 200k miles. That alternator lasted to 305k when I got rid of the truck. Brush replacement is around $15-$20, easy, and typically only needed once. It's the main cause of alternator problems, as I understand it.
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07-10-2020, 03:25 PM
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#34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thennen
Over the years, I've had one regulator failure (likely cause was failure of aftermarket remote start), and no diode failures. Not sure how one would be able to tell if either of those was nearing a failure point.
I've had one brush failure at 240k which I should have avoided, and replaced 4 sets preventively around 200k miles. I was first turned on to the brush replacement by my dealership parts guy when my 1988 4Runner was approaching 200k miles. That alternator lasted to 305k when I got rid of the truck. Brush replacement is around $15-$20, easy, and typically only needed once. It's the main cause of alternator problems, as I understand it.
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Correct me if I am wrong here. Won't bad brushes (not charging) cause the alt light to come on? I can't imagine it wouldn't. What did you see? I've had it happen in a corolla and the light does come on in that case.
I'm thinking if you have an alternator die and not see the alt light on the dash then you have bigger problems than brushes.
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-1996 4Runner. 3RZ 5-Spd. 4x4 Base model. OME2906/Toyota OEM rears with 2004 Tacoma Dual Rate Fronts on Bilstien 4600s.
-1993 Corolla Wagon 7AFE
-2001 Echo D.D.
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07-10-2020, 03:42 PM
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#35
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I suspect that the used T4R I just bought is going to turn into a real project .
Note to Kanoe: just prior to the total electrical failure , I lost my dashboard lights AND my tail-lights.
Are there any other hidden fuse boxes, other than the one in the drivers side interior lower panel and the one in the engine compartment ?
Last edited by Traveler74; 07-10-2020 at 03:47 PM.
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07-10-2020, 04:12 PM
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#36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Traveler74
I suspect that the used T4R I just bought is going to turn into a real project .
Note to Kanoe: just prior to the total electrical failure , I lost my dashboard lights AND my tail-lights.
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Separate issue. The moment your brushes failed and the alternator was no longer charging, you should have had a light on the dash, just one light to indicate the alternator was no longer charging. this is your warning sign of troubles. The vehicle will continue to run on battery for some time (hours??) on battery reserve alone.
What you saw when you lost all lights was the system shutting down due to low battery. See the difference? One is a warning and should have occured a long time before your truck died.
Let us know how it turns out. I suspect your alternator fail light might be not working as designed. It should come on when you turn the key to ON before you start the truck and go out once started.
Don't get too down on the truck. We all have gone through this. The problem with Toyotas in general is that they are so tough that previous owners can neglect them for years and they still keep going. Then we buy them when the list gets bigger than they want to deal with. You'll get there and it'll be good once you catch up.
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-1996 4Runner. 3RZ 5-Spd. 4x4 Base model. OME2906/Toyota OEM rears with 2004 Tacoma Dual Rate Fronts on Bilstien 4600s.
-1993 Corolla Wagon 7AFE
-2001 Echo D.D.
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07-10-2020, 05:11 PM
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#37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanoe
Correct me if I am wrong here. Won't bad brushes (not charging) cause the alt light to come on? I can't imagine it wouldn't. What did you see? I've had it happen in a corolla and the light does come on in that case.
I'm thinking if you have an alternator die and not see the alt light on the dash then you have bigger problems than brushes.
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My 2001 4Runner experienced the brush failure. My wife was DD of that. According to her, there was a day or two of sluggish starting. Then the next day, it failed while she was driving. Had to replace the alternator because nobody carries brushes. I removed them to check, and they were worn badly - one was at about 1/16” or so. She said the battery/alt lights came on only as it was dying.
What I assume was a regulator failure happened on my son’s 2009 Corolla, and it was a hard failure with dash lights and everything. First symptom of that WAS dash lights. Brushes were nearly new.
So to answer your question, maybe it’s because a brush failure isn’t like flipping a switch, since it happens gradually as contact is lost. There would still be some measure of charging until there wasn’t. I don’t know at what point the car is supposed to declare a charging problem.
With your Corolla, did the brushes fail, or do you know?
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07-10-2020, 05:42 PM
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#38
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I have located and ordered the alternator bushes (incased in a round plastic ring) on e Bay. Only $9.00. It LOOKS exactly like the one I saw on a youtube video and the one shown in Chilton's Repair Manuel, (chapter 5, page 5-15). eBay claims it fits my 1996 T4R SR5.
Being an old fart, I'm much more familiar with the cars of the 50's, and 60's than I am of the newer cars. I certainly did not expect to find the voltage regulator INSIDE the alternator. Tiny little thing. But I didn't order it yet. Perhaps I should have.
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07-10-2020, 06:05 PM
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#39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanoe
Separate issue. The moment your brushes failed and the alternator was no longer charging, you should have had a light on the dash, just one light to indicate the alternator was no longer charging. this is your warning sign of troubles. The vehicle will continue to run on battery for some time (hours??) on battery reserve alone.
What you saw when you lost all lights was the system shutting down due to low battery. See the difference? One is a warning and should have occured a long time before your truck died.
Let us know how it turns out. I suspect your alternator fail light might be not working as designed. It should come on when you turn the key to ON before you start the truck and go out once started.
Don't get too down on the truck. We all have gone through this. The problem with Toyotas in general is that they are so tough that previous owners can neglect them for years and they still keep going. Then we buy them when the list gets bigger than they want to deal with. You'll get there and it'll be good once you catch up.
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Agreed. Hopefully you have time and the availability of another vehicle to drive. If so, you can troubleshoot without pressure. As Kanoe said, people will drive and drive these things because they can. You have a ton of experience here on the forum, and guys eager to help. You’ll get there.
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07-10-2020, 06:47 PM
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#40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2TH4IST
Sounds like a bad alternator, but now that your brake lights and alarm don't work I'd start checking fuses too. I'd also have the battery tested, a bad cell can kill your alternator as well. Don't want you to replace a alt only to have it die again.
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I replaced the battery with a new one 2 weeks ago. Since then , however, the alternator failed and I had to have auto zone recharge it for 2 hours. Being 20 miles from home I decide to run on battery power alone and get it home. almost made it. 2 blocks short. Now battery is dead again and I'll be trickle charging it for as long as it takes.
excellent video YouTube
Last edited by Traveler74; 07-10-2020 at 07:40 PM.
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07-10-2020, 07:01 PM
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#41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thennen
With your Corolla, did the brushes fail, or do you know?
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Yes, the brushes were wore out. At about 210,000km. Drove the next set to nearly 400,000km on the original alt.
The charge light came on one day. Tapping the alternator with a screwdriver would get it working again and the light would go out. This went on getting progressively worse for a few days until I got the brushes replaced.
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-1996 4Runner. 3RZ 5-Spd. 4x4 Base model. OME2906/Toyota OEM rears with 2004 Tacoma Dual Rate Fronts on Bilstien 4600s.
-1993 Corolla Wagon 7AFE
-2001 Echo D.D.
Last edited by Kanoe; 07-10-2020 at 07:04 PM.
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07-10-2020, 08:44 PM
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#42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thennen
Over the years, I've had one regulator failure (likely cause was failure of aftermarket remote start), and no diode failures. Not sure how one would be able to tell if either of those was nearing a failure point.
I've had one brush failure at 240k which I should have avoided, and replaced 4 sets preventively around 200k miles. I was first turned on to the brush replacement by my dealership parts guy when my 1988 4Runner was approaching 200k miles. That alternator lasted to 305k when I got rid of the truck. Brush replacement is around $15-$20, easy, and typically only needed once. It's the main cause of alternator problems, as I understand it.
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I searched brushes and found most very cheap. I have an alternator pushing 13-13.3volts when hot. While I had it off I wondered why not replace the other items.
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07-10-2020, 09:39 PM
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#43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sweet88gt
I searched brushes and found most very cheap. I have an alternator pushing 13-13.3volts when hot. While I had it off I wondered why not replace the other items.
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Gotcha. I just don’t know what the benefit would be since regulators and diodes aren’t wear items like brushes.
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07-10-2020, 11:05 PM
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#44
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I know there is a fuse box in the engine compartment and another one near the drivers knee, but are there any other hidden ones ?
I am especially interested in the one for the instrument panel AND the one for the tail lights, and the one which supplies power to the auto alarm system. All three are currently non-functional. (3rd gen, 1996 T4R SR5, 2 wheel drive, automatic trans.)
Last edited by Traveler74; 07-10-2020 at 11:16 PM.
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07-11-2020, 01:30 AM
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#45
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Those are the only two fuse panels.
Some guys here have wiring diagrams but not me, sorry.
__________________
-1996 4Runner. 3RZ 5-Spd. 4x4 Base model. OME2906/Toyota OEM rears with 2004 Tacoma Dual Rate Fronts on Bilstien 4600s.
-1993 Corolla Wagon 7AFE
-2001 Echo D.D.
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