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Old 07-15-2020, 06:20 AM #31
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I have a 2005 SR5 with 150,000 miles and she never ever failed to start and run properly. The only part that failed in 15 years on mine was the starters, and I replaced three of them with AM from Amazon. Dealer here in the Bahamas once told me they would order a new starter from Japan for over $900. I found an AM at Amazon for $100. I keep a "new" rebuilt Amazon bought AM spare in the garage and my mechanic can install it anywhere for $60.

Water and engines don't mix. Did you wash the engine off? Getting something electrical (wires?) wet will cause your issues. Hopefully, that part will dry off and she will run right again. Had that happen once.

I would never recommend washing the engine or engine bay of any car - no matter how dirty/greasy it got.

Last edited by Captsolo; 07-15-2020 at 09:19 AM.
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Old 07-15-2020, 07:48 AM #32
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I would never recommend washing the engine or engine bay of any car - no matter how dirty/greasy it got.
What do you think happens when you drive in the rain or drive through puddles!? That’s an absolutely ridiculous statement.
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Old 07-15-2020, 08:24 AM #33
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I have a 2005 SR5 with 150,000 miles and she never ever failed to start and run properly. The only part that failed in 15 years on mine was the starters, and I replaced three of them with AM from Amazon. Dealer here in the Bahamas once told me they would order a new starter from Japan for over $900. I found an AM at Amazon for $100. I keep a "new" rebuilt spare in the garage and my mechanic can install it anywhere for $60.

Water and engines don't mix. Did you wash the engine off? Getting something electrical (wires?) wet will cause your issues. Hopefully, that part will dry off and she will run right again. Had that happen once.

I would never recommend washing the engine or engine bay of any car - no matter how dirty/greasy it got.
Did not wash the engine bay, just ran it through your run of the mill, gas station car wash. Plus, it's been several days now and pretty hot here. Any moisture that did get on anything would be gone now.

I've also driven this truck through 24+" deep water on my hunting land with zero issues.

The problem is elsewhere. I know it's not the MAF and a few other basic things. O2 sensors are next once I figure out what I'm going to do with the broken stud in the exhaust. If that doesn't fix it, I'm swapping injectors next.
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Old 07-15-2020, 08:42 AM #34
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Originally Posted by Captsolo View Post
Water and engines don't mix...................
Maybe not where you live, happens all the time in the snow belt.
During winter gas stations that have drive-thru carwashes offer free wash with fillup.
21 yrs of washing every fillup if roads had been salted/cindered along with 3-400k other drivers, do the math nation wide.
Sheitte happens not that often.
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Old 07-15-2020, 09:03 AM #35
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Did not wash the engine bay, just ran it through your run of the mill, gas station car wash. Plus, it's been several days now and pretty hot here. Any moisture that did get on anything would be gone now.

I've also driven this truck through 24+" deep water on my hunting land with zero issues.

The problem is elsewhere. I know it's not the MAF and a few other basic things. O2 sensors are next once I figure out what I'm going to do with the broken stud in the exhaust. If that doesn't fix it, I'm swapping injectors next.
If it were me I'd call in a GREAT auto mechanic (and stop throwing parts at it). A good mechanic that works on cars every day can troubleshoot and fix any engine IMO. I am not an any kind of (good mechanic) mechanic, myself.

It could be a simple as a dirty fuel injector. Faulty coil? Really good "street mechanics" are out there, you just have to be lucky enough to find one that will come to the house.

Some people will run a hose over the engine to clean off the dirt/dust, and that is a no-no, big mistake IMO.

Just wondered if you ran water directly on engine (to clean).. Been there done that... My sorrow!

BTW. Owned a 1995 GMC Jimmy from new. A 2005 4runner from new. Still runs like new. Had a 1996 Caddi Northstar. The GM V8 engine is tough, but car itself is junk compared to Toyota or Hondas IMO.

Also had three F225 Yamahas on the back of a 42 foot Performance (50 MPH at 5000 rpms - all day long!) that I ran across the oceans here (usually alone) for 12 years until I finally blew a PH.

Still say a really good mechanic can get it running right.

Last edited by Captsolo; 07-15-2020 at 09:51 AM.
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Old 07-15-2020, 09:20 AM #36
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If it were me I'd call in a GREAT auto mechanic (and stop throwing parts at it). A good mechanic that works on cars every day can troubleshoot and fix any engine IMO. I am not an any kind of (good mechanic) mechanic, myself.

It could be a simple as a dirty fuel injector. Faulty coil? Really good "street mechanics" are out there, you just have to be lucky enough to find one that will come to the house.
I have spares of basically every part on these trucks minus the o2 sensors which is why I'm replacing them (mine are most likely original, so 220k+ miles).

I already swapped the MAF with the spare I had, no change. I have injectors to swap next if the o2 sensors don't fix it.

So far I've managed to complete this work on 3rd gen 4Rs:

Pull two engines, install one
Pull two transmissions, install one
Two timing belt jobs
replaced starter
rebuild alternator
LBJ's, sway bar links,sway bar bushings, front/rear suspension (twice)
replaced every fluid
steering rack guide replaced
Bled brakes
countless transmission fluid changes
replaced tranny solenoids
fixed broken wires throughout the truck
fixed rear window defrost
fixed the AC system
replaced the exhaust twice
swapped the entire engine harness

And probably another dozen or so things

I have zero intent on taking this to a mechanic.

So far I've spent $100 on replacing things that may solve my problem and if they don't, they needed to replaced anyway. I've also spent maybe 1.5 hours working on this.

Thanks
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Last edited by thegipper; 07-15-2020 at 09:23 AM.
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Old 07-15-2020, 11:00 AM #37
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If it were me I'd call in a GREAT auto mechanic .
I'll pay myself what that GREAT mechanic is going to charge me, the process is the same. Paying someone else robs you of two things, your money and the knowledge.
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Old 07-15-2020, 11:38 AM #38
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The only time my truck has been to a shop is for new tires and an alignment.

Probably won't have time to mess with it until Friday after work, I'll report back then.
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Old 07-15-2020, 11:52 AM #39
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never experienced it. but Looks like this is very interesting. following
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Old 07-15-2020, 12:01 PM #40
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I had to remove the down pipe to get the O2 sensor off. Once the downpipe was off, removing the O2 sensor was easy. Unfortunately, one of the studs broke off on the down pipe flange. Not sure how I'm going to fix that, it's the one closest to the engine.

Also, I found this. There was a crack near the O2 sensor flange. The metal is super thin and rusty so I busted out the welder I just got (I'm not a welder BTW). I did my best to plug it up and I was successful. I basically had to make blobs of weld and slowly connect them to keep it from blowing through (machine was turned all the way down). It's ugly but solid.

Tomorrow I'm going to get the downstream sensor off. I'll need to figure out what I'm going to do with the broken stud on the exhaust flange.

If the O2 sensors don't fix the issue, I'm going to swap the injectors next.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
That crack was most likely the problem! Here's the rationale as of why. That crack in the pipe is allowing unmetered fresh air to contact the oxygen sensor under some circumstances like idling. The oxygen sensor picks up that unmetered air and sensor a high amount of oxygen in the 'exhaust'. That tells the sensor that the engine is not burning off all the air and is running lean, even though it is not. The ECU adds fuel like you are seeing but under some circumstances that crack isn't pulling in much air, like when the engine is under load and exhaust is coming out of the crack instead of fresh air being pulled in. It then throws a rich code since oxygen sensor is out of normal range on the rich end.

If you pull the EFI fuse after that O2 flange weld and drive it around, I'm very confident that the fuel trims will be back to normal.
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Old 07-15-2020, 12:49 PM #41
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That crack was most likely the problem! Here's the rationale as of why. That crack in the pipe is allowing unmetered fresh air to contact the oxygen sensor under some circumstances like idling. The oxygen sensor picks up that unmetered air and sensor a high amount of oxygen in the 'exhaust'. That tells the sensor that the engine is not burning off all the air and is running lean, even though it is not. The ECU adds fuel like you are seeing but under some circumstances that crack isn't pulling in much air, like when the engine is under load and exhaust is coming out of the crack instead of fresh air being pulled in. It then throws a rich code since oxygen sensor is out of normal range on the rich end.

If you pull the EFI fuse after that O2 flange weld and drive it around, I'm very confident that the fuel trims will be back to normal.
I was wondering if it had something to do with it. By the looks of the rust around it, it's seems to be somewhat old or at least, it didn't just "all of a sudden crack" if that makes since. It may have opened up more or....or.....when I went through the car wash the water hitting the hot pipe caused it open up a bunch more??? Who knows, hard to say.

I used a flashlight down the pipe to confirm my weld sealed it up and it did.

New o2 sensors are going in on Friday as long as I can figure out how the hell i'm going to fix that stud that broke.
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Old 07-15-2020, 12:52 PM #42
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Here is the stud that broke.

And here is what was left of the nut on the O2 sensor.
The other one was completely rusted off.



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Old 07-15-2020, 06:52 PM #43
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That crack was most likely the problem! Here's the rationale as of why.
If you pull the EFI fuse after that O2 flange weld and drive it around, I'm very confident that the fuel trims will be back to normal.
@thegipper ,
On cold start puddles of condensate formed under Cat to Muff Muff to tail joints. Let it go till a Cat code set, replaced gaskets good to go. So I can see that split at sensor playing hell with fuel trims.
Mechanic god's shined down on you getting stud out that easy, sweet.
What length bit you use ?
Something to add to toolbox, extra length jobber bits 6-10", new not cheap the time it saves your bacon worth cost.
3-4 lefthand bits good for backing broke stuff out of blind hole.

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Old 07-16-2020, 10:59 AM #44
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@thegipper ,
On cold start puddles of condensate formed under Cat to Muff Muff to tail joints. Let it go till a Cat code set, replaced gaskets good to go. So I can see that split at sensor playing hell with fuel trims.
Mechanic god's shined down on you getting stud out that easy, sweet.
What length bit you use ?
Something to add to toolbox, extra length jobber bits 6-10", new not cheap the time it saves your bacon worth cost.
3-4 lefthand bits good for backing broke stuff out of blind hole.
I haven't got the broken stud out yet, going to nuke the hell around it tomorrow after work and trying using a stud extractor.

Wish me luck.
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Old 07-16-2020, 11:41 AM #45
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I haven't got the broken stud out yet, going to nuke the hell around it tomorrow after work and trying using a stud extractor.

Wish me luck.
Oh damn, one day I'll be able read,,,, Good Luck.
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