[19963.4lsr5]

Has this ever been done before?

Since the 5vzfe is wasted spark it seems like a coil on plug from a mopar or ford would work for the sparkplug that's not under the coil pack. Just splice into the 12v connector that fires the OEM coil pack or a coil on plug on both plugs and tapping off the 12v connector and feed both coils. They would fire together with the factory setup anyway.

I guess that will depend on if they fit in the spark plug tube.

[JohnsD90]

Why?

[19963.4lsr5]

For me I have spare COP's and would try and use them if one of the coils went bad on the 3.4

Just thinking.............

I do have a spare Toyota coil I picked up at the junkyard though. Just like COP. Its simple and very forgiving.

[Jake.Werecat]

My same thought exactly!
Why? Because I dislike wasted spark design with 3 coil packs. But mainly because I can.
Converting to true COP is difficult, as there are only 3 ignition timing signals going from the ECU. It would be necessary to split those 3 signals to 6 signals firing twice less often, the split decision would have to be made using some 3rd party circuit fed with the signal from camshaft sensor.
BUT
Converting to wasted COP - i.e. 6 single COPs but still fired simultaneously in pairs should be fairly easy. There are two possible ways of doing that.
Using 6 2-pin COPs and connecting the pairs in parallel to the OEM ignition module OR
ditching the ignition module, ale using 6 4-pin COPs from Lexus, which give the IGF return signal back to the ECU.
It's only theory for now, but I'm eager to try that in practice really soon. I'm swapping my 3.slow to 5VZ-FE, so I'll have a new engine to play with

[brillo_76]

Oh. I am I liking this thread. Great thought. I am sure circuitry could be made to make it a non wasted as it just timing. So if this time can be determined. You could use capacitor to fire the 2nd coil at the proper time.

All you need is a passenger valve cover to bolt coils to it. Then the plugs to split the coil fire signal and the correct capacitor to delay the signal time.

Or circuitry to send the signal one pulse to this coil then the next signal to the other. As 2 options I am thinking to eliminate the wasted spark system on the v6.

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[rdruss]

Huh?

[brillo_76]

Originally Posted by rdruss

Huh?

The OP is talking about making the v6 engines have a coil on top of each cylinder and replace the wasted spark system. I kinda like the theory as it would make the spark plugs last a lot longer.

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[19963.4lsr5]

Holy dug up from the past.

I’ve seen it done to some Hondas, but I never pursued it.

My only concern is the drivers/transistors in the ICM not being able to handle the extra current. It’s load would be doubled.

I also thought of mounting 3 MSD6 boxes and using the coil signal it trigger the MSD boxes and fire msd’s wasted spark coils.

Another thing holding me back is not having a spare engine harness.


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[brillo_76]

Originally Posted by 19963.4lsr5

Holy dug up from the past.

I’ve seen it done to some Hondas, but I never pursued it.

My only concern is the drivers/transistors in the ICM not being able to handle the extra current. It’s load would be doubled.

I also thought of mounting 3 MSD6 boxes and using the coil signal it trigger the MSD boxes and fire msd’s wasted spark coils.

Another thing holding me back is not having a spare engine harness.


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What year harness you Need? I have a auto 1997 here I chopped transmission connector etc off of. ;) I can give you for the cause. I saw this was an old one 2013

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[JohnMc]

I've converted a Volvo motor to coil-on-plug before - it was a 16V redblock with deep well plugs (like the 4Runner) and I used some Toyota Corolla coil-on-plugs which had nice logic level triggers (along with being self powered, no need for an ignition module). But that was with a full standalone ECU (MS3X).

I'm not sure the juice (what juice) here is worth the squeeze. Since the factory ECU only fires three ignition channels, you're going to be wasted spark with twice as many coild. And a circuit which can accurately trigger the correct coils back and forth based on the ECU's single signal for both won't be simple. Certainly doable, but I'd generally think you're going to end up with something that is less reliable and, at best, runs exactly like an unmodified engine.

[brillo_76]

Originally Posted by JohnMc

I've converted a Volvo motor to coil-on-plug before - it was a 16V redblock with deep well plugs (like the 4Runner) and I used some Toyota Corolla coil-on-plugs which had nice logic level triggers (along with being self powered, no need for an ignition module). But that was with a full standalone ECU (MS3X).

I'm not sure the juice (what juice) here is worth the squeeze. Since the factory ECU only fires three ignition channels, you're going to be wasted spark with twice as many coild. And a circuit which can accurately trigger the correct coils back and forth based on the ECU's single signal for both won't be simple. Certainly doable, but I'd generally think you're going to end up with something that is less reliable and, at best, runs exactly like an unmodified engine.

I just like the concept of it. If it's just a fire signal. All we have to do is route the signal every other time to each cylinder. Being it's only the same coil firing. The coil load is identical. It's just a every other pulse switch the the other coil.

It's not that complex of a logic circuit. Relays can react fast enough so it has to be done via logic circuit

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[19963.4lsr5]

I was happy firing both plugs at the same time.

It eliminates plug wires going bad and the spark gap is only .045” instead of .090”. Which would be an improvement for the supercharger crew.

A single coil on plug will fire a huge gap without a missfire.


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[brillo_76]

Originally Posted by 19963.4lsr5

I was happy firing both plugs at the same time.

It eliminates plug wires going bad and the spark gap is only .045” instead of .090”. Which would be an improvement for the supercharger crew.

A single coil on plug will fire a huge gap without a missfire.


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You can do that as well. If all it is coming to the coil is a firing signal just paralleling the wiring to the second coil is all that should be required and basically just a homemade harness that plugs into the coil signal wires that have a set of plugs for the passenger with wiring and plugs for the 2nd coil.

Plus you need a way to hold the coils in place with a different valve cover or homemade brackets because that's the side with the oil filling plug as well.

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[WeakSauz]

Very common upgrade on other Toyota platforms such as the 1UZFE, which runs wasted spark from the factory.

The Audi R8 sports car COPS snap right into that engine, for example.


Now, the hard part is that converting to COP sometimes required a standalone engine management system.