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Old 05-26-2021, 04:40 PM #31
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I’d replace the rad and the fan clutch and see what that gets you if there original yet.


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Old 05-26-2021, 04:42 PM #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DenverAirport View Post
Understood. Is there any way to verify the pump is pumping without taking off the cover / timing belt? Also curious about diagnosing coolant sensor -- I'm assuming I can pull it out and test it in water but are there any better ways of doing so?
Yes. When the engine is completely cold, remove the radiator cap. Start up the engine (might be a little bit of a mess if it's filled high). Rev the engine for a little bit, periodically checking the top of the coolant. If the water pump is working, as the thermostat opens you'll start to see coolant flow slowly across the top of radiator from left to right. If the water pump and/or thermostat is not working, it will just look stagnant with no flow.
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Old 05-26-2021, 05:47 PM #33
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As the water heats up and expands it will push out the top if the level is touching the bottom of the cap. Which it should be if your cap is good and your overflow tank and hose are in good shape.


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Old 05-26-2021, 08:56 PM #34
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Prepping for a long trip with high coolant temps.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DenverAirport View Post
Understood. Is there any way to verify the pump is pumping without taking off the cover / timing belt? Also curious about diagnosing coolant sensor -- I'm assuming I can pull it out and test it in water but are there any better ways of doing so?

After the thermostat has opened you can visually see flow in the radiator. Impellers and shafts can break. That sort of situation is more common in semi‘s, but I have had it happen on a Chevy 350 before.

As far as getting your sensor baseline it’s fairly straightforward, you’ll obviously want to test the coolant temperature at a cold state using whatever you choose for a thermometer or a temperature probe you can use with a DVOM. Even a cooking thermometer can work. Compare yours pro breeding with your scan tool reading. You can even use the ambient air temperature as a baseline if the vehicles been sitting for a while and not in the direct sunlight.

Temperature can be done a couple of different ways. You can get geeky and actually measure the resistance at a specified temperature with a sensor directly. The simplest way it’s going to be to depressurize the cooling system with it hot and then use your probe to verify. The flip Radiator cap so nice for this, you can obviously unscrew the radiator with a rag/towel and a good amount of caution. The cooler is obviously going to be hot, and depending on your coolant mixture and what you have going on depressurizing the radiator can/will change the boiling point.

Lots of ways to skin the cat, just depends on how you want to do it.

Don’t assume anything and do a good job of diagnostics.

Since you’ve had a recent head gasket and cylinder repair, that does bring a few things into the equation. Make sure there is no excessive pressure in the radiator, or any kind of gas coming to the cooling system out of the top of the radiator once it’s full. If you’re getting a white smoke, that is coolant being burned.

You also mentioned that your gauge doesn’t move. Sensor measures resistance and reports to ECM, that information gets pushed to the display.

The thing is is without verifying the data and the flow m. We just don’t know what’s going on, the shop could have had a rag stuffed in there somewhere for all you know. That said, I wouldn’t put 215 in the danger zone. Elevated, but not danger zone assuming you have a radiator and cooling system that can hold pressure and good coolant in it.
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Old 05-26-2021, 09:06 PM #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DenverAirport View Post
Yep. Recently replaced it with a new OEM and it's in the 6 o'clock position. From what I've read the jiggle valve is actually supposed to be in the 6 not 12 (many complain that 12, common procedure in other vehicles, leads to higher engine temps in this truck and some other Toyotas)

All that jiggle valve does is help to release the air initially. Once the system is purged it really doesn’t do a whole lot. We used to drill tiny holes into the thermostats to help bleed the system is easier back in the day.

It has no function other than to assist in burping air out quicker. I’m not a 5vz expert by any means, but I would really have to question that one hard. Once that thermostat opens and assuming the pump is working, air cannot exist at that point in the system as it is one of the lowest points in the system.
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Old 05-26-2021, 09:14 PM #36
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I purchased via Partsouq. Was stamped -- everything I've gotten from them has been in stamped OE boxes and seemingly good parts, the exact size of the OE parts I'm pulling out of the vehicle for some pieces. Might be worth pulling it out and testing it though.
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Old 05-26-2021, 09:18 PM #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Romeo1 View Post
After the thermostat has opened you can visually see flow in the radiator. Impellers and shafts can break. That sort of situation is more common in semi‘s, but I have had it happen on a Chevy 350 before.

As far as getting your sensor baseline it’s fairly straightforward, you’ll obviously want to test the coolant temperature at a cold state using whatever you choose for a thermometer or a temperature probe you can use with a DVOM. Even a cooking thermometer can work. Compare yours pro breeding with your scan tool reading. You can even use the ambient air temperature as a baseline if the vehicles been sitting for a while and not in the direct sunlight.

Temperature can be done a couple of different ways. You can get geeky and actually measure the resistance at a specified temperature with a sensor directly. The simplest way it’s going to be to depressurize the cooling system with it hot and then use your probe to verify. The flip Radiator cap so nice for this, you can obviously unscrew the radiator with a rag/towel and a good amount of caution. The cooler is obviously going to be hot, and depending on your coolant mixture and what you have going on depressurizing the radiator can/will change the boiling point.

Lots of ways to skin the cat, just depends on how you want to do it.

Don’t assume anything and do a good job of diagnostics.

Since you’ve had a recent head gasket and cylinder repair, that does bring a few things into the equation. Make sure there is no excessive pressure in the radiator, or any kind of gas coming to the cooling system out of the top of the radiator once it’s full. If you’re getting a white smoke, that is coolant being burned.

You also mentioned that your gauge doesn’t move. Sensor measures resistance and reports to ECM, that information gets pushed to the display.

The thing is is without verifying the data and the flow m. We just don’t know what’s going on, the shop could have had a rag stuffed in there somewhere for all you know. That said, I wouldn’t put 215 in the danger zone. Elevated, but not danger zone assuming you have a radiator and cooling system that can hold pressure and good coolant in it.
Thanks for the insight with all of this. I'm going to test temp across the board tomorrow and see where I'm at. I'm definitely not getting white smoke or smelling coolant.
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Old 05-27-2021, 10:59 AM #38
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I've had bad OE thermostats a couple of times.
Not Toyota but Toyota doesn't make thermostats anyways.
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Old 05-27-2021, 11:55 AM #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Romeo1 View Post
All that jiggle valve does is help to release the air initially. Once the system is purged it really doesn’t do a whole lot. We used to drill tiny holes into the thermostats to help bleed the system is easier back in the day.

It has no function other than to assist in burping air out quicker. I’m not a 5vz expert by any means, but I would really have to question that one hard. Once that thermostat opens and assuming the pump is working, air cannot exist at that point in the system as it is one of the lowest points in the system.
You're not the first to question the jiggle valve affecting operating temps, but multiple people (including myself) have seen coolant temps drop with the same thermostat just by putting the jiggle valve at 6 instead of 12. I dropped 10 degrees according to my UltraGauge. I don't know why it makes a difference but it does.

EDIT: Also, the jiggle valve allows for a small amount of coolant to flow through the thermostat so that coolant can still flow through the engine and allows the hot coolant to reach the thermostat and open the thermostat. Without the slow coolant flow from the jiggle valve opening you would be depending on heat transfer to warm up the coolant by the thermostat enough for the thermostat to open which would likely mean that the coolant in some spots of the engine would be way too hot by the time that happened.
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Old 05-27-2021, 12:11 PM #40
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It's even listed in the FSM. Install with jiggle valve downward (6 o'clock).

Yes I know it doesn't make sense on the 5vz. Would be good for engineer in fluid dynamics explain this one.
Lots of members see solid before and after results of moving the valve downward.
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Old 05-27-2021, 05:00 PM #41
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EDIT: Also, the jiggle valve allows for a small amount of coolant to flow through the thermostat so that coolant can still flow through the engine and allows the hot coolant to reach the thermostat and open the thermostat. Without the slow coolant flow from the jiggle valve opening you would be depending on heat transfer to warm up the coolant by the thermostat enough for the thermostat to open which would likely mean that the coolant in some spots of the engine would be way too hot by the time that happened.
No, there is a bypass hose that always pumps water past the 'active' size of the thermostat.

The jiggle valve is traditionally for bubbles, as has been stated. There is something about the 5VZ design where the orientation of the thermostat matters that is different than most engines... I have not seen a good explanation, but I have seen lots of engines that run a bit too hot fixed by rotating the thermostat though.

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Old 05-27-2021, 05:08 PM #42
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No, there is a bypass hose that always pumps water past the 'active' size of the thermostat.

The jiggle valve is traditionally for bubbles, as has been stated. There is something about the 5VZ design where the orientation of the thermostat matters that is different than most engines... I have not seen a good explanation, but I have seen lots of engines that run a bit too hot fixed by rotating the thermostat though.

-Charlie
There is a bypass hose, but without the flow through the jiggle valve it would be difficult for hot coolant to reach the thermostat and open it.
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Old 05-28-2021, 03:16 PM #43
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My 99 is literally hot within two minutes of running up to the point where the thermostat opens, especially this time of year.

My Cummins on the other hand sometimes can take a half hour to open depending on how cold it is that day.

Time to open the thermostat 5VZ is kinda relative.

I love getting lost in the weeds in these things, but the point of this entire discussion is that they need to get diagnosed out completely to rule out what is and isn’t going on.
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