User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 05-29-2021, 10:29 PM #1
Down by the Water Down by the Water is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Florida, USA
Posts: 50
Real Name: Andre
Down by the Water is on a distinguished road
Down by the Water Down by the Water is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Florida, USA
Posts: 50
Real Name: Andre
Down by the Water is on a distinguished road
Inner tie rod or bad steering rack??

Taking an informal poll. Do we think this is a bad inner tie rod or bad steering rack?

My first thought was tie rod, but when I pushed the boot back some fluid came out. Pretty sure that's not normal. Outer tie rod end seems solid. There's no fluid leaking from the rack, just what came out when I unclipped the boot.

No other symptoms, though steering might be a tiny bit harder. Hard to say.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZSr...ature=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZhn...&feature=youtu.
__________________
1996 T4R, no mods, 4x4 w/factory rear locker
Down by the Water is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-30-2021, 10:39 AM #2
sleepydad's Avatar
sleepydad sleepydad is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1,249
Real Name: Andy ಠ_ಠ
sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold
sleepydad sleepydad is offline
Senior Member
sleepydad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1,249
Real Name: Andy ಠ_ಠ
sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold
Quote:
Originally Posted by Down by the Water View Post
Taking an informal poll. Do we think this is a bad inner tie rod or bad steering rack?

My first thought was tie rod, but when I pushed the boot back some fluid came out. Pretty sure that's not normal. Outer tie rod end seems solid. There's no fluid leaking from the rack, just what came out when I unclipped the boot.

No other symptoms, though steering might be a tiny bit harder. Hard to say.

bad rack or bad inner tie rod end? 00 - YouTube

bad rack or bad inner tie rod end? 01 - YouTube.
I think each time I have taken a factory boot off there is some type of grease they use during assembly that oozes out.

if you look at the FSM in the REASSEMBLY section for the rack they talk about

COAT PARTS INDICATED BY ARROWS WITH POWER STEERING FLUID OR MOLYBDENUM DISULFIDE LITHIUM BASE GREASE

so I would not be surprised if there was grease used during reassembly.

if I'm able to get the gist from your vid? if there is a clunky play? I can't believe that truck does not show death wobble at high speed?

you need to find what is bad, it could be upper or lower ball joints or bushings? I honestly don't think it's in the rack at all.

if your tie rod(s) or rac is bad in my experience your steering will have play and a "clunk clunk" back and forth. you will not be able to keep it going straight down the road without constantly adjusting the steering wheel. ++ it will start to leak like the exxon valdez as well.
sleepydad is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-30-2021, 11:26 AM #3
texadelphia texadelphia is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Oregon
Posts: 326
texadelphia will become famous soon enough
texadelphia texadelphia is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Oregon
Posts: 326
texadelphia will become famous soon enough
Does the color of the fluid match what's in the power steering reservoir? My guess is that your rack is just starting to leak. The grease on the inner tie rod isn't thin like that. Could just be residual from a previous assembly. If you compress the boot more does any drip out?

Hard to tell from the motion if anything is wrong. If both tires are off the ground your rack will move a bit when you push and pull on it. If it was a distinct clunking feeling I would suspect inner tie rod.

Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk
__________________
1997 SR5, 3.4L, Manual

Last edited by texadelphia; 05-30-2021 at 11:32 AM.
texadelphia is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-30-2021, 02:17 PM #4
Devbot's Avatar
Devbot Devbot is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Monroe, WA
Posts: 1,028
Real Name: Devan
Devbot is a jewel in the rough Devbot is a jewel in the rough Devbot is a jewel in the rough Devbot is a jewel in the rough
Devbot Devbot is offline
Senior Member
Devbot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Monroe, WA
Posts: 1,028
Real Name: Devan
Devbot is a jewel in the rough Devbot is a jewel in the rough Devbot is a jewel in the rough Devbot is a jewel in the rough
As said there is a TINY amount of play normally, you should really be listening for a clunk or feeling for anything excessive. A slightly shimmy/wobble at highway speeds is another good indication.
Another way to check if an inner tie rod is bad, what you can do is disconnect the outer ends and simply lift them up, and if the inners are good they should stay up. If one slowly falls back down if pretty well worn, and if it flops back down with no resistance then it's time to change it. At the same time you shouldn't have to force them upwards, they should be a little stiff but otherwise move smoothly.
Regardless I would just swap out your inners before getting a new rack altogether. Watch Timmy's video as the inners are VERY hard to get a normal wrench on, and they put a link to one that works best for the job. The situation is better explained in the video but it's definitely something you want to be prepared for if you decide to tackle the job as a regular spanner won't do.
__________________
Y2K Highlander Millennium Silver 3.4L auto @ 295k and climbing
Tundra TRD Lift in Front / LC Lift in Rear / JBA UCAs / CVJ 9168R Axles / Diff Drop / PCK / Extended Bump Stops; Brake Lines; Sway Bar Links; Rear Diff Breather / True North Fab. Hybrid Bumper / Smittybilt XRC Gen 3 Comp. / Northstar 880CCA AGM / Drivelines NW Rear Shaft / Lil Skip Gas Skid / BudBuilt Front Skid
Devbot is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-30-2021, 02:30 PM #5
Down by the Water Down by the Water is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Florida, USA
Posts: 50
Real Name: Andre
Down by the Water is on a distinguished road
Down by the Water Down by the Water is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Florida, USA
Posts: 50
Real Name: Andre
Down by the Water is on a distinguished road
Does the color of the fluid match what's in the power steering reservoir?

Yes


If you compress the boot more does any drip out?

No

And, there are no active leaks that I can see. I cleaned it up pretty good yesterday. Drove it today to the beach and no leaks.

I do not have any problems steering or hear any clunking sounds. It just feels a little loose to me, not dangerously so. The ball joints (upper and lower) and outer control arms are good, wheel bearings are good. The steering stabilizer end links are end of life but hanging in there. Stabilizer bar bushings in surprisingly good condition. Rack in there solid.

Suffice to say, there's a lot of deferred maintenance with this vehicle. Trying to set a game plan.
__________________
1996 T4R, no mods, 4x4 w/factory rear locker
Down by the Water is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-30-2021, 02:39 PM #6
HiLife HiLife is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Trying to figure this out
Posts: 1,209
HiLife is a jewel in the rough HiLife is a jewel in the rough HiLife is a jewel in the rough
HiLife HiLife is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Trying to figure this out
Posts: 1,209
HiLife is a jewel in the rough HiLife is a jewel in the rough HiLife is a jewel in the rough
It hard to see in your vid to see what's staying still and what's moving, cause the cam is slightly moving around too.
Does the driverside tire move too in oposite reation to the push and pull of the passengerside?
Is the rack housing itself staying still when pushing and pulling on the tire?

The drop method is a good way in gauging integrity of the inner tierod joint.
I wouldnt consider replacing the rack if there is no major leaks going on unless you got money to spare. Slight oozing is fine, unless it's so bad that there are spots left on the ground where the 4r was parked over night.

3 places that would allow movement in that area is the inner tierod, rack bushings and the rack guide bushing itself. Check also on those till you find your issue.
HiLife is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-31-2021, 02:53 PM #7
Bad Luck Bad Luck is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Hot Springs, AR
Posts: 1,876
Real Name: Patrick
Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold
Bad Luck Bad Luck is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Hot Springs, AR
Posts: 1,876
Real Name: Patrick
Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold
Quote:
Originally Posted by Down by the Water View Post
Does the color of the fluid match what's in the power steering reservoir?

Yes
One or both of the seals in the rack by the inner tie rod is leaking power steering fluid. While you can rebuild them it's a lot of work and time to do it properly. I would recommend replacing your steering rack with an OEM one. An OEM steering rack will come with new inner tie rod ends, but not the lock nuts.
__________________
2000 Limited V6 Auto E-Locker
Bad Luck is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-01-2021, 01:40 PM #8
fourfive's Avatar
fourfive fourfive is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Marietta, Georgia
Posts: 1,410
fourfive has a spectacular aura about fourfive has a spectacular aura about
fourfive fourfive is offline
Senior Member
fourfive's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Marietta, Georgia
Posts: 1,410
fourfive has a spectacular aura about fourfive has a spectacular aura about
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepydad View Post
I think each time I have taken a factory boot off there is some type of grease they use during assembly that oozes out.

if you look at the FSM in the REASSEMBLY section for the rack they talk about

COAT PARTS INDICATED BY ARROWS WITH POWER STEERING FLUID OR MOLYBDENUM DISULFIDE LITHIUM BASE GREASE

so I would not be surprised if there was grease used during reassembly.
This is good to know. When I replaced my itre years ago I noticed a dark moly type grease in the itre boot. Didn't know if this was normal or not because my only other point of reference was when I changed the itre on my friends 3rd gen that didn't have any grease or fluid in the boot.


Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepydad View Post
if your tie rod(s) or rac is bad in my experience your steering will have play and a "clunk clunk" back and forth. you will not be able to keep it going straight down the road without constantly adjusting the steering wheel. ++ it will start to leak like the exxon valdez as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bad Luck View Post
One or both of the seals in the rack by the inner tie rod is leaking power steering fluid. While you can rebuild them it's a lot of work and time to do it properly. I would recommend replacing your steering rack with an OEM one. An OEM steering rack will come with new inner tie rod ends, but not the lock nuts.
Is a leak the only real indicator that the steering rack is bad?
__________________
•Black 2002 SR5 4x4 5vz
Suspension: Front: Toytec Ultimate coilovers/eibach 600#, SPC UCA, durobumps Rear: Bil5100/Superflex, SS adjustable panhard, PCK, durobumps Body Lift: 2" 4crawler Tires: 315/75/16 General Grabber AT2 Wheels: SCS F5 Matte black 16x8 3.5bs Armor: Custom bolt on rock sliders (no frame drilling)
•Black 2018 TRD Pro (wife’s)
Armor: Custom bolt on rock sliders (U-bolts)
fourfive is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-01-2021, 01:54 PM #9
3bears 3bears is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: north east Fairbanks Alaska
Posts: 2,649
Real Name: 3 Bears
3bears is a glorious beacon of light 3bears is a glorious beacon of light 3bears is a glorious beacon of light 3bears is a glorious beacon of light 3bears is a glorious beacon of light
3bears 3bears is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: north east Fairbanks Alaska
Posts: 2,649
Real Name: 3 Bears
3bears is a glorious beacon of light 3bears is a glorious beacon of light 3bears is a glorious beacon of light 3bears is a glorious beacon of light 3bears is a glorious beacon of light
for me, it was hard to tell in video but my first thought was an outter tie rod end. the second video did make it look like it could be the inner.
however you will get some movement and I ask if someone was watching or holding the steering wheel at the time.

I currently need the inner on the pass side. Mine is real obvious, but I can get some very slight movement out of the driver side, but when I do I see the steering wheel move ever so slightly....so im only doing the pass side right now.
I also have a very slight leak. When time comes ( more leaking) I will do an entire rack.....if I still own it. ( looking for a 99 or 2000 )
__________________
2000 SR-5 Highlander. 4:30's, factory locker green
2001 SR-5...sold june 2021
2000 SR-5 V6 Auto . lifted, e locker, other cool stuff, totaled 10/20
3bears is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-01-2021, 03:02 PM #10
Bad Luck Bad Luck is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Hot Springs, AR
Posts: 1,876
Real Name: Patrick
Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold
Bad Luck Bad Luck is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Hot Springs, AR
Posts: 1,876
Real Name: Patrick
Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold
Quote:
Originally Posted by fourfive View Post
Is a leak the only real indicator that the steering rack is bad?
There's a lot of symptoms for a bad steering rack, but the steering fluid in the boot is the easiest one to spot. You can also have play internal to the steering rack which is difficult to tell without the inner tie rod boots being off to determine if it's the inner tie rod or the gears in the rack. You can also have a lack of power steering but the power steering pump is operating correctly. That one is much more rare. I had one steering rack that I replaced at work that had power steering assist turning left but wouldn't assist turning right. The bypass/flow valve was messed up. Also extremely rare.
__________________
2000 Limited V6 Auto E-Locker
Bad Luck is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-01-2021, 04:27 PM #11
sleepydad's Avatar
sleepydad sleepydad is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1,249
Real Name: Andy ಠ_ಠ
sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold
sleepydad sleepydad is offline
Senior Member
sleepydad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1,249
Real Name: Andy ಠ_ಠ
sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold sleepydad is a splendid one to behold
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bad Luck View Post
There's a lot of symptoms for a bad steering rack, but the steering fluid in the boot is the easiest one to spot. You can also have play internal to the steering rack which is difficult to tell without the inner tie rod boots being off to determine if it's the inner tie rod or the gears in the rack. You can also have a lack of power steering but the power steering pump is operating correctly. That one is much more rare. I had one steering rack that I replaced at work that had power steering assist turning left but wouldn't assist turning right. The bypass/flow valve was messed up. Also extremely rare.
I'm going to add a little here

#1 the rack is leaking - seals are worn out so... it's generally cheaper to just replace the rack with a rebuild because re-building them is time consuming.

#2 the rack or pump is physically worn out or damaged.

#3 one of the connecting tie rods inner/outer joints is worn/damaged and needs to be replaced.

it turns out any of these things people just say "rack is bad, replace it" the reality that labor today is just expensive and it's easier to just replace, send old to rebuild.
sleepydad is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-02-2021, 10:11 AM #12
Bad Luck Bad Luck is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Hot Springs, AR
Posts: 1,876
Real Name: Patrick
Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold
Bad Luck Bad Luck is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Hot Springs, AR
Posts: 1,876
Real Name: Patrick
Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold Bad Luck is a splendid one to behold
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepydad View Post
I'm going to add a little here

#1 the rack is leaking - seals are worn out so... it's generally cheaper to just replace the rack with a rebuild because re-building them is time consuming.

#2 the rack or pump is physically worn out or damaged.

#3 one of the connecting tie rods inner/outer joints is worn/damaged and needs to be replaced.

it turns out any of these things people just say "rack is bad, replace it" the reality that labor today is just expensive and it's easier to just replace, send old to rebuild.
Good added info. That's very true about replacing being cheaper than rebuilding due to labor costs. The only time I've replaced inner tie rods were recalls on camaros and caprice cop cars. I'm also a firm believer in replacing the steering rack with OEM. I've seen countless threads on here about people replacing with aftermarket only to have problems very quickly. OEM made it to the mileage you're at now so it's proven quality.
__________________
2000 Limited V6 Auto E-Locker
Bad Luck is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-07-2021, 01:04 PM #13
Down by the Water Down by the Water is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Florida, USA
Posts: 50
Real Name: Andre
Down by the Water is on a distinguished road
Down by the Water Down by the Water is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Florida, USA
Posts: 50
Real Name: Andre
Down by the Water is on a distinguished road
New video, the answer is "yes"

Answer to the question is, yes. The inner tie-rod is bad, the rack is going bad. For now, I have no real symptoms other than the truck wanders a slight bit and some uneven wear on my passenger side front tire.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mAnzZgpsED4&feature=youtu.be
__________________
1996 T4R, no mods, 4x4 w/factory rear locker
Down by the Water is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-07-2021, 01:26 PM #14
texadelphia texadelphia is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Oregon
Posts: 326
texadelphia will become famous soon enough
texadelphia texadelphia is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Oregon
Posts: 326
texadelphia will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by Down by the Water View Post
Answer to the question is, yes. The inner tie-rod is bad, the rack is going bad. For now, I have no real symptoms other than the truck wanders a slight bit and some uneven wear on my passenger side front tire.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mAnzZgpsED4&feature=youtu.be
Looks like you got it figured out. If you get a new rack it comes with new inner tie rods so factor that into your calculus when deciding if you're just going to do the tie rod knowing that a new rack is inevitable.
__________________
1997 SR5, 3.4L, Manual
texadelphia is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-08-2021, 11:32 AM #15
Down by the Water Down by the Water is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Florida, USA
Posts: 50
Real Name: Andre
Down by the Water is on a distinguished road
Down by the Water Down by the Water is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Florida, USA
Posts: 50
Real Name: Andre
Down by the Water is on a distinguished road
OEM, rebuilt, new?

Anyone have any thoughts on getting a new or rebuilt rack? Good brands? I understand and agree that an original Toyota rack would be optimal. Unfortunately, it is out of the question, just way to expensive.

I'm also seeing some used racks for sale on ebay. Would love to keep it all Toyota parts. That seems like a fool's game though.

My 4Runner is my daily so I can't have it sit for a month while I have my rack rebuilt or I would do that.
Attached Images
Inner tie rod or bad steering rack??-steering-racks_01-jpg 
__________________
1996 T4R, no mods, 4x4 w/factory rear locker
Down by the Water is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Reply

Tags
bad , rack , rod , steering , tie

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Power Steering Pump or Steering Rack? *VIDEO* LexusFTW 3rd gen T4Rs 43 04-16-2021 10:51 AM
Excessive play on drivers side steering - replace steering rack guide cheeser 3rd gen T4Rs 16 11-06-2019 05:27 PM
Power steering leak/steering rack SRQ-Runner 3rd gen T4Rs 1 10-25-2014 02:13 PM
Steering Rack and Power Steering Pump Replacement thebrandon 3rd gen T4Rs 5 07-02-2013 10:07 AM
Power steering/steering rack question (need help fast) alex bland 3rd gen T4Rs 9 01-09-2010 07:37 PM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.2

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:17 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
***This site is an unofficial Toyota site, and is not officially endorsed, supported, authorized by or affiliated with Toyota. All company, product, or service names references in this web site are used for identification purposes only and may be trademarks of their respective owners. The Toyota name, marks, designs and logos, as well as Toyota model names, are registered trademarks of Toyota Motor Corporation***Ad Management plugin by RedTyger
 
Copyright © 2020