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Old 06-18-2021, 08:24 AM #16
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Hey Tim,

Have you considered using an additive in your coolant like Royal Purple "Ice"? I've never used it but I have read that a few guys used it and it seemed to help lower coolant temps, some by as much as 10 degrees in scenarios like you were just in.

I don't think its "the" fix but it may be worth a try until you can re-gear or get a E fan setup.

Amazon.com: Royal Purple 01600 Purple Ice Super-Coolant Radiator Additive - 12 oz.: Automotive
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Old 06-18-2021, 08:38 AM #17
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Tim,
I don't live in AZ, so I can't speak directly from that experience. But I do live in NC where we see extremely humid 95-100 degree summers.

The probable and unfortunate answer is an expensive one- re-gearing. I went from 3.91 (15" wheel base SR5) to 4.88's.

My coolant temps with the old gears hung around 193-198 (which is normal!).
With the 4.88's, I'm rarely if ever over 188 degrees, even in the dead of summer while wheeling with low airflow.

I'm thinking that with your weight + 33" tires, your truck is simply working way too hard to stay at speed.
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Old 06-18-2021, 09:21 AM #18
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Originally Posted by mtbtim View Post
That might be the way to go. I’m going to check out his video.
@spartacus

I spent last last summer in the sand dunes. Nothing I have seen so far can cause temp spikes like the sand dunes. your working the rig hard all the time and ambient temps in the sand dunes... well have you ever burnt your feet walking on hot beach sand?

the champion Rad has an extra gallon of capacity over stock so that is a huge part of it's cooling bonus.

Don't cheap out on a namby pamby fan controller. I know there is a fine line between aero space level stuff and my truck but; no not really. my truck is aero space quality, I would drive it to the moon if possible no questions asked.

I feel a new sick mods vid in the works?
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Old 06-18-2021, 09:46 AM #19
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Though not the 4runner, I have discovered things about hot weather driving since moving back to AZ three years ago.
I work in the hottest part of AZ (126° yesterday). My commute includes a 12 mile, 6% grade.
My 68 Ford gets really hot (hasn't overheated, yet) when I drive home in the afternoon.
I've added a larger radiator (width) and recently had it recored to a 3 row. It has an 18" electric fan that was held on with the plastic tiles through the core. Fine for paved streets, but not where we now live (primitive dirt roads). The fan is going to destroy the new radiator. So I made some sheet metal brackets to support the fan by the radiator frame.
It worked well, but ran just a tiny fraction hotter (according to the OEM, 50 year old, analog gauge). So I decided to make a fan shroud that supported the fan and draw air through the entire core. It worked splendidly! Sort of. Consistent temperature around town and at idle. Climbing "the hill" not so much. The fan just couldn't move enough air at highway speeds. It ran hotter on "the hill".
So I made a new mounting bracket out of rebar (teaching myself to weld). This securely supports the fan to the radiator frame and allows airflow at speed. The fan kicks on when needed and draws through the 18" circle in the middle of the core.
Here's my fan mount progression:
fan alone, mounted through radiator
Sheet metal side brackets
Full shroud (cake pan)
Final rebar, redneck solution
Yes, 126° yesterday

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Old 06-18-2021, 10:04 AM #20
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Originally Posted by mtbtim View Post
I forgot to mention that I am running the Stant 170 degree thermostat. It does seem to help a little, but when the weather gets really hot, it doesn’t do much.

I have heard 230 degrees is kind of the danger level but I could be mistaken. The highest I’ve seen is 215 driving in Los Angeles on grades in 110 degree heat. I think 220 is still safe but you’re really starting to push it so that’s why I set the limit for my rig at 210. I was purposely driving 50 mph with overdrive off, heater on full blast, and windows rolled down so I didn’t kill my mom and wife. When the highway got flat or downhill, I cranked the AC, closed the windows and enjoyed it until the next grade. Nevada is much hillier than you think especially when you’re in the situation I was in driving up steep grades in 117 degree heat.
Have you tried cleaning your condenser? They can get clogged up and restrict airflow to the radiator.

One thing to consider when switching to electric fans is the additional electric load required. There is still a load on the engine in the form of increased load on the alternator. You may need to upgrade your alternator in order to keep up with the demand. There's no such thing as a free ride.

The Koyo or Champion radiators are a thicker radiator core (advertised 33% thicker) which will greatly increase heat transfer. Combine that with a 170 degree thermostat, fresh coolant with water wetter, and a properly functioning fan clutch and I don't see a reason for electric fans. I don't think Koyo or Champion have provisions for an internal transmission cooler, and they may require a different radiator cap.
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Old 06-18-2021, 11:31 AM #21
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I only skimmed the info peeps r throwing out so if i rehash anything thats why.

what weight r u running, what outside temps r u driving in normally, u have an auto, 2wd or 4wd, how r u using ur 4runner ie (camping, rock crawling, etc), r u cing these temps on the hwy, city slow driving, mtn passes, etc

Just want a bit more info to guide my response....

The 4runner I currentlly use 4 camping/hunting/"over-landing"/rock crawling etc is probably one of the heaviest units of this forum when completely load up when I go out for a long period of time, weights over...

electric fans will only lower ur temps 5ish degrees (which is a lot when ur getting hot), I run pusher e/fans in conjunction with the OEM fan

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Old 06-18-2021, 12:26 PM #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bad Luck View Post
Have you tried cleaning your condenser? They can get clogged up and restrict airflow to the radiator.

One thing to consider when switching to electric fans is the additional electric load required. There is still a load on the engine in the form of increased load on the alternator. You may need to upgrade your alternator in order to keep up with the demand. There's no such thing as a free ride.

The Koyo or Champion radiators are a thicker radiator core (advertised 33% thicker) which will greatly increase heat transfer. Combine that with a 170 degree thermostat, fresh coolant with water wetter, and a properly functioning fan clutch and I don't see a reason for electric fans. I don't think Koyo or Champion have provisions for an internal transmission cooler, and they may require a different radiator cap.
I need to buy another radiator/AC condenser comb to clean up and fix some dings I put in them during the engine rebuild.

I love that water wetter! It makes a huge difference for dirtbikes on those extreme heat desert days/slow technical riding. With that being said, I would not run it in the factory plastic/aluminum radiator (I would run it in full metal radiators though). While it is not corrosive to metals in the cooling system, a bunch of people have had issues with it eating the plastic away in their cooling systems.

The Champion does have an internal transmission cooler, but I am not sure what the radiator cap compatibility is.
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Old 06-18-2021, 12:39 PM #23
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A simple thing to try would be to drop the mix ratio of coolant to water. 50/50 is recommended for optimum freeze protection with minimal heat transfer losses. A lot of race/track cars will run 25% antifreeze, or even 10% antifreeze, to maximize the cooling efficiency. Fortunately you don't have to worry about freezing, but even 10% antifreeze is enough to protect down to 26F.

If it were me, I would try running 25% coolant and see how that went.
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Old 06-18-2021, 01:18 PM #24
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Lots of good ideas in here, Tim. Here are some of my own ideas and my take on some of the suggestions offered here.

Regearing -- agreed this is likely to make the most difference as it will reduce strain on the drivetrain = less heat generation. Less torque converter slipping, engine running at higher RPMs and more reasonable loads rather than being bogged down all the time.

Electric fans -- A pusher fan in the front of your radiator can help a good deal. My little 1000cfm one certainly does. I would NOT change your mechanical fan to a primary electric fan. I have also personally had bad experiences with this approach.

Mechanical fan -- I know your fan clutch is new, but have you actually confirmed its operating correctly? It is also possible to change the viscosity of the fan's silicone oil to make it hook up more. Reading these two links it sounds like the factory units are sometimes underfilled with silicone oil as well!

Coolant -- Good idea to try a higher water % in your coolant mix as water is a much better heat transfer fluid than ethylene glycol. Redline's water wetter or similar is a strong surfactant and helps the coolant reject heat into the radiator more quickly but I'd leave this as a last resort.

Radiator -- Sounds like a lot of people are suggesting an upgraded radiator. Makes sense to me.
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Old 06-18-2021, 01:56 PM #25
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Originally Posted by TravThePro View Post
I need to buy another radiator/AC condenser comb to clean up and fix some dings I put in them during the engine rebuild.

I love that water wetter! It makes a huge difference for dirtbikes on those extreme heat desert days/slow technical riding. With that being said, I would not run it in the factory plastic/aluminum radiator (I would run it in full metal radiators though). While it is not corrosive to metals in the cooling system, a bunch of people have had issues with it eating the plastic away in their cooling systems.

The Champion does have an internal transmission cooler, but I am not sure what the radiator cap compatibility is.
Thanks for the info. I knew the Koyo radiator didn't have an internal transmission cooler but wasn't sure on the Champion. I've never heard that about water wetter and never considered it to be honest. I wonder if that's a problem specific to water wetter or if it applies to the other coolant additives that function similar to water wetter.

Quote:
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A simple thing to try would be to drop the mix ratio of coolant to water. 50/50 is recommended for optimum freeze protection with minimal heat transfer losses. A lot of race/track cars will run 25% antifreeze, or even 10% antifreeze, to maximize the cooling efficiency. Fortunately you don't have to worry about freezing, but even 10% antifreeze is enough to protect down to 26F.

If it were me, I would try running 25% coolant and see how that went.
That's a really good point about the antifreeze ratio. Like you said you just have to make sure you exceed the minimum freezing point for whatever mixture you decide on for where you are and remember that if you make any winter trips. That would make for a bad time if it did freeze and blew the freeze plugs out or cracked a radiator.
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Old 06-18-2021, 02:47 PM #26
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My cooling system is sound. Fan clutch, radiator, and thermostat have all been replaced. I do plan on re-gearing to 4:88 which I know will help. I’m wondering what else I might be able to do. I’ve heard the Champion radiator might allow me to run cooler. If you have any suggestions, I’d appreciate reading them.

Thanks!
I'd still suspect the cooling system just a bit - the radiator cap. If not new and OEM, change it out.

I had slight overheating issues when I had a weak radiator cap - it got up in the 210*F range in ~105*F heat with a medium load (32's, armor, 3 dudes w/ backpacking gear) on long hills. It was always fine around town, in traffic or on regular freeways (rock solid at 191*F). After replacing the cap, no issues with the same or higher load in harsher conditions. I already had a new radiator, new water pump, new thermostat and coolant (all OEM).

The OEM cooling system is incredibly good, I think it might be as simple as the radiator cap.

-Charlie

Edit: PS. I always run about 40% coolant / 60% water - it has been ok down to as low as -10*F temps on my Subaru, and I'd assume the 4Runner would be fine that way too.
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Old 06-18-2021, 03:18 PM #27
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Your rig has a cold intake right? That probably helped you out.

It appears that the water to antifreeze ratio can also have an affect on heat transfer. That's because water is a better conductor of heat, but be warned that there is some disagreement if running pure water can lead to it boiling and becoming steam. The antifreeze raises the boiling point of the water, but the system is pressurized so it should make it more difficult for water to turn into steam.

But the long term fix is upgrading radiator and fan. This is probably a good idea anyway because it appears that these heat waves will happen more often.
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Old 06-18-2021, 03:27 PM #28
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How is the front end airflow over the radiator with the bumper compared to stock? I’m not familiar with the design but is it restricting air flow in combination with the weight?

In my experience the electric fans are nice in that they can run all the time if you wish and you can adjust when then trigger. But in general they are more fragile and prone to failure than the comparatively simple stock setup. Maybe try to find one with pretty robust blades and what not. Haven’t some people dropped in the fans from a Taurus or something?
The CBI bumper with winch does block a decent amount of air flow over the stock set-up but I really think, like others have mentioned, it's more about the weight of the rig and 33 inch tires causing the engine to run really hot in extreme conditions.
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Old 06-18-2021, 03:30 PM #29
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Hey Tim,

Have you considered using an additive in your coolant like Royal Purple "Ice"? I've never used it but I have read that a few guys used it and it seemed to help lower coolant temps, some by as much as 10 degrees in scenarios like you were just in.

I don't think its "the" fix but it may be worth a try until you can re-gear or get a E fan setup.

Amazon.com: Royal Purple 01600 Purple Ice Super-Coolant Radiator Additive - 12 oz.: Automotive
I have not considered this but it's something to think about especially if you know you're going to drive in summer heat through desert areas like I did. 117 degrees is crazy hot. I don't know how people in places like Nevada and Arizona handle it. Low 100's sure. 115-120, F that!
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Old 06-18-2021, 03:34 PM #30
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Tim,
I don't live in AZ, so I can't speak directly from that experience. But I do live in NC where we see extremely humid 95-100 degree summers.

The probable and unfortunate answer is an expensive one- re-gearing. I went from 3.91 (15" wheel base SR5) to 4.88's.

My coolant temps with the old gears hung around 193-198 (which is normal!).
With the 4.88's, I'm rarely if ever over 188 degrees, even in the dead of summer while wheeling with low airflow.

I'm thinking that with your weight + 33" tires, your truck is simply working way too hard to stay at speed.
I agree with you. My rig is super heavy and I'm asking a lot of it especially on grades. Under normal driving conditions in the California Bay Area and with decently hot temps, like the 90's, my rig runs relatively cool. But, loaded down with gear and people and then put it on a steep grade in extreme heat and the engine is saying, "Help me, Help me!" The re-gear is going to happen. I'm going to switch from 4:30 to 4:88 and I think it will help a ton.
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