02-14-2022, 11:40 AM
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#16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JZiggy
Anonymous fab shows ARP fasteners as replacements. I was going to look into that and spec some out. 180kpsi strength vs typical 150psi in 10.9 and grade 8 applications.
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Any downsides to upgrading the bolts to the ARPs while still running the OEM LBJs? Like, would this create an unintended weak link somewhere else? (And would it matter?)
Here's the link: Toyota ARP Spindle Lower Ball Joint Hardware - Anonymous Fabrication
Thanks!
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Last edited by cl4Rk; 02-14-2022 at 02:00 PM.
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02-14-2022, 02:11 PM
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#17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cl4Rk
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No downsides other than how expensive they are. Just added overall strength. I have been running ARP 763-1003 SS HEX M10x1.25, 30mm length in my OEM LBJ for about 2yrs now. Lots of hard wheeling in rocks, impacts, lots of street miles. Anything you can imagine really. Much stronger than the Toyota bolts @ 180k psi. Toyota bolts are just fine also! But you cant really compare the strength of ARP vs Toyota. Different leagues. I think you'd rip the threads right out of the Knuckle before you break an ARP bolt. Which, if that happens, youve probably hit something so hard youre rig is totaled anyway
The purists will want to burn me at the stakes for this and start talking about how the factory bolts are TTY for a reason and have stretch built in, yada yada.
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Last edited by WeakSauz; 02-14-2022 at 02:13 PM.
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02-14-2022, 02:49 PM
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#18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeakSauz
No downsides other than how expensive they are. Just added overall strength. I have been running ARP 763-1003 SS HEX M10x1.25, 30mm length in my OEM LBJ for about 2yrs now. Lots of hard wheeling in rocks, impacts, lots of street miles. Anything you can imagine really. Much stronger than the Toyota bolts @ 180k psi. Toyota bolts are just fine also! But you cant really compare the strength of ARP vs Toyota. Different leagues. I think you'd rip the threads right out of the Knuckle before you break an ARP bolt. Which, if that happens, youve probably hit something so hard youre rig is totaled anyway
The purists will want to burn me at the stakes for this and start talking about how the factory bolts are TTY for a reason and have stretch built in, yada yada.
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Nah, the factory bolts aren't TTY. If they were the torque procedure would be something like "30 ft-lb + 60* of rotation".
It looks like ARP's stainless bolts are 170ksi and the black oxide chromoly ones are 180ksi or higher.
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02-14-2022, 03:22 PM
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#19
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@ JZiggy
@ WeakSauz
I assume you'd still want to use the FSM torque spec for these stronger bolts since the knuckle threads would now be the weak link?
(Anonymous Fab says the are for 2000-2002 model years, so 59 ft/lbs)
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02-14-2022, 03:25 PM
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#20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JZiggy
Nah, the factory bolts aren't TTY. If they were the torque procedure would be something like "30 ft-lb + 60* of rotation".
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Oh, I 100% agree with you. I just know we'll have someone come in here claiming it haha
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02-14-2022, 03:26 PM
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#21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cl4Rk
@ JZiggy
@ WeakSauz
I assume you'd still want to use the FSM torque spec for these stronger bolts since the knuckle threads would now be the weak link?
(Anonymous Fab says the are for 2000-2002 model years, so 59 ft/lbs)
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I just went to 60ft/lbs on my ARPs and called it there. (with blue loctite). Basically like factory
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02-14-2022, 03:44 PM
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#22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cl4Rk
@ JZiggy
@ WeakSauz
I assume you'd still want to use the FSM torque spec for these stronger bolts since the knuckle threads would now be the weak link?
(Anonymous Fab says the are for 2000-2002 model years, so 59 ft/lbs)
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Personally I would use whatever torque ARP suggests for the fastener. The strength of the bolt matters as does the coating (COF can change what is needed).
The threaded portion can be weaker since there's more area bearing the load. If that wasn't the case we could never torque steel fasteners to their proof load into aluminum housings. In this case it's still forged steel so the threads should be quite strong.
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02-17-2022, 09:36 PM
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#23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JZiggy
Personally I would use whatever torque ARP suggests for the fastener. The strength of the bolt matters as does the coating (COF can change what is needed).
The threaded portion can be weaker since there's more area bearing the load. If that wasn't the case we could never torque steel fasteners to their proof load into aluminum housings. In this case it's still forged steel so the threads should be quite strong.
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For the Stainless bolts 763-1003- 180k Psi - the torque is 54 Ft Lbs.
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03-04-2022, 09:45 AM
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#24
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Given the different materials (SS vs CroMo) and the 663-1003 chromoly bolts being stronger and half the cost, any reason not to buy them instead of SS?
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03-05-2022, 01:26 AM
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#25
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I received my set a couple weeks ago, they look solid. I also got the updated ARP bolts. My wheeling style is crazy and I don't live in the salt belt so we will see how the uni-ball lives in a temperate climate (Bay Area).
For those concerned about the uniball needing service, it can be replaced, which means the initial cost of entry is high, but overall maintenance could be less than replacing OEM LBJ's more frequently.
Josh does some great work putting these together and the quality shows when you inspect these - now to put them to the test!!
.
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03-05-2022, 09:52 AM
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#26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by infamousRNR
I received my set a couple weeks ago, they look solid. I also got the updated ARP bolts. My wheeling style is crazy and I don't live in the salt belt so we will see how the uni-ball lives in a temperate climate (Bay Area).
For those concerned about the uniball needing service, it can be replaced, which means the initial cost of entry is high, but overall maintenance could be less than replacing OEM LBJ's more frequently.
Josh does some great work putting these together and the quality shows when you inspect these - now to put them to the test!!
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Nice Sean
You gonna boot them?
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05-18-2022, 11:24 PM
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#27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezert4Runner
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Out of curiosity are you still using the OEM hubs? I find it extremely odd the top cap interferes, and I'm really struggling to believe one would go through the effort of making these but not confirm it's fitment before selling and advertising them. Something seems funky
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05-19-2022, 12:16 AM
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#28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Devbot
Out of curiosity are you still using the OEM hubs? I find it extremely odd the top cap interferes, and I'm really struggling to believe one would go through the effort of making these but not confirm it's fitment before selling and advertising them. Something seems funky
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I’m running stock hubs and spindles. Josh was running these and I got to see them in person before ever installing mine. His Tacoma is 2wd and has no CV’s in the equation, and the caps were pretty tight clearance wise. There’s not much room there between the spindle and 3d printed cap. Now add the cv outer dust seal and it gets even tighter. They were essentially being guinea pigged on his rig for a while before he started including them with purchases. I have no idea if other people were getting them before I picked mine up.
I could have made contact when tightening the cv nut and drawing that dust seal across the 3d cap. Who knows. I don’t really care if it’s there or not personally, so it was an easy decision to just leave them off. It’ll be way easier to lube the uniball without them being covered from the top anyways. Josh said he has to use a small paint brush from the bottom to get the uniball lubed, so even if the 3d caps fit, you’re sacrificing access to the uniball and stuff can still get in through the bottom if you’re in mud or water. It would really just be keeping the larger debris from sitting on top.
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05-19-2022, 07:09 AM
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#29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezert4Runner
I’m running stock hubs and spindles. Josh was running these and I got to see them in person before ever installing mine. His Tacoma is 2wd and has no CV’s in the equation, and the caps were pretty tight clearance wise. There’s not much room there between the spindle and 3d printed cap. Now add the cv outer dust seal and it gets even tighter. They were essentially being guinea pigged on his rig for a while before he started including them with purchases. I have no idea if other people were getting them before I picked mine up.
I could have made contact when tightening the cv nut and drawing that dust seal across the 3d cap. Who knows. I don’t really care if it’s there or not personally, so it was an easy decision to just leave them off. It’ll be way easier to lube the uniball without them being covered from the top anyways. Josh said he has to use a small paint brush from the bottom to get the uniball lubed, so even if the 3d caps fit, you’re sacrificing access to the uniball and stuff can still get in through the bottom if you’re in mud or water. It would really just be keeping the larger debris from sitting on top.
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I've been running the Anonymous Fabrication LBJs for a while now with srlf-sourced ARP 663-1003 bolts.
Amazon.com: ARP (663-1003) Hex Oxide Bolt, Black : Automotive
These chromoly back oxide bolts are rated at 180,000 psi tensile strength, stainless steel (763-1003) are rated at 170,000 psi tensile strength. Both torque to 54 pounds feet according to ARP.
The caps Josh sent did not fit mine either, the CV dust shields wouldn't let the LBJ . I mic'd the center thickness of the cap at 2.7mm and sanded them down to 1mm thick so far... still a tight fit. I've been in communication with Josh about it and it's reasonable to run without the caps under normal conditions.
I am still pursuing alternative solutions and I suspect Josh is too. The caps are 3D printed, locally sourced and I hope to see a solution soon. While they are a tight fit, they are not watertight, so I would consider them an inspection point after submersion or prolonged extreme conditions, regardless.
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05-19-2022, 09:03 AM
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#30
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if you're in an area where you'll get sand, salt etc in them its just not worth it
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