User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 04-13-2022, 02:28 AM #1
Pyral's Avatar
Pyral Pyral is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2021
Location: Eastern WA
Posts: 551
Real Name: N/A
Pyral has a spectacular aura about Pyral has a spectacular aura about
Pyral Pyral is offline
Member
Pyral's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2021
Location: Eastern WA
Posts: 551
Real Name: N/A
Pyral has a spectacular aura about Pyral has a spectacular aura about
E15 and 3rd gens

Biden admin says it's going to allow E15 to be sold all summer. Currently I'm forced to buy gasoline with a 10% dilution of ethanol (E10), and the owners manual say that is the max amount of ethanol. Unfortunately, E15 is coming whether we like it or not.

I've seen a lot of places claiming that all vehicle made from 01 onwards are safe to use with E15. That should include the very tail end of 3rd gen 4runners.

Did Toyota have to change anything with the fuel system in those model years to achieve E15 compatibility?

I'm worried that my early 3rd gen will start having issues when I start being forced to use E15. Mines a 4 cylinder, so it was discontinued by 2001 (hope its not too different)
__________________
1998 4runner 2.7 manual
Pyral is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-13-2022, 06:47 AM #2
spartacus's Avatar
spartacus spartacus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: denver
Posts: 2,993
spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of
spartacus spartacus is offline
Senior Member
spartacus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: denver
Posts: 2,993
spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of
E-15 is more corrosive to rubber and attracts moisture. I would avoid it.
spartacus is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-13-2022, 08:11 AM #3
Brian.'s Avatar
Brian. Brian. is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Earth
Posts: 862
Brian. is a name known to all Brian. is a name known to all Brian. is a name known to all Brian. is a name known to all Brian. is a name known to all Brian. is a name known to all
Brian. Brian. is offline
Member
Brian.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Earth
Posts: 862
Brian. is a name known to all Brian. is a name known to all Brian. is a name known to all Brian. is a name known to all Brian. is a name known to all Brian. is a name known to all
Quote:
Originally Posted by spartacus View Post
E-15 is more corrosive to rubber and attracts moisture. I would avoid it.
Nearly no one will be able to avoid it.... it will be at EVERY pump that isn't specifically "ethanol free".

But I agree, it's something I'd love to avoid. Like feeling hungry and adding a handful of sand to your food to "feel full". My 2 carbed vehicles are already trouble with the current formulations, soooo not looking forward to what's coming.


Funny, this feels like a planned situation given the Keystone pipeline he canceled on day 1.
__________________
'99 Limited 4x4, Millenium Silver ~ Maintenance Thread
Brian. is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-13-2022, 08:12 AM #4
brillo_76's Avatar
brillo_76 brillo_76 is offline
Elite Member
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Western PA
Posts: 5,921
Real Name: Jon
brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute
brillo_76 brillo_76 is offline
Elite Member
brillo_76's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Western PA
Posts: 5,921
Real Name: Jon
brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute
I saw when the ethonal first came out. Toyota said the maximum is 10% In the older vehicles. So I expect a lot of people to have major issues with older vehicles if they run 15%

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk
__________________
7 3rd gens listed in the build thread (2 are parts mobiles)
Build Thread: https://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-g...os-builds.html
Brillo's Bucket Fluid Ex changer: https://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-g...ml#post3358086
Sparks Plugs Wire and Coil Information: https://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-g...on-5vz-fe.html
brillo_76 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-13-2022, 09:31 AM #5
jgue467's Avatar
jgue467 jgue467 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 3,127
jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice
jgue467 jgue467 is offline
Senior Member
jgue467's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 3,127
jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice
Time for Stabil or Star Tron, which is my cost-effective choice, about .20cents a tankful from the quart size. I give each vehicle a little splash every tankful or so...
__________________
2001 Limited 4WD - 340+K - SunfireRed\Thunder Cloud; - 265/75/16 Michelin A/T2s - Fat Pat's 1.5" BL - StopTech ANGLED rotors - In series 699 trans cooler, New Yota1 transmission, All new OEM suspension front to rear.
jgue467 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-13-2022, 09:38 AM #6
ch1966 ch1966 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 50
ch1966 will become famous soon enough
ch1966 ch1966 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 50
ch1966 will become famous soon enough
100% gas all things.
Unless you like chasing ethanol related problems.
Those cost time and money.
ch1966 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-13-2022, 09:42 AM #7
delstele's Avatar
delstele delstele is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2021
Location: MI
Posts: 34
delstele is on a distinguished road
delstele delstele is offline
Member
delstele's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2021
Location: MI
Posts: 34
delstele is on a distinguished road
Rec gas has no ethanol but it is about $.40 - .50 cents higher than ethanol blends so that's an option. I run it in my 72 c10 truck.
delstele is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-13-2022, 09:45 AM #8
turbodudey2's Avatar
turbodudey2 turbodudey2 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Colorado
Posts: 247
turbodudey2 will become famous soon enough
turbodudey2 turbodudey2 is offline
Member
turbodudey2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Colorado
Posts: 247
turbodudey2 will become famous soon enough
The difference between E10 and E15 is negligible. Any 3rd gen, even pre-2001 should run E15 with no issue. Ethanol isn't any more corrosive to fuel systems than gasoline. The only caveat is if it's mixed with water. So just don't put water in your fuel tank and you'll be good. There are old arguments that say it will readily absorb moisture from the air, but this is very silly since the fuel systems are sealed.

Ethanol is a good solvent, so if anything it may clean the fuel injectors which will improve performance.

The energy density of ethanol is lower than gasoline, so you may notice a decrease in fuel economy. This is normal. Depending on the price of gas, it may be a wash in terms of actual $$ per mile for fuel consumed.

I've been running E85 for a while (supercharged, larger injectors, etc) and it is considerably cheaper than gasoline even after accounting for the decrease in fuel economy. The price of ethanol has remained relatively stable while the price of gasoline has gone up significantly.

The other bonus of ethanol is the high octane rating (average 105 octane), which is especially nice for supercharged applications.
__________________

'96 Toyota 4Runner Limited 4x4, Supercharged
turbodudey2 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-13-2022, 09:59 AM #9
jgue467's Avatar
jgue467 jgue467 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 3,127
jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice
jgue467 jgue467 is offline
Senior Member
jgue467's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 3,127
jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice jgue467 is just really nice
Quote:
Originally Posted by turbodudey2 View Post
...There are old arguments that say it will readily absorb moisture from the air, but this is very silly since the fuel systems are sealed.
...
How about the air in the tank as is splashes around while driving?

You make otherwise solid points about alcohol. I hate that it deteriorates rubber hoses, which by and large do not exist on runners. But they sure do exist on most small engines, atvs, ect. So I just treat every fuel tank I have, since many of my engines don't see daily duty, uggg.
__________________
2001 Limited 4WD - 340+K - SunfireRed\Thunder Cloud; - 265/75/16 Michelin A/T2s - Fat Pat's 1.5" BL - StopTech ANGLED rotors - In series 699 trans cooler, New Yota1 transmission, All new OEM suspension front to rear.
jgue467 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-13-2022, 10:27 AM #10
ArthurKotb's Avatar
ArthurKotb ArthurKotb is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2022
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 396
Real Name: Rich
ArthurKotb has a spectacular aura about ArthurKotb has a spectacular aura about ArthurKotb has a spectacular aura about
ArthurKotb ArthurKotb is offline
Member
ArthurKotb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2022
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 396
Real Name: Rich
ArthurKotb has a spectacular aura about ArthurKotb has a spectacular aura about ArthurKotb has a spectacular aura about
Doing a little research this morning I find that cars made since 2001 will be okay with E15 gas. Small engines like lawnmowers, chainsaws, generators and marine engines should not use E15. BUT, only 1.5% of gas stations in the US have the necessary equipment to store E15 fuel, so E10 should still be readily available. It's estimated that for a 10 pump station it would cost $300,000 to convert to E15, a fuel that cannot be sold in summer because it causes smog. Its sale in some states is banned June to Sept 15.

Biden’s approval of E15 gas will only affect 1.5% of gas stations — Quartz
President Joe Biden and E15: What to know about the renewable fuel
__________________
Rich
2004 V8 4Runner 140K+ miles
Kentucky
ArthurKotb is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-13-2022, 10:31 AM #11
turbodudey2's Avatar
turbodudey2 turbodudey2 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Colorado
Posts: 247
turbodudey2 will become famous soon enough
turbodudey2 turbodudey2 is offline
Member
turbodudey2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Colorado
Posts: 247
turbodudey2 will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by jgue467 View Post
How about the air in the tank as is splashes around while driving?
Assuming a typical condition of 50% relative humidity at 70įF, the amount of water vapor in the air is very small.

If the fuel tank was only half full, that would leave about 1 cubic foot of air space containing 0.006312 oz of water vapor. Pretty much insignificant.

There is something to be said for the old rule of thumb to store a vehicle with the fuel tank full. Just to reduce the air volume allowed in the tank. But again these numbers are so small, it's not something anyone needs to worry about.
__________________

'96 Toyota 4Runner Limited 4x4, Supercharged
turbodudey2 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-13-2022, 10:43 AM #12
jross20's Avatar
jross20 jross20 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Georgia
Posts: 1,318
jross20 is a jewel in the rough jross20 is a jewel in the rough jross20 is a jewel in the rough
jross20 jross20 is offline
Senior Member
jross20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Georgia
Posts: 1,318
jross20 is a jewel in the rough jross20 is a jewel in the rough jross20 is a jewel in the rough
More government nonsense that we don't need. Woo
jross20 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-13-2022, 11:34 AM #13
heat's Avatar
heat heat is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Virginia
Posts: 360
heat will become famous soon enough heat will become famous soon enough
heat heat is offline
Member
heat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Virginia
Posts: 360
heat will become famous soon enough heat will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArthurKotb View Post
Doing a little research this morning I find that cars made since 2001 will be okay with E15 gas. Small engines like lawnmowers, chainsaws, generators and marine engines should not use E15. BUT, only 1.5% of gas stations in the US have the necessary equipment to store E15 fuel, so E10 should still be readily available. It's estimated that for a 10 pump station it would cost $300,000 to convert to E15, a fuel that cannot be sold in summer because it causes smog. Its sale in some states is banned June to Sept 15.

Bidenís approval of E15 gas will only affect 1.5% of gas stations ó Quartz
President Joe Biden and E15: What to know about the renewable fuel
The EPA ban and supporting court case is an interesting twist. I was getting a
little crazy about this. My owner's manual says nothing over E10, and the local
dealer service department had no information at all.
__________________
'02 Limited 4x4 AT - Stock ~181k miles
Thundercloud aka metallic dirt
heat is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-13-2022, 01:23 PM #14
brillo_76's Avatar
brillo_76 brillo_76 is offline
Elite Member
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Western PA
Posts: 5,921
Real Name: Jon
brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute
brillo_76 brillo_76 is offline
Elite Member
brillo_76's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Western PA
Posts: 5,921
Real Name: Jon
brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute brillo_76 has a reputation beyond repute
Time will tell. I expect issues with it. So additives will help. Being pre 2001 engines where never designed to run ethonal. Lots of testing seems to be done if folks dig around.

Isn't adding more ethonal to the gas going to curb mpg?

As adding 10% dropped the mpg some. Wouldn't adding more drop it slightly more?



Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk
__________________
7 3rd gens listed in the build thread (2 are parts mobiles)
Build Thread: https://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-g...os-builds.html
Brillo's Bucket Fluid Ex changer: https://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-g...ml#post3358086
Sparks Plugs Wire and Coil Information: https://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-g...on-5vz-fe.html
brillo_76 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-13-2022, 02:12 PM #15
spartacus's Avatar
spartacus spartacus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: denver
Posts: 2,993
spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of
spartacus spartacus is offline
Senior Member
spartacus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: denver
Posts: 2,993
spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of spartacus has much to be proud of
The fuel systems in these trucks are getting long in the tooth. Ethanol is known to degrade rubber, nylon in fuel pumps and lines and effects aluminum. Fuel pumps and injectors etc will surely be effected.
spartacus is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Reply

Tags
3rd , e15 , ethanol , forced , gen

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
are the headlight bulbs the same on 4th gens and 5th gens? keakar 5th gen T4Rs 1 09-26-2018 12:01 PM
Do fully built 3rd gens or 4th gens get better MPG? TejasRunner01 3rd gen T4Rs 18 05-05-2018 11:42 AM
People that are selling 4th gens and getting 5th gens, please state your reasons bassmacka 4th Gen T4Rs 42 03-07-2017 06:55 PM
AIR LIFT 1000. Lifted 4th gens, FJ and maybe 5th gens. TOWING shootmymime For Sale: Suspension/Wheels/Tires 3 09-18-2016 04:29 PM
3rd Gens and 4th Gens EVERYONE PLEASE READ!!! Matt Starr 3rd gen T4Rs 12 03-13-2009 02:22 AM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.2

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:38 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2023 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2023 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2023 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
***This site is an unofficial Toyota site, and is not officially endorsed, supported, authorized by or affiliated with Toyota. All company, product, or service names references in this web site are used for identification purposes only and may be trademarks of their respective owners. The Toyota name, marks, designs and logos, as well as Toyota model names, are registered trademarks of Toyota Motor Corporation***Ad Management plugin by RedTyger
 
Copyright © 2020