10-30-2017, 01:59 PM
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#31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dta1984
Hey no problem! Glad to see it may be the root of your issues as well. Our symptoms are very similar.
Most likely it will be this coming weekend i'll get back around to working on it. My intention is to first blow out all of the connectors and ECM, and see how long that lasts me. Next step will probably be to splice the wire somewhere to see if I can stop the capillary action.
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I'm thinking it could be. I am definitely going to try cleaning out the connectors on both sides with Electronic Cleaner spray and letting it dry... see how long that keeps issues at bay. Thanks again and keep me posted! I will do the same as well if I make any additional discoveries!
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10-30-2017, 02:14 PM
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#32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gm350reratliff
I'm still find it hard to believe that the transmission fluid is getting pushed through the wiring harness, especially the O2 harness, and into the ECM. I don't recall ever seeing that on any of the vehicles I've worked on. I would think you would see one of the connectors between the transmission and ECM start to leak first. Plus, if the connectors are dry inside, there's no way that's the issue.
It's funny that this thread popped up because a friend of mine was dealing with some lean codes on his super clean, pampered FJ after the dealer forgot to put the air filter housing together. He put the air filter housing back together himself but ended up taking the FJ back after the codes re-appeared. The dealer's findings were that the transmission over-pressured due to a plugged transmission vent and pumped ATF through the harness to the ECM. They recommended replacing the ECM, entire engine/trans harness to the staggering cost of $5k, and that was just to start. It didn't sound right to my buddy because they never mentioned anything about clearing or replacing the trans vent or to find out why the transmission was over-pressurizing so he had them put it back together and he drove it home. Not to mention that the FJ is driving and running perfectly fine other than the CEL was on. The dealer supposedly showed him oil on the ECM connectors but the oil, or whatever it was, had no color, it was clear. When my buddy inquired about that the dealer stated that the ATF in the FJ was clear, not red (more red flags).
I went and checked the FJ out and pulled apart several connectors (O2 and some others) and found them to be dry. I next went the MAF, since the whole problem started with the dealer leaving the air filter lid off. I cleaned the MAF and so far the CEL is off and the FJ is running great. I feel that the dealer was completely trying to take advantage of my buddy. I never dug into the ECM to see if oil was on those connectors but I really doubt oil is getting to them anyway. Like I said, it just seems highly unlikely that such a thing could even happen, much less to a low mile, very pampered FJ.
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I agree it's definitely odd, but it does happen. Ever since I found this thread I've been reading up more on it.
Thanks for mentioning the transmission vent, that was mentioned in the other thread. I should probably check that first.
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10-30-2017, 02:38 PM
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#33
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Where is the transmission vent located? Might just be a lazy question, but before crawling under it I want to know what to look for.
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10-30-2017, 04:12 PM
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#34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supersonic
Where is the transmission vent located? Might just be a lazy question, but before crawling under it I want to know what to look for.
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I haven't looked for it yet, but according to this link it's on top of the bell housing (at least on the v8). Breather locations
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10-30-2017, 09:13 PM
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#35
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@ gm350reratliff
Like I said on a Toyota it's very odd. I think I've only seen this once before on a Camry? I could be wrong on that it's been years. But I have seen sensors fail and fill up an ECM, it was fairly common with BMWs I recall from when I did used cars and my dealer tech friend was telling me.
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10-31-2017, 09:05 AM
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#36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackWorksInc
@ gm350reratliff
Like I said on a Toyota it's very odd. I think I've only seen this once before on a Camry? I could be wrong on that it's been years. But I have seen sensors fail and fill up an ECM, it was fairly common with BMWs I recall from when I did used cars and my dealer tech friend was telling me.
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Is the transmission vent on top of the bell housing? I couldn't find a definitive location for it.
Thinking back, my trans pan gasket had been leaking. I did replace it, but wonder if it's linked to a plugged vent and over pressurizing.
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10-31-2017, 12:30 PM
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#38
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Thanks, that's it! That link brought up a Tundra, but I was able to find the diagram. Looks like it is on top, and probably visible from the back of the engine bay.
https://parts.lakelandtoyota.com/sho...rimLevel=18357
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10-31-2017, 12:59 PM
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#39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dta1984
Is the transmission vent on top of the bell housing? I couldn't find a definitive location for it.
Thinking back, my trans pan gasket had been leaking. I did replace it, but wonder if it's linked to a plugged vent and over pressurizing.
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The vent is on top of the bell housing and comes up and is attached to the rear of the driver side head. At least on my 2008 it is.
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11-03-2017, 08:25 AM
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#40
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So yesterday I pulled all the ECM plugs, and both downstream 02 sensor plugs. Both downstream sensor plugs had ATF in them, in particular the passenger side was the worst. I wiped them out, used compressed air and electrical cleaner. Unfortunately within 10 miles the code came back on (P0171, P0174, P0136).
After the drive I pulled the ECM plugs and didn't notice fluid on them, maybe a little, but could have been residual.
I suppose next steps will be to first check the 02 plugs again to see if fluid already filled back up. Along with that I'll pull the ecm out completely to make sure no oil is inside of it. I also need to locate and check the transmission breather.
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11-03-2017, 09:57 AM
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#41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dta1984
So yesterday I pulled all the ECM plugs, and both downstream 02 sensor plugs. Both downstream sensor plugs had ATF in them, in particular the passenger side was the worst. I wiped them out, used compressed air and electrical cleaner. Unfortunately within 10 miles the code came back on (P0171, P0174, P0136).
After the drive I pulled the ECM plugs and didn't notice fluid on them, maybe a little, but could have been residual.
I suppose next steps will be to first check the 02 plugs again to see if fluid already filled back up. Along with that I'll pull the ecm out completely to make sure no oil is inside of it. I also need to locate and check the transmission breather.
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Keep us posted. I have cleaned out my ECU connectors, but noticed a lot of my cabling was saturated with ATF fluid as well. I have yet to check the A/F Sensor Connectors, but am planning on finding time Sunday to do so.
What is the consensus on the fix to prevent this from happening anymore? Change the transmission vent and sensor? and then put a "block" in by soldering in a solid piece of wire instead of stranded somewhere before the front A/F sensors and any other sensors that are affected?
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11-03-2017, 10:36 AM
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#42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BoostinZX
Keep us posted. I have cleaned out my ECU connectors, but noticed a lot of my cabling was saturated with ATF fluid as well. I have yet to check the A/F Sensor Connectors, but am planning on finding time Sunday to do so.
What is the consensus on the fix to prevent this from happening anymore? Change the transmission vent and sensor? and then put a "block" in by soldering in a solid piece of wire instead of stranded somewhere before the front A/F sensors and any other sensors that are affected?
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I don't think I have found a consensus on fixing the problem other than the one post above that shows someone had success with splicing in solid wire near that transmission sensor. It makes sense that this would work. I wonder how you get the residual fluid that is in the harness out after this fix? Or maybe it won't travel since downstream is blocked with the solid wire? This will be my route eventually.
I do wonder if once we fix the issue, is the af sensor going to be bad from the ECM compensating for so long for the lean reading?
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11-03-2017, 11:43 AM
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#43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dta1984
I don't think I have found a consensus on fixing the problem other than the one post above that shows someone had success with splicing in solid wire near that transmission sensor. It makes sense that this would work. I wonder how you get the residual fluid that is in the harness out after this fix? Or maybe it won't travel since downstream is blocked with the solid wire? This will be my route eventually.
I do wonder if once we fix the issue, is the af sensor going to be bad from the ECM compensating for so long for the lean reading?
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Seems like you are right, putting the "block" in from that sensor wiring would be the best fix... I too worry about the residual fluid left in the cabling... no clue how you would go about getting rid of all of that... or just deal with replacing the sensors for a few more times over the next X years... And not to mention the long term effects of ATF fluid in the cabling? not sure what that may cause issues with...
Do you think we need to replace the transmission sensor itself? is it going bad the root of these issues? or just putting the block in place do you think is enough?
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11-03-2017, 12:48 PM
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#44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BoostinZX
Seems like you are right, putting the "block" in from that sensor wiring would be the best fix... I too worry about the residual fluid left in the cabling... no clue how you would go about getting rid of all of that... or just deal with replacing the sensors for a few more times over the next X years... And not to mention the long term effects of ATF fluid in the cabling? not sure what that may cause issues with...
Do you think we need to replace the transmission sensor itself? is it going bad the root of these issues? or just putting the block in place do you think is enough?
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I'm not sure if the sensor going bad is the root, or maybe a blocked vent ? Definitely something to keep thinking about.
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11-03-2017, 01:18 PM
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#45
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Just another thought, but the power steering uses ATF as well. I'm not sure if that's on the same harness as the 02 sensors though.
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