[Falcon3]

Installed the Daystar leveling kit- has the 1" spacer that should give a 2" lift at the axle. Left side is fine, original CV axle, leaking but not torn. No binding. Right side has a Napa Maxdrive New axle (not reman). At full droop, its binding, I can only turn the wheel about 1/4 turn in either direction. If I jack the LCA up even 1/8", the binding is gone and i can spin the axle at all wheel angles.

I know aftermarket axles have more problems than OEM with lifts, especially spacer lifts, but getting binding at 2" seems ridiculous. Everything else I've found says 3" is where the CV binding really starts. The axle seems great in every other aspect, I've had no problems in 2 years since installing it.

Anyone else have low flexibility with the Napa New axles?
Suggestions? I could get a Cardone reman and try that, but from searching, it doesn't seem like this would be a home run fix.

[benztech82]

Well this sucks, I just replaced both front axle shafts and was going to order Daystar leveling kit too. I would really go 🍌 if it would do that on my truck. My shafts were from Worldpac.

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[Mike07SE]

Originally Posted by Falcon3

Installed the Daystar leveling kit- has the 1" spacer that should give a 2" lift at the axle. Left side is fine, original CV axle, leaking but not torn. No binding. Right side has a Napa Maxdrive New axle (not reman). At full droop, its binding, I can only turn the wheel about 1/4 turn in either direction. If I jack the LCA up even 1/8", the binding is gone and i can spin the axle at all wheel angles.

I know aftermarket axles have more problems than OEM with lifts, especially spacer lifts, but getting binding at 2" seems ridiculous. Everything else I've found says 3" is where the CV binding really starts. The axle seems great in every other aspect, I've had no problems in 2 years since installing it.

Anyone else have low flexibility with the Napa New axles?
Suggestions? I could get a Cardone reman and try that, but from searching, it doesn't seem like this would be a home run fix.

Been down this long road before. Aftermarket axles - despite them saying OEM rebuilt, etc - do not mix with lift kits on these trucks. Pick up some real OEM replacement axles (I know, $$$) or get the originals rebuilt. The problem lies in the inner joint's tulip shape is much more aggressively cast than the OEM unit hindering the degree of axle pivot from within the joint.

[Falcon3]

Yeah, I was aware of he aftermarket CV issues, but I never thought a mere 2" lift up front would get anywhere close to binding. I specifically passed over the 2.5/1.5 lift because of the potential for CV issues.
I might try to return the Napa for warranty and see if the Napa reman (Cardone) has any better luck. Or I might gut just drive it as is. Like I said, the binding is in the lowest 1/8" of travel only, and I don't see myself totally unweighting that wheel or negatively flexing it that far. My off-roading is limited to forest service and BLM roads, some Rocky Mountain style trailhead roads, but no huge stuff like some of you guys do.

[Mike07SE]

Originally Posted by Falcon3

Yeah, I was aware of he aftermarket CV issues, but I never thought a mere 2" lift up front would get anywhere close to binding. I specifically passed over the 2.5/1.5 lift because of the potential for CV issues.
I might try to return the Napa for warranty and see if the Napa reman (Cardone) has any better luck. Or I might gut just drive it as is. Like I said, the binding is in the lowest 1/8" of travel only, and I don't see myself totally unweighting that wheel or negatively flexing it that far. My off-roading is limited to forest service and BLM roads, some Rocky Mountain style trailhead roads, but no huge stuff like some of you guys do.

Careful with that thought. Just because you say mild or no wheeling doesn't mean that you'll never reach that amount of down travel. If you're on the road and dip down onto another low section of pavement you can easily reach that angle, and also being pavement there will be very little give to alleviate an axle that suddenly binds.

[benztech82]

Ok, so to do a quick check if CV binds, we can simply put truck on stands, and run it in the air and turn steering side to side to see if binding will occur ?

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[Falcon3]

Originally Posted by Mike07SE

Careful with that thought. Just because you say mild or no wheeling doesn't mean that you'll never reach that amount of down travel. If you're on the road and dip down onto another low section of pavement you can easily reach that angle, and also being pavement there will be very little give to alleviate an axle that suddenly binds.

Yeah, I was awake last night and this thought occurred to me. So much for an easy $40 mod to make my truck look normal. Found a local salvage yard that has An OEM from a runner with 39k, think I'll swap that in for the Napa axle, then when the OEMs go, I'll spring for CVJ axles. My Runner is my most prized possession and I have always loved the free feeling that I can jump in and go anywhere in the country (or out of it) and not worry about it.

[Mike07SE]

Originally Posted by Falcon3

Yeah, I was awake last night and this thought occurred to me. So much for an easy $40 mod to make my truck look normal. Found a local salvage yard that has An OEM from a runner with 39k, think I'll swap that in for the Napa axle, then when the OEMs go, I'll spring for CVJ axles. My Runner is my most prized possession and I have always loved the free feeling that I can jump in and go anywhere in the country (or out of it) and not worry about it.

Just keep an eye out in that junk yard for extra axles! That's what I did when I was having issues.

Remember, the FJ's work as well as the corresponding generation Tacoma's.

[Mike07SE]

Originally Posted by benztech82

Ok, so to do a quick check if CV binds, we can simply put truck on stands, and run it in the air and turn steering side to side to see if binding will occur ?

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Basically. Just getting the front end off the ground to free spin the wheels is enough - steering is not much of a factor. It's the inboard joint that's at the diff that will bind well before the CV joint at the hub will.

[Falcon3]

Originally Posted by Mike07SE

Just keep an eye out in that junk yard for extra axles! That's what I did when I was having issues.

Remember, the FJ's work as well as the corresponding generation Tacoma's.

This is confirmed? I found a CV from a 2014 Tacoma with 28k miles for $65. It's a direct replacement and won't cause any problems due to dimensions or anything? Toyota shows different part numbers..

EDIT: Napa shows the same part number for their reman and new axles for a 4th Gen 4Runner and a 2nd gen Tacoma, so I'm gonna try the low miles OEM. Probably swap out the Napa axle for a Cardone reman, as the Napa new can't even handle 2" of LCA drop if I can get Napa to warranty it for me.

[RonJR]

This issue is one of the downsides of top-out spacer lifts in general. Because they effectively move the upper mount point of the shock down, they increase LCA droop by the amount of lift, which puts a lot of stress on the inner CV joint at full droop.

Doing a lift in the more "preferred" manner, using something like an adjustable Bilstein or OME shock, doesn't have this problem. The maximum LCA droop stays nearly at stock levels - the suspension just rides higher in the range between full droop and full compression.

A stock 4runner has about 3" of compression range and 5" of droop range. Total range = 8".

With a Bilstein set at 2" of lift, that changes to 5" of compression and 3" of droop. Total range = 8", same as stock. (The Bilstein may add a bit of droop range, but not much.)

With a 2" spacer lift, compression is about 4", (now limited by the shock instead of the bump stop - not good), but droop stays at 5", for a total range of 9". Sounds like an improvement, except that the other components (upper ball joints, CV axles, the shock, etc.), can't handle that much range and so stuff tends to break. That's why most off-road shops aren't big on spacer lifts for serious off-roading.

Specifically, the two dangers with spacer lifts are:
1) hard compression will over compress the shock and possibly damage it, since the shock limits travel before the bump stop is contacted.
2) Full extension (droop) may exceed the max CV inner joint angle causing binding and possible breakage.

[Falcon3]

Originally Posted by RonJR

This issue is one of the downsides of top-out spacer lifts in general. Because they effectively move the upper mount point of the shock down, they increase LCA droop by the amount of lift, which puts a lot of stress on the inner CV joint at full droop.

Doing a lift in the more "preferred" manner, using something like an adjustable Bilstein or OME shock, doesn't have this problem. The maximum LCA droop stays nearly at stock levels - the suspension just rides higher in the range between full droop and full compression.

A stock 4runner has about 3" of compression range and 5" of droop range. Total range = 8".

With a Bilstein set at 2" of lift, that changes to 5" of compression and 3" of droop. Total range = 8", same as stock. (The Bilstein may add a bit of droop range, but not much.)

With a 2" spacer lift, compression is about 4", (now limited by the shock instead of the bump stop - not good), but droop stays at 5", for a total range of 9". Sounds like an improvement, except that the other components (upper ball joints, CV axles, the shock, etc.), can't handle that much range and so stuff tends to break. That's why most off-road shops aren't big on spacer lifts for serious off-roading.

Specifically, the two dangers with spacer lifts are:
1) hard compression will over compress the shock and possibly damage it, since the shock limits travel before the bump stop is contacted.
2) Full extension (droop) may exceed the max CV inner joint angle causing binding and possible breakage.

Thank you. I am learning all this through lots of research at this point. I will admit tearing your suspension apart will give you an understanding of its geometry and function far better than reading about it. I currently have XREAS and will likely go to a 1.5-2" coilover lift combo when it dies. I didn't want to spend the money at this point to redo a functioning suspension. However, at 170k, I also don't think it's long for this world. However, I do enjoy the ride it gives me on the highway, and that's where 95% of my driving takes place. So for now it'll have to do.

[benztech82]

Originally Posted by Mike07SE

Basically. Just getting the front end off the ground to free spin the wheels is enough - steering is not much of a factor. It's the inboard joint that's at the diff that will bind well before the CV joint at the hub will.

Sweet, I just had my truck on a hoist few days back when I was checking for vibration and in gear freespining. I will check brand of the axles that I have and post here, maybe it will be useful.

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[benztech82]

Lifetime warranty, FEQ autoparts.


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[Falcon3]

Just an update, replaced my Napa axle and installed a Tacoma cv axle with 28k on it. The Tacoma and 4runner axles have different part numbers but it fit just fine with no issues. there is no binding at full droop. At rest, the axles are pretty much straight, which should actually result in less boot wear and less vibration at highway speeds than the stock geometry.