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Old 04-12-2021, 09:16 PM #1
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Cool Nitro Helical Carrier installed in front clamshell!

Finally got around to installing this guy yesterday (after sitting for a few months in my garage) and wanted to share a bit since I've never seen anyone throw one of these in a Toyota 8" clamshell. From what I understand, it's pretty new - I just wish I knew about it before I did my re-gear last year, but cracking it open again wasn't too bad.







The unit itself seems to be a Nitro rebrand and is actually manufactured by Speedmaster79 as indicated by the stamp on the carrier. The casing itself was very well machined and the carrier bearings pressed on nicely. 6 helical "worm" gears inside this guy, which seems nice, and the torque bias ratio (TBR) is listed as 3.5x.





Straightforward install - swapped my bearings and stuff over to it. The carrier required a little re-shim to get he backlash right (it was aa tad different/off from the stock one) and we added a bit more preload to the carrier/pinion to get it into spec, did a quick pattern check and it was good to go.

Driving impressions - On the street it's very transparent, smooth and well behaved. Only time it makes itself known is under throttle in a turn. I was bracing for excessive understeer with this unit, but that doesn't seem to be the case - the truck tracks as it normally would. The steering feel has a little bit of feedback under turning throttle and you can feel the front end pulling itself out of a corner - coasting through a turn is the same as stock. So a tiny bit more steering effort in this scenario, but nothing crazy - easily daily drivable. In fact, I was already honestly fully used to it by the time I made my 20 minute drive home, so there's that.

Also got to do some preliminary off-road testing on some relatively loose rock/gravel inclines. With the rest of my driveline unlocked (AWD), I was able to make it up the inclines, with the steepest one presenting the most challenge. It still managed to pull itself, slowly creeping up, but interestingly enough I could actually feel the the front end pulling me up - a strange new sensation I haven't felt before with just ATRAC. Speaking of ATRAC, it never seemed to trigger during these tests, likely because the helical was already biasing the torque well enough. The "weakness" I haven't tested yet is front wheel lift and the front wheels on extremely slick surfaces (ie wet rocks). I've gotten myself into situations where my rear/center are locked but I'd just be waiting for ATRAC to wake up and pull the front over the obstacle - so hopefully this will help remedy that. As for wheel lift, the helical would act like an open with no load, so based what I've researched (and how these work), my hypothesis is that ATRAC would kick in when wheel spin is present, create a load for the helical, and the torque would begin transferring to the wheel with traction again. In the past, this could be accomplished with left-foot braking, but with ATRAC, it should just start moving again on its own once the brake clamps down on the spinning wheel. More testing this weekend will bear out if it ends up working like I think it will. This should compliment my rear e-locker quite well, I think.



Oh, and I also installed my Dobinsons dorkel afterwards!
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Old 04-13-2021, 08:42 AM #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drift Monkey View Post
Finally got around to installing this guy yesterday (after sitting for a few months in my garage) and wanted to share a bit since I've never seen anyone throw one of these in a Toyota 8" clamshell. From what I understand, it's pretty new - I just wish I knew about it before I did my re-gear last year, but cracking it open again wasn't too bad.







The unit itself seems to be a Nitro rebrand and is actually manufactured by Speedmaster79 as indicated by the stamp on the carrier. The casing itself was very well machined and the carrier bearings pressed on nicely. 6 helical "worm" gears inside this guy, which seems nice, and the torque bias ratio (TBR) is listed as 3.5x.





Straightforward install - swapped my bearings and stuff over to it. The carrier required a little re-shim to get he backlash right (it was aa tad different/off from the stock one) and we added a bit more preload to the carrier/pinion to get it into spec, did a quick pattern check and it was good to go.

Driving impressions - On the street it's very transparent, smooth and well behaved. Only time it makes itself known is under throttle in a turn. I was bracing for excessive understeer with this unit, but that doesn't seem to be the case - the truck tracks as it normally would. The steering feel has a little bit of feedback under turning throttle and you can feel the front end pulling itself out of a corner - coasting through a turn is the same as stock. So a tiny bit more steering effort in this scenario, but nothing crazy - easily daily drivable. In fact, I was already honestly fully used to it by the time I made my 20 minute drive home, so there's that.

Also got to do some preliminary off-road testing on some relatively loose rock/gravel inclines. With the rest of my driveline unlocked (AWD), I was able to make it up the inclines, with the steepest one presenting the most challenge. It still managed to pull itself, slowly creeping up, but interestingly enough I could actually feel the the front end pulling me up - a strange new sensation I haven't felt before with just ATRAC. Speaking of ATRAC, it never seemed to trigger during these tests, likely because the helical was already biasing the torque well enough. The "weakness" I haven't tested yet is front wheel lift and the front wheels on extremely slick surfaces (ie wet rocks). I've gotten myself into situations where my rear/center are locked but I'd just be waiting for ATRAC to wake up and pull the front over the obstacle - so hopefully this will help remedy that. As for wheel lift, the helical would act like an open with no load, so based what I've researched (and how these work), my hypothesis is that ATRAC would kick in when wheel spin is present, create a load for the helical, and the torque would begin transferring to the wheel with traction again. In the past, this could be accomplished with left-foot braking, but with ATRAC, it should just start moving again on its own once the brake clamps down on the spinning wheel. More testing this weekend will bear out if it ends up working like I think it will. This should compliment my rear e-locker quite well, I think.



Oh, and I also installed my Dobinsons dorkel afterwards!
Huh, this looks super cool. I've often wondered why there wasn't a good LSD option for the front.

I wish these were more doable as a DIY install. Mad props for setting the backlash and everything yourself.

LSD front/E-locker back is probably the best option short of ARBs. I kind of want to do a lunchbox locker rear, but I really don't want the snow handling to go to shite lol :P Maybe one day I'll do the 8.2 rear swap.

Good find!
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Old 04-13-2021, 09:27 AM #3
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props on the DIY, thats the one thing I elected not to do myself. Great looking rig as well man!
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Old 04-13-2021, 11:11 AM #4
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Very cool! I almost ordered one with my gears from ECGS, but decided to go with the rear Torsen only. I couldn't find anyone that had tried one up front in a V8 AWD setup.

-Rob
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Old 04-13-2021, 12:31 PM #5
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Very cool! I almost ordered one with my gears from ECGS, but decided to go with the rear Torsen only. I couldn't find anyone that had tried one up front in a V8 AWD setup.

-Rob
Did ECGS end up being any cheaper than having the same work done at a local shop?
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Old 04-13-2021, 12:36 PM #6
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Did ECGS end up being any cheaper than having the same work done at a local shop?
It did.

I was quoted about ~$600 more through a local Toyota specialty shop for regearing my diffs, after dropping off to them (No core, so my truck would be down while they worked on the diffs).

-Rob
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Old 04-13-2021, 02:54 PM #7
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It did.

I was quoted about ~$600 more through a local Toyota specialty shop for regearing my diffs, after dropping off to them (No core, so my truck would be down while they worked on the diffs).

-Rob
Wow, my local shop was only wanting about 250$ for a locker install if I brought them a third member.

I can't decide if I want to go that route, or scavenge an 8.2 with e-locker from a junkyard. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to find a good junkyard around here to pull one from... If I could find the mythical 350$ axle I'd do that in a heartbeat xD
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Old 04-13-2021, 06:09 PM #8
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Huh, this looks super cool. I've often wondered why there wasn't a good LSD option for the front.

I wish these were more doable as a DIY install. Mad props for setting the backlash and everything yourself.

LSD front/E-locker back is probably the best option short of ARBs. I kind of want to do a lunchbox locker rear, but I really don't want the snow handling to go to shite lol :P Maybe one day I'll do the 8.2 rear swap.

Good find!
There wasn't until super recently - Eaton never did make one from the front either.

It's a little involved for sure, but if you've never done any type of gearing, I'd def recommend a good installer handle it.

The only downside I see over full front ARB/E-locker up front is never fully truly locking and the wheel-lift stuff - I think ATRAC can overcome those limitations, but we'll see - needs more testing. This setup should be much easier to maneuver on tight trails and the added benefit of less tension/binding the front than a true locker should be nice - the CVs should appreciate that haha.

A rear auto-locker probably won't be TERRIBLE with AWD, i considered it. That and a helical up front (or helicals F/R) would probably do quite well I'd think.

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props on the DIY, thats the one thing I elected not to do myself. Great looking rig as well man!
Thanks man! My buddy has done a ton of gears so we figured it out surprisingly quick. What also made it quicker is I"m already on 4.56 ring/and pinion so it was just a carrier swap this time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RivMan View Post
Very cool! I almost ordered one with my gears from ECGS, but decided to go with the rear Torsen only. I couldn't find anyone that had tried one up front in a V8 AWD setup.

-Rob
It didn't even exist as an option when I did gears - I really wish it did! Afaik, I'm the first person to ever put one of these up front, but so far, I'd say it's def worth it. Like I said, more testing this weekend, but I think F/R Torsens might actually be a pretty sweet setup - great for the snow (which I very rarely get). I'm curious how she does with center/rear locked with the Torsen up front as well - it's done very well thus far open/ATRAC up front, but ATRAC can be a little slow to react in some cases - stoked to see what kinda capabilities it adds!
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Old 04-14-2021, 10:25 AM #9
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This is awesome news! I wish this was an option years ago when I did the ARB in the front of my '07 to match the TrueTrac in my rear. Can't see myself changing that out at this point.

Although, I am looking to regear my '19. Now if only a helical were available for the rear 8.2 that it has I'd be pulling the trigger.
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Old 04-14-2021, 05:18 PM #10
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This is awesome news! I wish this was an option years ago when I did the ARB in the front of my '07 to match the TrueTrac in my rear. Can't see myself changing that out at this point.

Although, I am looking to regear my '19. Now if only a helical were available for the rear 8.2 that it has I'd be pulling the trigger.
Yeah I tried asking ya about it before I ordered it, but it musta slipped thru the cracks. I'm basically running whatcha got in reverse hahaha.

I'm surprised no one has made one for the 8.2 out back, but it took forever for them to make one for the front 8" clamshell, so who knows!
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Old 04-19-2021, 04:24 PM #11
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Update after some wheeling - very impressed.

Got through alot of obstacles without having to lock the rear up - fronts grab very nicely and I could feel the front tires pulling up and over things.

In one particular spot, there was a deep rut/hole on the driver's side tire with a nearly vertical climb while the passenger front tire was a good 3ft+ higher - a buddy watched as the tires grabbed and pulled me up and out the hole, very cool.

ATRAC barely did any work out on the trails, but I can recall one spot where the tire lifted, ATRAC reacted briefly to stop the airborne wheel and torque was immediately transferred to the wheel on the ground once the helical sensed a "load" on the other wheel. It was very quick and seamless - pretty magical.

As for tight turns on trails, there was no binding or increased turning radius that I could tell, pretty much felt just like stock there.

Overall, again, very impressed and wish I would have found it sooner!
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Old 04-20-2021, 08:58 AM #12
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Update after some wheeling - very impressed.

Got through alot of obstacles without having to lock the rear up - fronts grab very nicely and I could feel the front tires pulling up and over things.

In one particular spot, there was a deep rut/hole on the driver's side tire with a nearly vertical climb while the passenger front tire was a good 3ft+ higher - a buddy watched as the tires grabbed and pulled me up and out the hole, very cool.

ATRAC barely did any work out on the trails, but I can recall one spot where the tire lifted, ATRAC reacted briefly to stop the airborne wheel and torque was immediately transferred to the wheel on the ground once the helical sensed a "load" on the other wheel. It was very quick and seamless - pretty magical.

As for tight turns on trails, there was no binding or increased turning radius that I could tell, pretty much felt just like stock there.

Overall, again, very impressed and wish I would have found it sooner!
That is awesome!

My biggest concern with an LSD front is going to be snow. I have had a clutch based one step out on me before, so I'm kind of curious what one in the front would do.
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Old 04-20-2021, 08:38 PM #13
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That is awesome!

My biggest concern with an LSD front is going to be snow. I have had a clutch based one step out on me before, so I'm kind of curious what one in the front would do.
It seems to be fairly common for guys in wintery areas to run front and rear helicals for maximum snow traction.
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