Castrol is out now, but I forgot to mention Amsoil along with Mobil 1 earlier, hell I used to sell Amsoil and I forgot all about them earlier.

I have a box of Mobil 1 in my garage for the switch if you were curious.

T

What I get a kick out of is that we will be totally anal about the oil we use and the interval we run it (the reason is for less engine wear right!!!) Then we will go out and install some after market air filter that says it increases air flow to the engine. It also increases the flow of dirt into the engine. This causes more damage and wear to our engine then using cheap oil and running it 2X's the recommended interval. Just thought I would throw this in for discussion

Hmm... Sounds like a K&N scenario. I'll be honest, I hate K&N. I'll never use any of their products. I'm proud to say my 4Runner, '00 Impreza RS, and '98 ZX-9R all have 100% OEM original intake and exhaust components.

9 Cars, trucks, and Jeeps,

Combined mileage around: 550,000 miles, all with K&N, 1 blown engine, and it was in a Ford so it doesn't count

The last Toyota I had was a T100 and I ran it with a custom setup K&N and beat the hell out of it, but took care of maintanence and I got over 180,000 miles out of it.

I originally started running K&N on my motorcycles and thats when I got hooked. To each his own, I honestly recommend them to everyone, they sound great, better performance on most applications, and they give better milage to boot.

They are not for everyone, but they are for me, just don't over oil it

A lot of people love K&N and I've heard all kinds of fantastic claims about their air filters. But what I can't get past is that to my knowledge none of the major manufacturers use them (or a similar type) as original equipment. In a world where performance is everything (especially motorcycles) why wouldn't a manufacturer take advantage of the supposed benefit of K&N filters?

I have the same type of discussion with a friend of mine about vitamins. He sells USANA brand and everything else is worthless per my buddy. I just shrug my shoulders and keep takin my Sam's club brand vitamins for 1/10 the price. Whatever turns you on. I would take his USANA vitamins if they were 10 times cheaper and I would use K&N filters if they were recommended by Toyota.

Manufacters don't use them because of cost, however, almost all aftermarket performance people use them.

Ie. Renntec on Mercedes
NISMO on there performance varients
Ligenfelter on there Corvettes,
SVT on the Cobra R model
Hamman on BMW


& on and on. Also since the original topic was synthetic oils, all of the previously mentioned Performance minded shops use synthetic oils as orignial equipment as well.

Once again, they might not be for you, but they are for me, and other performance minded individuals.

T Out

I'll also add that you guys might want to look into Royal Purple synthetic oil.

I saw a demontration of R.P.'s abilities last year at a trade show. A rep. had a little demonstration stand, which basically consisted of an electrical motor driving a wheel, which had a levered weight dragging on it with hanging weights. (causing friction drag) At the bottom of the wheel was a cup, which held the lubrication fluid that would be provided as a lubricant between the turning wheel and the weighted lever arm that was dragging on it's circumference. They also had a ampmeter and adjustable weight set so you could monitor how much power was required for a given weight, or applied friction.

The first test they ran was with water only, nasty results, lots of drag and the motor drew a lot of current and eventually tripped itself off. (overcurrent protection) Mobil synthetic was next, and it looked pretty good. Still, took a good amount of power to the motor to run with the max. weights on it.

Then they ran the R.P. product. Unbelievable difference, it was drawing a fraction of the power. I was very impressed at this point. But then, they then put in a mixture of R.P. to water, about a 1 to 5 mixture, 80% water! And it still ran at a low current! The R.P. literally was able to bond itself to the metal surfaces and provide lubrication, even in strong concentrations of water.

GOOD STUFF. They primarily provide products for commerical and industrial applications, but have been making oils for automobile use as well. You can get their stuff online, or call up R.P. directly and order it from them. I'm not advertising for them, but they deserved to be mentioned along with Mobil 1 and Castrol Syntec.

Cost is not the reason. A manufacturer would gladly pay this trivial cost to get a boost in "Horsepower, torque, and acceleration." It sells vehicles. We've all seen countless car and truck commercials that brag about the vehicle's horsepower or torque. Besides, a manufacturer would probably pay less than half of retail prices and could justify a miniscule sticker price increase by saying the reusability of the new filer will make up for the price increase after only a few filter changes.

What kind of powertrain warranties do the above aftermarket companies offer on their vehicles?

the original warrenty with the exception of the Lingenfelter due to it completely tearing the engines apart and building them up.

As for the rest, they are generally thought of as being endorsed by the manufacturer, they will usually not void the warenties. i'm not 100% on that statement though.

T

This thread is really interesting; Myself, I have used Syntec once...never again. It worked ok during a very cold winter, but when it started to warm up, it would not build pressure. I switched back to dino oil and all was right again.

I am seeing a lot of mention of mileage intervals; if I change mine at 3k to 5k miles, that would be one change per year. I like changing it spring and fall myself. It seems to me this would help with temperatue changes (we see 90 commonly in the summer and hover around 0 to 20 f. in the winter).

I am thinking seriously of switching to synth myself. Mobile1 or Royal Purple. For us "dino-users" Lucas Oil has some very good "suppliments" IMHO. I have used it in old engines and liked the results. My main goal is to make my 220k v6 last a while longer, another year or three, untill I can have it rebuilt.

On the K&N discussions, I have one in my 4Runner, but am really thinking of changing it out. It would be interesting to see what happens with performance/mileage having never run a paper filter in this rig. I'll report back what happens in a while.

The aftermarket companies are taking over responsibility for the factory warranty on these vehicles??? Wow. I can't imagine these warranties are very long.

K&N is a bit slippery in my opinion on the "will not void warranty" claim. They hang their hat on the fact that it's illegal for a manufacturer to require the use of a specific brand of air filter. They interpret that to say a manufacturer can't simply void a warranty just because a non-OEM product has been installed. But in the real world, should your car have problems caused by poor air filtration, you'll have a heck of a time getting it fixed under warranty if you bring your car in with a K&N installed. So ultimately a K&N will affect your warranty.

Has anyone heard of a PRE-LUBER? I truly believe that this will protect the engine & prolong the lifespan. It's an oil pump that is connected to the drain pan and circulates oil throughout the engine before you start up the engine. It is activated w/a push button. A client of mine has it on his Dodge Cummins Turbo Diesel. I'm planning on getting it even though I always use synthetic (Mobil1).

ANY synthetic is far better (in many ways, explained below) then petroleum based oil, and overkill if you change it at petroleum based intervals. Therefore whichever brand you feel more comfortable with is better then ANY petroleum based oil.

Some interesting information about choosing motor oil;

Choosing the right oil - The oil companies provides “typical inspection data” to there distributors, and you get it from either. This data contains the actual physical and the common chemical properties of the oil. The most important properties to considering oil are, viscosity, viscosity index, flash point, pour point, percentage of sulfated ash, and percentage of zinc.

Grade/weight of oil – Viscosity (flowability) is how to measure the shear strength of a thin layer of oil. A bearing works by using a thin layer of oil not by the oil pressure generated by the pump. If you use too high a weight oil the layer will not form fully or may not get into the bearing at all. If you use too low a weight the layer will not give the bearing the proper protection. Bottom line, make sure you stay within the manufactures recommended ranges.

Multi viscosity oil is created by adding polymers (chemicals) to a base 5W, 10W, 20W. Think of a 20W – 50W as a 20 weight oil that will not thin more than a 50 weight when hot. Keep the weight range as narrow as possible. Polymers are prone to viscosity and thermal breakdown.

Viscosity Index – The Number indicating the rate of change in viscosity within a given temperature range. The higher the number, the lower the change. The higher the number the better. Important for bearings. Approx. range 110 to 210

Flash Point – Temperature oil gives vapors that can ignite. The higher the flash point the better. Approx. range 350 to 510

Pour Point – 5 degrees F above the point chilled oil will not move in testing. The lower the pour point the better.
Approx. range -80 to -10

Percentage of Sulfated Ash – How much solid material is left when the oil burns. The lower the better. Approx. range .5 to 2

Percentage of Zinc - Amount of zinc used as an extreme pressure, anti-wear additive. Zinc should be used when metal makes contact with metal. This should not occur. I try to stay away from any additives . High zinc content can cause deposits and plug fouling. If used in oil .11 would be the minimum effective percentage.

The pure synthetic oil is far superior to petroleum due to much higher temp. oxidation resistance, high film strength, very low tendency to form deposits, stable viscosity base, and low temp. flow rate. I recommend Amsoil and Mobil 1, testing and their data has proved to be among the best. I personally change the oil in my cars at 10K miles, 5K on my motorcycle, or 1 year, whichever comes first.

I have seen oil analysis reports on used synthetic oil with over 20K miles that show more protection left in it then petroleum based oil with 2K mile. The only problem is contamination. The longer the oil is used the more contaminants (combustion byproducts). These contaminants mix with moisture and create harmful acids. After reviewing this data I have come to the conclusion that one year is the point that i feel comfortable with leaving synthetic oil in a engine.

If your going to change your oil every 2 to 3K miles don't waste your money on synthetic oil. If you are going to keep your vehicle till it falls apart (like Me) I recommend using pure synthetic after your first change and following the manufactures recommended change intervals until the warranty runs out, then change it once a year or 10K miles whichever comes first.

By the way - You can mix synthetic and petroleum oil and can go back to either oil with no ill effects, Toyota's recommendation about not going back to petroleum oil really makes me wonder about all their recommendations.

Koz

Great information Koz! What's your opinion on bypass filters and pre-lubers?