01-24-2019, 09:21 AM
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#1
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: South Central PA
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Location: South Central PA
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4th to 5th Generation - Looking for Information
Hi Everyone -
Long time member, frequently stalking but rarely posting.
We have resigned to the fact that we are ready to upgrade (?) from our 2005 T4R Sport Edition V8 to a current 5th Generation. We have our sights set on a T4R Off Road (coming in at just under $40,000 MSRP). However, as educated as we feel we have become on the current-generation, we have a few questions that we cannot seem to get answered from the dealer salesman.
We certainly realize the obvious items that are no longer standard (roof rack cross bars) or are no longer available (locking fuel filler lid, auto-closing lift gate) but one of the most desirable features for our current 2005 T4R is the Decent Assist Control. It appears available on the SR5, but not as obvious in the Off Road. Is the functionality of DAC built INTO the Multi-Terrain Select and Crawl Control? How exceptional is the CRAWL control? Coming from a V8 w/ the locking center diff, we have never gotten stuck. We do not hard-core off road, but we do like the look of the Off Road better than the SR5.
Additionally, we would be curious what discounts/dealer price reduction others are getting on the current-gen T4R. Of course the SR5 is more common than the Off Road and therefore we would expect the dealers to move LESS on the Off Road. Our initial (sole) negotiation with the selling dealer regarding the Off Road resulted in a ~ 10% reduction from MSRP. This reduction was independent of our trade-in, just coming off the sticker. Is this reduction on par with other people's purchase experience, or is there more room?
We really dislike the new vehicle purchasing process - especially with a vehicle we love so very much. However, we do want to part ways with our T4R before repairs become major. We have been waiting to see the next-generation but every year seems to continue with the current 5th generation.
Thanks in advance for all of the replies and information - hopefully we can post some pics of our new T4R soon.
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Matt
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2005 T4R Sport Edition V8
2016 Honda Accord Sport 6MT
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01-24-2019, 09:46 AM
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#2
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Member
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Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: IL
Age: 37
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Real Name: Ben
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Member
Join Date: Dec 2013
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All 4x4 models have DAC.
I see this phrase more and more "I really dislike the new vehicle purchasing process"
Buying a new vehicle is almost a game. I have purchased regrettably, over 15 new vehicles while mostly all for myself a few were for family members. 6 were from the same salesman. The discount depends on many factors from both parties mood and attitudes to what particular vehicle you're buying. In theory they can say MSRP or walk. The discount you got for walking in isn't bad perhaps nicely negotiating a few hundred more off wouldn't hurt.
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01-24-2019, 10:12 AM
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#3
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Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Louisiana
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Real Name: Micah
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No V8. You probably are aware of this, but 4G drivers comment on this frequently. The 5G isn't a pig, but she's not equipped with a V8.
Get to know KDSS (and not). If you're coming off XREAS in your 4G then you will want to know the good and bad of each option. There is a lot to say about that.
The Torsen center diff (AWD) is only available in the LE.
Not sure there are any other operational differences (I assume you're aware the OR has the rear locker).
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01-24-2019, 11:02 AM
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#4
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Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Lake Geneva, WI
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Real Name: Insta: cadeandmollyadventures
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Member
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Lake Geneva, WI
Posts: 121
Real Name: Insta: cadeandmollyadventures
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We went from a 2006 SR5 4th gen to the 2015 Trail and the dealer never mentioned any "loyalty" credit. I think we negotiated the sticker down around 10% like you and then I got an extra $500 on the trade by haggling.
I agree, car buying is a pain because you can never get a straight answer from the (usually) slimy sales people. And don't even get me started on the extended warranty and other BS they throw at you along the way.
Aside from the usual annoyance of the buying experience, we have enjoyed the upgrade. You will definitely miss the V8 power, but there are a couple devices you can buy to reduce pedal lag. Also, don't bother buying Toyota crossbars, lots of reports of them being extremely flimsy. We just bit the bullet and bought a Thule rack system to carry our cargo box, canoes, etc.
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01-24-2019, 11:44 AM
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#5
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Dallas, TX
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When I first needed Decent Assist Control I couldn't find the button. I just used Crawl Control so I guess that is the equivalent in an OR but not 100% sure. 4-lo is usually good enough but on super steep slopes Crawl Control worked good.
For current prices, check out the "What did you pay for your 4Runner" topic.
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2017 Off-road Premium w KDSS, moon roof, sliding rear cargo deck,3" Toytech Boss lift, SPC upper control arms, Sonoran Steel High Articulation KDSS Trac/PanHard Bar, RCI sliders, RCI skid plates aluminum including gas tank, C4 Fab diff skid plate, SCS Ray 10 Wheels Matte Gray, 285/70R17 Hankook Dynapro AT2 RF11 E-load RWL, Cali Raised LED 3x2 fog-light pods, Lock'r Down EXxtreme console safe with electronic lock, Auto Heat Shield all windows, Raingler rear cargo net, Canvasback rear covers, LFD Off-Road cross bars aluminum, LFD Hybrid bumper, LFD wind fairing, LFD Hi-lift jack mounts, Goat Armor, Blackgate Custom KDSS spacers, Ironman 2.5 awning with quick release mounts, Ironman 12,000 lb synthetic line winch.
Last edited by mteolus; 01-24-2019 at 11:47 AM.
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01-24-2019, 11:46 AM
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#6
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Elite Member
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Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Pittsburgh
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Real Name: Chris
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Elite Member
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I traded in my 08 4th gen on my 17 SR5P and they did give me a "loyalty discount" I believe it was only a grand, but hey anything helps on a brand new 40K truck. And yes, DAC is standard on all 4Runners
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2017 Nautical Blue SR5 Premium - Black Emblems, AFE 76mm TB, AFE Momentum GT Intake, URD MAF Calibrator, Borla Touring Cat-Back Exhaust, VR ECU Tune, RCI Skid Plate, Morimoto MLED 2.0 Headlight Retrofit, Morimoto LED Fogs, Eagle Eye Smoked Black Tail Lights, FyreFlys LED Interior, Meso Puddle Lights, Tinted Mirror Turn Signals, Smoked Amber Raptor Lights, Odyssey 34 Battery, 32" LED Bar with Rago Hidden Brackets, Rago Molle Panels, Side Shooter LED Ditch Lights, sPod w/ PowerTray, Raceline Matte Bronze Wheels w/ Cooper Discoverer RTX, CaliRaised Rock Sliders, BajaRack Full Length Roof Rack, Kenwood DMX1057XR, Infinity Kappa Door Speakers and 3.5's in dash, JL 8w3v3 in JBL Enclosure, Husky Weather Beaters, Blackvue DR900S Dash Cams
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01-24-2019, 12:39 PM
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#7
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: South Central PA
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Member
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Interesting statements that DAC is on all T4R. I assume it is hidden within the CRAWL control. On the website, when comparing the SR5 to the OR, there is definite identification of the DAC on the SR5. We really like the XREAS until it came time to replace shocks/struts. When it failed, it FAILED. We ended going the 5100 route.
We miss the V8 on the test drive - to be sure.
Good to know about the cross bars. You want to talk about flimsy, I thought the cargo cover was going to break off in my hand when I first pulled it.
Thanks for the mention of the "What did you pay" thread - will look that one up. We are struggling to justify the slight premium of the OR to the SR5 - especially given that the SR5 may have more negotiation opportunity. We definitely like the look of the OR, but perhaps the exclusivity (in our area?) is keeping the price too high?
Aside from all of the niggling about the 5G T4R, we cannot find anything else on the market at this time that would satisfy us. We definitely welcome the owner input.
Thanks for all of the continued input.
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Matt
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2005 T4R Sport Edition V8
2016 Honda Accord Sport 6MT
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01-24-2019, 01:18 PM
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#8
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Real Name: KE0OIC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4-Legged-Runner
Interesting statements that DAC is on all T4R. I assume it is hidden within the CRAWL control. On the website, when comparing the SR5 to the OR, there is definite identification of the DAC on the SR5. We really like the XREAS until it came time to replace shocks/struts. When it failed, it FAILED. We ended going the 5100 route.
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Yeah, it's the crawl control. It'll "crawl" at whatever speed you set uphill or downhill.
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1988 4Runner 22re, 1992 4Runner SR5 3.slow, 1998 4Runner SR5 5VZ-FE
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01-24-2019, 01:29 PM
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#9
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Winnipeg, MB, Canada
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I'm a current owner of an '04 GX470 (same drivetrain as your 4th gen minus the vvti and power boost that came in '05), and a '15 4Runner Ltd.
The pedal calibration in the 4Runner made it feel like a dog, despite having a signifigant power and torque advantage on paper over the GX. I purchased a sprint booster for the 4Runner and it made a considerable difference, making the 4Runner feel like the spec sheet suggests it should, well worth the purchase price IMO. Totally changed the character of the 4Runner for the better. The power is there, you just have to work it really hard to access it in stock configuration.
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'93 Toyota LandCruiser VX Ltd 4.2TD - 3X e-lockers, winch, factory fridge, 285/75/16E Duratracs, ICON Stage 1 3" lift, GTurbo Grunter Extreme
'04 Lexus GX470 Ultra Premium - Dobinsons 2F/1R lift, Tandem 612's w/ 265/70/17 Wildpeaks, XD HID lows
'15 Lexus GX460 - FJC 6-spokes w/ 265/65/17C Duratracs Weathertech HP & Canvasback liners
'15 4Runner Limited - 1" Cornfed level, 255/75/17SL Duratracs on FJC 8-holes, XD HID lows, Sprint Booster, Canvasbacks & Husky Liners - SOLD
'96 Toyota Hilux Surf SSR-G 3.0TD RIP - 265/75/16C Duratracs, '99 tall fronts, OME 906's rear
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01-24-2019, 01:42 PM
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#10
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Dallas, TX
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You will hear arguments over whether the Crawl Control and Terrain Select are gimmicks or not (OR and Pro), but the OR and PRO does have a locking rear differential also that the SR5 doesn't have.
The OR only has the option of KDSS. I have it and like it, some don't though. KDSS will make cornering more level at higher speeds and at lower speeds (off road) will give you more articulation.
It's the TRD Pro that doesn't seem to have much if any negotiation leverage. The OR and SR5 does (not sure but probably Limited too). Looks like some people are getting 3 or 4 thousand off of the OR and maybe slightly more on an SR5. Not every dealership will give that so some like me have gone out of state.
The V6 power is adequate in my opinion on a stock 4Runner, it becomes less adequate when adding weight from modifications. I bet Jeep owners would say the same thing as the engines in both are similar in power and torque. I watched a YouTube video of a 4Runner racing a Wrangler and the result was dead even at a quarter mile.
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2017 Off-road Premium w KDSS, moon roof, sliding rear cargo deck,3" Toytech Boss lift, SPC upper control arms, Sonoran Steel High Articulation KDSS Trac/PanHard Bar, RCI sliders, RCI skid plates aluminum including gas tank, C4 Fab diff skid plate, SCS Ray 10 Wheels Matte Gray, 285/70R17 Hankook Dynapro AT2 RF11 E-load RWL, Cali Raised LED 3x2 fog-light pods, Lock'r Down EXxtreme console safe with electronic lock, Auto Heat Shield all windows, Raingler rear cargo net, Canvasback rear covers, LFD Off-Road cross bars aluminum, LFD Hybrid bumper, LFD wind fairing, LFD Hi-lift jack mounts, Goat Armor, Blackgate Custom KDSS spacers, Ironman 2.5 awning with quick release mounts, Ironman 12,000 lb synthetic line winch.
Last edited by mteolus; 01-24-2019 at 01:44 PM.
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01-24-2019, 02:08 PM
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#11
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Member
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Join Date: Dec 2013
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Real Name: Ben
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Member
Join Date: Dec 2013
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Did they make an offer on your old vehicle
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01-24-2019, 02:40 PM
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#12
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Location: Albany, Oregon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MossJenks
Yeah, it's the crawl control. It'll "crawl" at whatever speed you set uphill or downhill.
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Question: The Crawl uses the brakes to slow wheel speed. What happens if you also select the lowest gear? I've never touched the shifter with Crawl active.
Edit: I just realized we never get fast enough in Crawl to hit 2nd... so the new question is: Does Crawl also utilize engine braking?
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01-24-2019, 02:50 PM
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#13
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You use Crawl control when you put it in drive and just let it go forward. Toyota just adds brakes to maintain speed pretty easy system to add.
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01-24-2019, 03:19 PM
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#14
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Senior Member
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Location: North Bay, ON, Canada
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A few links to videos on Downhill Assist Control (DAC) on 5th Gen 4Runners:
YouTube
YouTube
YouTube
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2011 Limited 4WD with NAV: "CDN Package" (running boards, mud guards, all-weather mats, cargo liner, block heater).
Summer: Michelin Defender LTX 245/60R20 on OEM Limited 20" rims / Winter: Toyo Observe GSi-5 265/70R17 on 2018 TRD Off-Road 17" rims.
Previous: 2003 4Runner Limited 4WD V8; 1997 Lexus LS400; 1997 Camry CE; 1988 Celica Turbo 4WD; 1982 Celica GT
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01-24-2019, 04:25 PM
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#15
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Senior Member
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bossman
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There is no DAC button on my 2017 ORP. I think my buddies 2014 Trail has it. Perhaps this was changed in 2017.
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2017 Off-road Premium w KDSS, moon roof, sliding rear cargo deck,3" Toytech Boss lift, SPC upper control arms, Sonoran Steel High Articulation KDSS Trac/PanHard Bar, RCI sliders, RCI skid plates aluminum including gas tank, C4 Fab diff skid plate, SCS Ray 10 Wheels Matte Gray, 285/70R17 Hankook Dynapro AT2 RF11 E-load RWL, Cali Raised LED 3x2 fog-light pods, Lock'r Down EXxtreme console safe with electronic lock, Auto Heat Shield all windows, Raingler rear cargo net, Canvasback rear covers, LFD Off-Road cross bars aluminum, LFD Hybrid bumper, LFD wind fairing, LFD Hi-lift jack mounts, Goat Armor, Blackgate Custom KDSS spacers, Ironman 2.5 awning with quick release mounts, Ironman 12,000 lb synthetic line winch.
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