Wasn't referring to your post specifically regarding the hate, more of a general observation. Similar to all of the people who complain that the 4R doesn't have enough power.

My KO2s have about 8000 miles on them; I installed them on the 4R 2 days after I bought it at 118 miles. And yes, I realize they're better when new than when worn; I had these tires on my Tacoma twice. Admittedly, they're not as good as dedicated snow tires, but compared to the other ATs I've tried (Toyo OC AT2, Cooper ST, previous gen KO) they do as good of a job as can be expected in various conditions. Someone expecting dedicated mud tire or snow tire performance from the KO2 will be left disappointed, but with realistic expectations and careful driving, they more than get the job done IMO.

I already stated my dislike for the BFG's. Either way, a good driver can compensate for almost any awful tire. How much tread depth left on the BFG? New tires of any sort can make all the difference in the world. It is my understanding, that even at 50% tread you now have tires with less silica in the outside of the tread than they had new, and performance is severely degraded.

I'm not arguing tires or your particular driving abilities here anyway, I'm saying the T4R really is not a bad winter vehicle. I did it for a while with stock dunlops. I survived.

I live in Fairbanks, Alaska where winter is 6 months. Subzero temps... ice and snow everywhere. Roads are permafrosted. Nothing beats dedicated winter tires and is practical here, but I stick with my kumho at51s all year and they do fine. Of course, with slowing down on noticeably slick roads. I’ve had to drive 30-40 mph on the highway when they were bad.


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I had my first real snow driving in my '16 Limited this week. About 100 miles of driving snow covered roads on the 395 from Bishop CA to Nevada each way. CHP was making everyone chain up, but just waved me through.

Incredible traction with the Yoko Geolander H/Ts and the full time 4WD. Up and down steep grades and in white out conditions. Passed an endless parade of Jeep Wranglers and German luxury SUVs.

I agree driving skill and common sense helps! Back in the day used to navigate these same streets with rear wheel drive beaters with about bald tires. Still survived, lol
The KO2s I had were brand new, actually tried a 2nd set thinking I had lemons.

This has been my experience as well- and I absolutely love driving on them in the snow and ice! I’m about to hit 120,000 miles and the geolanders feel sure-footed even when it’s pretty deep, and driving up to VT through “stay at home unless it’s an emergency warnings” is a regular occurrence

I don’t live in the snowiest part of America but we do get big snow falls in nyc I have to say it comes down to tire choice and experience period
My friend used ice race in Canada and Niagara’s in an Audi 5000 and winning big he was also my mechanic because he was a wiz on my Porsche 944 turbo which was my only car for 3 years as a goof he mounted snow tires and adjusted other things I have to say my car was a total snow cat only 6in or more of snow stopped it I would fly up and down with most people looking at me and saying wtf miss that fun little car
Mike

I agree that the truck is quite capable with the stock tires ( Bridgestone Duellers in my case ) but they were quite sketchy with understeer and braking on snow covered roads (packed). I sourced another set of OEM rims for winter #3 now and went with the Michelins. We got a decent amount in our parts overnight and the difference was night and day obviously. And now I have an excuse to touch up my calipers yearly with some fresh paint too. The Michelins are vault quiet on the highway as well, very impressed. They get my vote.

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I live in wNY right in the middle of the lake effect snow belt. 110" of snow is average here. I put on around 35K miles per year here with alot of those miles back country, last to be salted/plowed, roads.

Just put my new 19 ORP through its paces during some icing yesterday morning and I was wildly disappointed. I'm solely lumping this into the tire category - ABS engaged at very low speeds coming to a stop. 4WD is nice, but the stopping part felt like a spin of the roulette wheel (pun intended).

I'm familiar with snow/ice, and a variety of vehicle sizes in those conditions. this thing is by far the worst "out of the gate" experience I've had. My F150 does better with lesser quality tires; my Escape has generics (beater vehicle) and it stops.

I'm going to be looking into a set of winter tires today. I was hoping this stock tires would be manageable in the winter for at least a season.

my completely stock 2019 TRD ORP with stock tires has been great in the snow in Denver so far. I'm shocked, really. It's better in snow on stock all seasons than my 3rd gen was with snow tires. might be the weight?

Maybe the traction and stability control?

Maybe it was just super slick. Surface conditions can vary wildly in the winter. Sometimes it can be icy and just be sorta slick, and sometimes it can be icy and super super slick.

First season with my trd off road. It's been below zero here in Winnipeg for about a month but only intermittent with snow on the roads. Does well in wet or packed snow. On sheets of ice I'm a little nervous braking - was expecting the general grabber atx's to have a little more bite. I am not, however, convinced this is much worse than my civic with worn winter tires was. I won't have final thoughts until we get deeper into winter and some more experience.

The TCS and stability control is aggressive and reassuring. I might even wish it was a little less aggressive. It is very fun to disable both and slide around on purpose. She certainly takes when in 4H. I am currently pleased with the situation and don't see myself buying winter tires. The majority of the winter here is between -10 and -25c. In those conditions the roads are not as slippery even if packed snow/ice.

I agree on advice to augment expectations. Heavy vehicle with part time 4wd. If I wanted absolute control at all times I would have gotten a Subaru and would not be having as much fun.

It was definitely icy, but at 10MPH, I did the "look left and right" because I am going through this stop sign. Caught me off guard. Then it happened a second time, missing a turn as the vehicle wouldn't stop in time.

I'm placing blame on the tires at this point. It wasn't me because I was redundantly cautious - first time in snow in brand new vehicle so I was being very conservative. Handling wise she does well. It's the stopping part that is worrisome.

Drove up to Yosemite this past Thanksgiving week and was really pleased with how the 4R with AT3Ws performed in the snow. Lots of snow and ice.