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Old 11-06-2019, 05:46 PM #16
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Originally Posted by matoolie View Post
Can you self jump, i.e. connect the two batteries together if needed? Other than using jumper cables.
If you want, I guess you could switch positions on the distribution block to jump one to the other but there is no need since it is impossible to drain the main battery.
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Old 11-06-2019, 11:35 PM #17
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Redarc 25 is what I run on my truck with a Odyssey 34 for the accessories. Stock battery sees 13.9 while accessory battery see 14.4. Haven't had any issues yet. DC to DC is the way to go.
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Old 11-07-2019, 07:32 PM #18
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Originally Posted by duffdog View Post
If you want, I guess you could switch positions on the distribution block to jump one to the other but there is no need since it is impossible to drain the main battery.
Understood but there is always a need. If the main battery takes a dump make sure you can use the aux. battery to start the vehicle and get you back to civilization and a new main. Which sounds like you can by switching leads or carrying jumper cables. Had my main battery take a dump overnight where it dropped cells and resulting voltage was only 6v. I self jumped with aux battery to get truck started and buy new main.
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Old 01-14-2020, 10:31 PM #19
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Originally Posted by Xtremluck View Post
So I built my dual battery setup just about 1.5 years ago. Which consists of two AGM batteries connected via a National Luna Intelligent solenoid. It has been working really well with close to 60 days of camping under its belt. Details on the build are here:
Dual Battery Setup (5th Gen Toyota 4runner) - Google Docs

I've recently noticed that my secondary battery hasn't been holding a charge sitting at around 12.2 volts after charging from the alternator for three hours. My battery isolator also will disconnect the batteries when the engine is running if I turn on all my off-road lights at the same time at night while traversing trails. I think some of this may be related to battery degradation especially since our alternator's charging voltage isnt ideal for AGM.

I dont have the ability to charge both batteries via shore power unfortunately. So I'm trying to find a solution. It would seem that ripping out the current solenoid system for an intelligent DC-DC charger would make the most sense but one of my requirements is the ability to link the batteries to winch or jump start the vehicle. With a DC-DC charger this would not be possible.

I know there are other folks here who have similar setups. What have you been doing? Augmenting with solar? Moving back to lead acid?
You can link/jump your batteries with a DC/DC charger. I have it on my rig. Here's the Redarc wiring guide.

BCDC Dual with Jump-Start - The New Ultimate Dual Battery Setup | REDARC Electronics
Attached Images
Dual Battery Setup 1.5 Years In (AGM Woes)-screen-shot-2020-01-14-6-19-17-pm-jpg 
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Old 01-14-2020, 10:53 PM #20
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Originally Posted by Xtremluck View Post
So I built my dual battery setup just about 1.5 years ago. Which consists of two AGM batteries connected via a National Luna Intelligent solenoid. It has been working really well with close to 60 days of camping under its belt. Details on the build are here:
Dual Battery Setup (5th Gen Toyota 4runner) - Google Docs

I've recently noticed that my secondary battery hasn't been holding a charge sitting at around 12.2 volts after charging from the alternator for three hours. My battery isolator also will disconnect the batteries when the engine is running if I turn on all my off-road lights at the same time at night while traversing trails. I think some of this may be related to battery degradation especially since our alternator's charging voltage isnt ideal for AGM.

I dont have the ability to charge both batteries via shore power unfortunately. So I'm trying to find a solution. It would seem that ripping out the current solenoid system for an intelligent DC-DC charger would make the most sense but one of my requirements is the ability to link the batteries to winch or jump start the vehicle. With a DC-DC charger this would not be possible.

I know there are other folks here who have similar setups. What have you been doing? Augmenting with solar? Moving back to lead acid?
I'm running 2 Odyssey batteries connected via a Blue Sea ACR. My batteries can charge via Alternator, Shorepower (CTEK hardwired) and I have a 100w solar panel on the roof rack.

I absolutely love this system, I haven't turned my ARB fridge off in over 2 years and my Victron battery monitor is at 100% almost full time even if sitting parked. If camping I do have 2 100w panels that I'll rig up to my 4R via the rear Anderson plug that powers my turtleback trailer when attached.

If you search my username I did a pretty detailed write up somewhere along the way on how I wired everything up.
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Old 01-15-2020, 02:39 PM #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ruff4runner View Post
You can link/jump your batteries with a DC/DC charger. I have it on my rig. Here's the Redarc wiring guide.

BCDC Dual with Jump-Start - The New Ultimate Dual Battery Setup | REDARC Electronics
Based on that diagram, the REDARC has nothing to do with jumping.

You are just using a solenoid to temporally put both batteries in parallel, bypassing the REDARC completely.

This could be applied to any system regardless of a ACR or DC-DC charger.
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Old 01-15-2020, 04:29 PM #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ruff4runner View Post
You can link/jump your batteries with a DC/DC charger. I have it on my rig. Here's the Redarc wiring guide.

BCDC Dual with Jump-Start - The New Ultimate Dual Battery Setup | REDARC Electronics
This is the setup I will be starting to build late Feb. I am leaving the solenoid jump-start until later. The solar and DC/DC will be going in with group 34. You can also carry a lithium starter pack as a fail-safe. I mainly want the parallel running for winching. Don't intend to fit a winch until next year though.
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Old 01-15-2020, 04:39 PM #23
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Originally Posted by SnoRnR View Post
This is the setup I will be starting to build late Feb. I am leaving the solenoid jump-start until later. The solar and DC/DC will be going in with group 34. You can also carry a lithium starter pack as a fail-safe. I mainly want the parallel running for winching. Don't intend to fit a winch until next year though.
How are you putting both in parallel for the winch load?

I actually went to a triple battery setup... I still have a traditional ACR based system with two regular starters, and then use a DC-DC and a smaller battery for the small accessory loads like the fridge.

Also, you could consider separates from Victron Energy instead of REDARC. I think they have a better overall system.

DC-DC
Orion-Tr Smart DC-DC Charger Isolated - Victron Energy

MPPT Solar Charge Controller which is substantially nicer than the integral one in the REDARC. Phone application, bluetooth connected.
SmartSolar MPPT 75/10, 75/15, 100/15 & 100/20 - Victron Energy

Both are programmable voltages so you can match it to any type of battery you want, including lithium.

Victron makes really good gear... been using them for years in my custom builds.

Here is a good case study when looking at solar and self recovery from a flat battery.
PROBLEM WITH REDARC DC to DC
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Old 01-15-2020, 04:46 PM #24
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Based on that diagram, the REDARC has nothing to do with jumping.

You are just using a solenoid to temporally put both batteries in parallel, bypassing the REDARC completely.

This could be applied to any system regardless of a ACR or DC-DC charger.
Agreed. Simply using jumper cables to connect the two batteries for emergency starting when needed just as effective and cheaper than the additional fuses, wiring, and solenoid.
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Old 01-15-2020, 05:13 PM #25
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Originally Posted by matoolie View Post
Agreed. Simply using jumper cables to connect the two batteries for emergency starting when needed just as effective and cheaper than the additional fuses, wiring, and solenoid.
If you consider most people would be carrying around a set of jumper cables anyways, I find little reason to wiring up an entire bypass circuit for the off chance you do need to self-jump. It adds cost and complexity for something you really shouldnít even need.

The entire point of these dual battery systems is to prevent starting issues in addition to having more capacity for accessory loads.

If you are constantly running your starter flat, you designed your system incorrectly. I have yet to actually need to jump start myself, but I have helped others which is why I still carry cables.

On a side note: There is a reason ACRs like the BlueSea ACR SI-Series have a low voltage lockout protection. If the voltage is too low, internal short as an example, then you might end up with two dead batteries forcing them in parallel. If you killed your starter in the dual battery system, it would be best to investigate if you are on the trail where you canít get quick help.
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Old 01-15-2020, 05:53 PM #26
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If you consider most people would be carrying around a set of jumper cables anyways, I find little reason to wiring up an entire bypass circuit for the off chance you do need to self-jump. It adds cost and complexity for something you really shouldnít even need.

The entire point of these dual battery systems is to prevent starting issues in addition to having more capacity for accessory loads.

If you are constantly running your starter flat, you designed your system incorrectly. I have yet to actually need to jump start myself, but I have helped others which is why I still carry cables.

On a side note: There is a reason ACRs like the BlueSea ACR SI-Series have a low voltage lockout protection. If the voltage is too low, internal short as an example, then you might end up with two dead batteries forcing them in parallel. If you killed your starter in the dual battery system, it would be best to investigate if you are on the trail where you canít get quick help.
Yep. A proper dual system should prevent drain, but you have to be prepared for when a starter battery suddenly takes a dump. I woke up one morning with my truck completely dead. The starter battery was only at 6v. It had dropped cells overnight. I was able to start the truck with auxiliary battery. In my opinion not having that capability when you have two batteries is not smart. And it can be done with typical solenoid dual systems or jumper cables. Just make sure you have the capability.
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Old 01-15-2020, 09:12 PM #27
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Based on that diagram, the REDARC has nothing to do with jumping.

You are just using a solenoid to temporally put both batteries in parallel, bypassing the REDARC completely.

This could be applied to any system regardless of a ACR or DC-DC charger.
Thats right, The Redarc has nothing to do with the jump/linking of the batteries, but as @Xtremluck implied there are some that think it will damage the Redarc if the batteries are linked temporarily.
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Old 01-15-2020, 09:36 PM #28
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Originally Posted by ruff4runner View Post
Thats right, The Redarc has nothing to do with the jump/linking of the batteries, but as @Xtremluck implied there are some that think it will damage the Redarc if the batteries are linked temporarily.
Yes, bypassing the REDARC would not harm it in any way.

Perhaps I misunderstood your postÖ I though you implied the REDARC is doing the jumping.
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Old 01-15-2020, 09:43 PM #29
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Originally Posted by matoolie View Post
Yep. A proper dual system should prevent drain, but you have to be prepared for when a starter battery suddenly takes a dump. I woke up one morning with my truck completely dead. The starter battery was only at 6v. It had dropped cells overnight. I was able to start the truck with auxiliary battery. In my opinion not having that capability when you have two batteries is not smart. And it can be done with typical solenoid dual systems or jumper cables. Just make sure you have the capability.
There are some OEM loads that can help run down the starter…. Leaving doors open, lights on, radio on.

I do use my stereo often when camping and because of that moved the main power feed for the head unit to the AUX battery side. It is more work but it was part of my design to ensure that there isn’t anything that I can really do under normal operating conditions that would leave me without power to start the truck.

If you find you use a lot of OEM loads and are unable to re-wire those circuits, then you should consider:

Adding a low voltage disconnect to the starter side
Adding solar to charge the starter to provide supplemental charge
Adding a basic DC-DC converter to charge from AUX to Starter to help supplement those loads.
Use a BlueSea BatterLink ACR which allows you to lower the disconnect voltage, essentially creating a bigger battery as both stay in parallel longer.


Here is a link to a basic DC-DC which would work very well for this.

For $65 bucks, you can have this on a switch to provide 9 amps of charge current from the AUX to the starter. It’s got a remote port so you don’t have to worry about any relays or high current switching.

Victron Energy Orion-Tr 12/12-9A (110W) Isolated DC-DC converter
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Old 01-15-2020, 10:27 PM #30
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There are some OEM loads that can help run down the starterÖ. Leaving doors open, lights on, radio on.

I do use my stereo often when camping and because of that moved the main power feed for the head unit to the AUX battery side. It is more work but it was part of my design to ensure that there isnít anything that I can really do under normal operating conditions that would leave me without power to start the truck.

If you find you use a lot of OEM loads and are unable to re-wire those circuits, then you should consider:

Adding a low voltage disconnect to the starter side
Adding solar to charge the starter to provide supplemental charge
Adding a basic DC-DC converter to charge from AUX to Starter to help supplement those loads.
Use a BlueSea BatterLink ACR which allows you to lower the disconnect voltage, essentially creating a bigger battery as both stay in parallel longer.


Here is a link to a basic DC-DC which would work very well for this.

For $65 bucks, you can have this on a switch to provide 9 amps of charge current from the AUX to the starter. Itís got a remote port so you donít have to worry about any relays or high current switching.

Victron Energy Orion-Tr 12/12-9A (110W) Isolated DC-DC converter
I think you are missing my point.....my starter battery died with nothing on. Parked in my garage. Cells inside the battery went bad. The battery simply crapped out. Nothing related to loads. This sometimes happens to batteries. And if it happens in the middle of nowhere you want to make sure you have a way to start the truck with auxiliary. And I am happy with my setup and it suits all my needs.
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2nd battery = http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-ge...-complete.html
Rock lights = http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-ge...ne-safely.html
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