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Old 02-06-2020, 06:46 PM #76
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You are probably correct, just regular 4x4 no AWD. C&D needs to be more careful about printing such things.

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Old 02-06-2020, 07:11 PM #77
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Old 02-06-2020, 07:36 PM #78
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Clearly it says "SR5" and not "Trail". Look at those wheels. Trail/TRDOR wheels in a different silver shade.

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Old 02-06-2020, 07:50 PM #79
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The cement looks so damn good
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Old 02-06-2020, 08:50 PM #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drewsro View Post
These are Four Wheel Drive, not AWD bud. Here is the quote from the article:

"and are available with either rear- or four-wheel drive."

SR5's are 4x4.
Do the SR5's have a rotary knob to engage 4wd (that looks similar to Limited)? My '14 Trail has the lever. Maybe that's where the AWD/4X4 confusion comes from?
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Old 02-06-2020, 09:38 PM #81
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Originally Posted by Mikey2020 View Post
I think he meant Grand Cherokee. I considered it before pulling the trigger on the 4runner. They are really nice, roughly the same size, and have good off road chops. but I hear many people have catostrophic transmission failures early. When I was test driving at one dealership, I saw three in the repair lot with "transmission dead, will not move" written on the windshield.

That scared me off
Yeah, I figured that's what he meant. I'm not familiar with the differences between the two. I wonder if those transmission failures are on ones with the hot motor. Too much power for the transmission? Drag racing?
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Old 02-06-2020, 09:51 PM #82
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Sweet, now the poor hipsters can look like the rich hipsters in pro's.
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Old 02-06-2020, 10:30 PM #83
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Sweet, now the poor hipsters can look like the rich hipsters in pro's.
LMAO and I'm sure it's pissing off all the Pro bro's
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Old 02-06-2020, 10:38 PM #84
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Sounds like you're looking for a Range Rover Sport? I know JLR absolutely sucks in the reliability department, but RR's are quite capable off-road, and their on road manners are nothing to sneeze at regarding performance.
FWIW, my 2017 4Runner was in the shop about once a month for the 20K miles I owned it (from new) for a variety of issues: strong steering wheel wobble, alignment issues, rear right shock exploding, A/C blower motor loudly vibrating, remote start not working, and one other thing I can't remember.

My 2017 Range Rover Sport has 40K miles on it now, (~25k from me), and has never been to the shop for non-standard maintenance (every 16K miles). It has a SC V8 with 510hp, does 0-60 in 5 seconds, gets about 15mpg city and 19-21mpg highway (both better than my 4Runner) despite having 275/55R20 KO2s, has a big 27.5 gallon fuel tank, and is great off-road. It should do all of those things though considering it was nearly twice the price.

Pretty sure I had a lemon 4Runner and have had the opposite of a lemon RRS, but it's a data point to consider. Most Range Rover issues nowadays are related to the dual-screen infotainment system (freezing, non-responsive, etc. until the vehicle is restarted).

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Old 02-06-2020, 10:57 PM #85
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My post this morning was my initial reaction after paying sticker to get the "exclusive" AG on our 2020 Pro, which we got first week of October after waiting six months for it to come in. Then I read into this more and realized this is a limited run of 4,000 units across four colors, so maybe 1,000-1,500 extra AGs running around. That's fine, and the Pro is definitely different than the SR5. Looking at what is offered on the new "Trail", (gray TRD Off road wheels, AWD dial from Limited, roof rack, some black trim on grill, rear cargo tray, and a cooler), I'd still have gone with the Pro hands down though I wonder if I can buy an AG cooler separately...
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Old 02-06-2020, 11:02 PM #86
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It might not sound like it, but I really do agree with you. The 4Runner and the new Tacoma aren't well sorted vehicles in the engine/transmission/gearing department. They need some modernizing and I don't know why Toyota is sitting on their hands for so damn long. The 4.0 and 5AT was pretty great in 2002 when it first hit the show room floors. The 2010 update was pretty nice at the time too.

But here we are now another decade later and you can buy a turbo I6 diesel Tahoe that gets 30mpg and a Rav4 that has 302hp and gets 40mpg. And Toyota's answer for a new version of the 4Runner is painting an SR5 gray and putting a cooler in the back?!? And making a very confusing naming convention. That's just not good enough anymore.
What really bugs me about the 4Runner and esp the Taco is that they are geared high, with a transmission that wants to keep it at the lowest possible RPM (+/- 2K), yet the engines make barely any power in that rpm range. HP/TQ peaks are well over 4k rpm. It's a very mis-matched combo. I saw a dyno chart not too long ago, and at 2k rpm the 4.0 is making about 150h[/150tq. No wonder why it can't pull a modest grade without dropping 2 gears to maintain speed.

Some people have no problem revving the 4R past 4k every time, but that's not my driving style. All of the other vehicles I've owned have had good low end, I'm used to being able to drive with a light foot and let the vehicle shift at 2,500rpm. What makes it worse is how terrible the 4.0 sounds over 3k rpm. Sounds like a blender full of ball bearings.


Back on topic, I wished they'd picked a different name that "Trail". That's almost as bad as Chevy naming their new crossover the "Blazer".

And I'd be pissed if I just bought a new Army green PRO just for the color.
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Old 02-06-2020, 11:11 PM #87
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As an SR5 owner, I'm smitten with how Toyota was able to troll both Pro and Trail owners in one fell swoop.

You know the Trail owners are saying "Awe shit, that sucks."

And the Pro owners are currently drafting strongly worded letters to Toyota Corporate in order to communicate their butt hurt.

Toyota will respond with something that in essence says "We give zero fvcks about your feelings. Go ahead and buy a Jeep, b!tch."

To which some will go out and buy Jeeps, but will inevitably come crawling back with their tail between their legs and Toyota will be right there waiting, like a drug dealer with the goods.

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Old 02-06-2020, 11:26 PM #88
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I do not necessarily disagree with your statement, especially your closing comment. I do however think that the Cherokee is a substitute for the 4Runner while the Wrangler may be less so. While I believe it is now built on a car body the Cherokee line certainly represents an alternative to the 4Runner especially for those who might consider 2WD 4Runner. In any event, the entrance of the Bronco in the market will certainly impact everyone in the market space if the hype and apparent anticipation in the market extends into robust sales.
I think you mean GRAND Cherokee? It's always been a unibody, btw. It's not necessarily a "car body", in the way a RAV4 is basically an AWD Corolla.

I THINK the current WK2 Grand Cherokee is based on the same platform as the previous gen Mercedes MClass SUV. It's a holdover from when M-B owned Chrysler.

I think the earlier Grands were more of a competitor to the 4R, The first two generations of Grands had solid front axles, and could easily be built to be trail beasts. The current gen has lost some capability by having 4 wheel independent suspension, and all models below the Limited come standard with a single speed t-case, you need to get at least a LTD to get low range.

IMO the fact that they're unibody is immaterial to me. I think for this class of vehicle having a full frame is overrated, it's not like it gives a large towing capacity on the 4Runner, and on a Toyota it's just one more thing to rust out.

A unibody Grand Cherokee can come with a 5.7 V8 and tow up to 7200 lbs, so in towing and power it easily outclasses the 4R. The potential trade-off is reliability and resale.

I had a 97 Grand Cherokee, btw. Had the straight six and was very reliable for the 12 years and 165k that I owned it.
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Old 02-06-2020, 11:33 PM #89
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Can this thread just stay on topic? lol
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Old 02-06-2020, 11:46 PM #90
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... I'd still have gone with the Pro hands down though I wonder if I can buy an AG cooler separately...
I'm guessing a Kong cooler is way better than what is sure to be an overpriced Toyota cooler. I have a couple of Kong coolers, and they are awesome. Made in the US, lifetime guarantee, and hand over fist better than Yeti -- KONG Coolers - Coolers
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