10-30-2021, 07:11 PM
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#16
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Some people aren't gonna want to hear this, but there are actually some really great products that are made in.....CHINA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RysiuM
I just look at them and say: you have not the absolute slightest idea what you are talking about. This is 4Runner.
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'15 Trail Premium, GOBI Stealth, CVT Summit Awning, ARB Safari Snorkel, TRD Pro susp. w/Bilstein 6112 coils & 1" spacer (front) & OME 895 (rear), 285/70/17 BFG KO2, Spidertrax wheel spacers, TRD Pro package (wheels, grill, valences, & skid), full RCI aluminum skids, C4 Fab diff skid, Toytec bump stop extensions, plenty of lights, patches, stickers, and other miscellaneous mods (backup & front camera, accessory meter display, rear window/hatch, bumper cup holders, Wit's End fire extinguisher mount, Ellis Precision TRD shift lever)
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10-30-2021, 07:16 PM
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#17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamalani Mahie
Some people aren't gonna want to hear this, but there are actually some really great products that are made in.....CHINA
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there really are. it doesnt make it moral or ethical though. but anyways
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2016 TE : Grocery Getter, 34/10.5R17 Toyo at3, Prinsu Rack, King Coilovers, DuroBumps, ToyTec HD 2.0 springs, King shocks, King hydro bumps, Total Chaos mounts, DirtKing Fabrication UCA, VIVID RACING Tune, URD Y pipe, RCI skids, Marlin Crawler gussets, DRKDSS everything
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10-30-2021, 08:40 PM
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#18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Too Stroked
Good points. Let me address them.
First of all, I don't ever assume that anything made overseas is a knock off. But I spent 36 years in manufacturing for a large US based company and I spend enough time in China to be dangerous. Generally speaking, Chinese contract manufacturers have no issue with copying technology or products. They have no respect for patents or intellectual property and the court system there backs them up. They even stole our technology and knocked off the products they made for us. Even after all that, I don't simply assume. The sad truth is that this stuff happens more often than anybody thinks. BTW, if you read that TW post, you'll see details on how the Lasfit product is a knock off.
As for owning Diode Dynamics and Lasfit products, I actually do thank you. The 4 9soon to be 8) DD pods on my T4R have been stellar performers. The Lasfit 7440 LED bulbs in the same vehicle, not so much.
We all have the right to express our opinions - at least for now. I respect yours and I hope you respect mine.
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I guess we will have to agree to disagree. Since you clearly stated your reasoning/opinion, i guess so will I.
I do want to point out that you state you don't assume that products made overseas are knockoffs, but then you literally start your next argument with "generally speaking.." and go on to make disparaging remarks on the chinese industry as a whole. IP theft is not regional specific to China. It is a global problem that countries may or may not enforce due to how the geo-political winds blow. Also to stay on topic, we are talking about 3 inch LED cubes, not your perception of the quality or value of chinese made products in general.
As previously mentioned i've read that rant thread on TW, and this is my conclusion:
That thread literally proved NOTHING is the same between DD and LASFIT, and concluded that LASFIT must have tried to make a clone but failed so they made a inferior clone, which is a stretch (its called moving the goal posts when you're evidence doesn't support your argument).
The lenses use the same number of "fins" but the lenses are NOT interchangeable and produce a DIFFERENT light pattern, is far from confirming that lasfit made a clone. It is actually easier to conclude that they are NOT clones.
I did a patent search on TIR technology, and guess what i found as of todays date? Take a good guess.
So current use of TIR technology that both lasfit and DD does not mean they are copies of each other, considering that technology is used in MULTIPLE industries, and in multiple applications and no patents have been issued by the patent office as of today's date to diode dynamics or lasfit in regards to TIR tech in 3 inch cubes.
We also don't know how diode dynamics or lasfit is sourcing their components or what agreements they have on file with their sources in regards to their technology.
Light output is not the same
Light pattern is not the same
Physical dimensions are not the same (brackets, attachment points, and pods)
Physical construction is not the same (nothing is interchangeable)
Electrical/wiring is not the same (pigtail vs non-pigtail)
A cube is a cube (thats where the similarities start and end).
Since you want to throw your background experience into this. I'll tell you mine: I was voted most likely to succeed by my classmates in the 2nd grade.... You probably wondering what does this have anything to do with a discussion about 3 inch cubes made by LASFIT? It doesn't, just like your background has nothing to do with this discussion about 3 inch LED cubes made by LASFIT.
If you want to spread BS on a company, feel free to make your own thread about it. However, if you feel the need to crap in my thread, prepare to get a rebuttal.
cheers!!
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2016 trail 4runner, twin locked on 34's.
Can read more of my build here (2 parts):
https://www.lasfit.com/blogs/news/ho...ad-build-part1
Last edited by mrblah; 10-31-2021 at 06:22 AM.
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10-30-2021, 09:49 PM
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#19
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So i'm not trying to call anyone out with the following matter, but i want to clarify my stance as a whole, since I'm not in the mood to continue getting drawn into a political debate.
Yeah, i don't like companies that steal IP.
For instance, I won't run certain wheels/rims, that are considered clones, nor would i recommend them. However, I dont trash those companies or the people who run them, because I have never owned them. I have no authority to make a comment due to not actually owning it, or physically having it in my possession. I'm also not stupid enough to rely and repost someone else's experiences because it is hearsay and unverifiable, and can easily be misconstrued as my own experience. I also think its disingenuous and designed to mislead.
The problem i have is this statement and how the poster used a thread on TW to try and prove it: "blatant chinese reverse engineered knockoffs" because thats a pretty broad and highly negative accusation even when DD is not the originator of the 3 inch cubed pod light....so I guess DD products are also "blatant USA reverse engineered knockoffs" of more well known, more premium LED manufacturers... Well, the TW thread just cleverly and conveniently ignore that fact...lol.
I think i've done my best to try to debunked the other posters arguments and the TW thread in general in my previous post, so I don't think i need to reiterate my arguments.
If the poster said, "i tried the cubes and they sucked"... I would not have a problem with it.
However, I'm so tired of people accusing a company of making a "clone" but they don't define what is a "clone", and have nothing from their own experience to support it. I wouldn't exactly call links to other forum posts made by other strangers verifiable evidence, nor does it validate any statement as factual.
If the sole reason to call something a clone is due to the country of origin, i'm going to call BS on that one.
If it uses interchangeable parts (replica) or it uses someone else's IP and patents on file (clone), and sold in the country where its violating the patents or IP or knowingly trying to represent itself as another product in which it is not...then yeah that is a clone/replica/trash/etc.
LOL if we are going to define the lasfit product as a clone based on "looks" then the DD product is also a "clone", because neither companies originated the 3 inch LED cube light. It reminds me of the saying "like the pot calling the kettle black."
Lastly, my response is not to defend products made overseas, my goal was to debunk a flawed argument.
CHEERS!!!
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2016 trail 4runner, twin locked on 34's.
Can read more of my build here (2 parts):
https://www.lasfit.com/blogs/news/ho...ad-build-part1
Last edited by mrblah; 10-31-2021 at 06:17 AM.
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10-31-2021, 01:23 AM
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#20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblah
So i'm not trying to call anyone out with the following matter, but i want to clarify my stance as a whole, since I'm not in the mood to continue getting drawn into a political debate.
Yeah, i don't like companies that steal IP.
For instance, I won't run certain wheels/rims, that are considered clones, nor would i recommend them. However, I dont trash those companies or the people who run them, because I have never owned them. I have no authority to make a comment due to not actually owning it, or physically having it in my possession. I'm also not stupid enough to rely and repost someone else's experiences because it is hearsay and unverifiable, and can easily be misconstrued as my own experience. I also think its disingenuous and designed to mislead.
The problem i have is this statement and how the poster used a thread on TW to try and prove it: "blatant chinese reverse engineered knockoffs" because thats a pretty broad and highly negative accusation even when DD is not the originator of the 3 inch cubed pod light....so I guess DD products are also "blatant USA reverse engineered knockoffs" of more well known, more premium LED manufacturers... Well, the TW thread just cleverly and conveniently ignore that fact...lol.
I think i've done my best to try to debunked the other posters arguments and the TW thread in general in my previous post, so I don't think i need to reiterate my arguments.
If the poster said, "i tried the cubes and they sucked"... I would not have a problem with it.
However, I'm so tired of people accusing a company of making a "clone" but they don't define what is a "clone", and have nothing from their own experience to support it.
If the sole reason to call something a clone is due to the country of origin, i'm going to call BS on that one.
If it uses interchangeable parts (replica) or it uses someone else's IP and patents on file (clone), and sold in the country where its violating the patents or IP or knowingly trying to represent itself as another product in which it is not...then yeah that is a clone/replica/trash/etc.
LOL if we are going to define the lasfit product as a clone based on "looks" then the DD product is also a "clone", because neither companies originated the 3 inch LED cube light. It reminds me of the saying "like the pot calling the kettle black."
Lastly, my response is not to defend products made overseas, my goal was to debunk a flawed argument.
CHEERS!!!
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your kings are clones of my kings!!!!!
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2016 TE : Grocery Getter, 34/10.5R17 Toyo at3, Prinsu Rack, King Coilovers, DuroBumps, ToyTec HD 2.0 springs, King shocks, King hydro bumps, Total Chaos mounts, DirtKing Fabrication UCA, VIVID RACING Tune, URD Y pipe, RCI skids, Marlin Crawler gussets, DRKDSS everything
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10-31-2021, 01:55 AM
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#21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by honda250xtitan
your kings are clones of my kings!!!!!
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my hydrobumps are clones of your hydrobumps..... I cry myself to sleep at night knowing I bought a clone, but nobody will know that i'm not rocking the king bling blue..i just need a little bit of plastidip.. ;)
seriously man, everything i go to the shop, i gravitate to those king hydrobumps
__________________
2016 trail 4runner, twin locked on 34's.
Can read more of my build here (2 parts):
https://www.lasfit.com/blogs/news/ho...ad-build-part1
Last edited by mrblah; 10-31-2021 at 02:08 AM.
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10-31-2021, 09:21 AM
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#22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblah
I guess we will have to agree to disagree. Since you clearly stated your reasoning/opinion, i guess so will I.
I do want to point out that you state you don't assume that products made overseas are knockoffs, but then you literally start your next argument with "generally speaking.." and go on to make disparaging remarks on the chinese industry as a whole. IP theft is not regional specific to China. It is a global problem that countries may or may not enforce due to how the geo-political winds blow. Also to stay on topic, we are talking about 3 inch LED cubes, not your perception of the quality or value of chinese made products in general.
As previously mentioned i've read that rant thread on TW, and this is my conclusion:
That thread literally proved NOTHING is the same between DD and LASFIT, and concluded that LASFIT must have tried to make a clone but failed so they made a inferior clone, which is a stretch (its called moving the goal posts when you're evidence doesn't support your argument).
The lenses use the same number of "fins" but the lenses are NOT interchangeable and produce a DIFFERENT light pattern, is far from confirming that lasfit made a clone. It is actually easier to conclude that they are NOT clones.
I did a patent search on TIR technology, and guess what i found as of todays date? Take a good guess.
So current use of TIR technology that both lasfit and DD does not mean they are copies of each other, considering that technology is used in MULTIPLE industries, and in multiple applications and no patents have been issued by the patent office as of today's date to diode dynamics or lasfit in regards to TIR tech in 3 inch cubes.
We also don't know how diode dynamics or lasfit is sourcing their components or what agreements they have on file with their sources in regards to their technology.
Light output is not the same
Light pattern is not the same
Physical dimensions are not the same (brackets, attachment points, and pods)
Physical construction is not the same (nothing is interchangeable)
Electrical/wiring is not the same (pigtail vs non-pigtail)
A cube is a cube (thats where the similarities start and end).
Since you want to throw your background experience into this. I'll tell you mine: I was voted most likely to succeed by my classmates in the 2nd grade.... You probably wondering what does this have anything to do with a discussion about 3 inch cubes made by LASFIT? It doesn't, just like your background has nothing to do with this discussion about 3 inch LED cubes made by LASFIT.
If you want to spread BS on a company, feel free to make your own thread about it. However, if you feel the need to crap in my thread, prepare to get a rebuttal.
cheers!!
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Yes, we will - respectfully - agree to disagree.
As for me "bashing all Chinese made products," I did not. I was in fact pretty specific here. But, I've been to China - many times - and you have not. I've seen what goes on first hand and you have not. I've seen the reputations of great companies (including the one I worked for) destroyed by unscrupulous Chinese business practices defended by their government.
Are there well made products sourced in China? Absolutely. Unfortunately, there are a disturbingly large number of very poorly made products sourced there.
One final note. The thread I linked from TW was written by one of the leading experts in automotive lighting, yet you dismiss everything he said. Your qualifications?
Cheers, mike drop, over and out.
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10-31-2021, 05:52 PM
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#23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Too Stroked
Yes, we will - respectfully - agree to disagree.
As for me "bashing all Chinese made products," I did not. I was in fact pretty specific here. But, I've been to China - many times - and you have not. I've seen what goes on first hand and you have not. I've seen the reputations of great companies (including the one I worked for) destroyed by unscrupulous Chinese business practices defended by their government.
One final note. The thread I linked from TW was written by one of the leading experts in automotive lighting, yet you dismiss everything he said. Your qualifications?
Cheers, mike drop, over and out.
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Thank you for admitting you do have a motive as to why you like to bash chinese companies and get so butthurt over some 3 inch light cubes. None of your argument is specific to the LASFIT 3 inch cubes. You literally just bash the chinese in every post you make. If you want to continue your own anti-chinese rant, please start your own thread.
I've already debunked the rant thread on TW in previous posts in regards to Lasfit. Yet at the same time, you haven't done anything to substantiate those claims made in TW.
Again qualifications over the internet from random strangers don't mean crap. Just like your hatred of all things chinese don't make you an expert on chinese made products.
"mike drop, over and out"... Yes, You can have the final word. Please see your way out of my thread, and don't forget to grab your bags full of hate. I think you have made your point already that you don't like chinese made things.
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2016 trail 4runner, twin locked on 34's.
Can read more of my build here (2 parts):
https://www.lasfit.com/blogs/news/ho...ad-build-part1
Last edited by mrblah; 10-31-2021 at 06:18 PM.
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10-31-2021, 06:18 PM
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#24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblah
Thank you for admitting you do have a motive as to why you like to bash chinese companies and get so butthurt over some 3 inch light cubes.
I've already debunked the rant thread on TW in previous posts in regards to Lasfit. Yet at the same time, you haven't done anything to substantiate those claims made in TW, other than you think that thread is gospel, without doing any fact checking of your own.
Again qualifications over the internet from random strangers don't mean crap, unless of course you are one of those "armchair, internet experts". Just like your hatred of all things chinese don't make you an expert in anything relevant.
"mike drop, over and out"... Yes, You can have the final word. Please see your way out of my thread, and don't forget to grab your bags full of hate. I think you have made your point already that you don't like chinese made things.
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I see "respectful" went right out the window. As for the "armchair expert on TW," You might want to check out his qualifications. He's a renowned expert on automotive lighting. Just check out some of his instrumented testing. You have nothing on him except your opinions - with no instrumented testing to back them up.
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10-31-2021, 06:25 PM
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#25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Too Stroked
I see "respectful" went right out the window. As for the "armchair expert on TW," You might want to check out his qualifications. He's a renowned expert on automotive lighting. Just check out some of his instrumented testing. You have nothing on him except your opinions - with no instrumented testing to back them up.
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Dood, are you that dense. His own data on TW refutes what he says. His very own instrument tests show nothing matches. He even has to qualify his own conclusion or otherwise it will be easy to discredit.
His very own data and his conclusion:
LIGHT OUTPUT; doesn't match
LIGHT BEAM: doesn't match
Dimensions: doesn't match
Construction: doesn't match
Lens fins: matches but output and beam not the same.
Lens tech: both uses TIR technology
Conclusion: its must be an "inferior" clone, since the data doesn't match between the two products, he has to qualify his statement or his data wont support his conclusion.
Diode dynamics HOLD NO PATENTS on TIR technology. Go look it up yourself.
Diode dynamics HOLD NO PATENTS on 3 inch LED cube lights. GO look it up yourself.
Diode dynamics HOLD NO PATENTS on anything related to this product.
Diode Dynamics HOLD 1 patent on LED construction that isn't used in this application. Go look this up for yourself.
You are so full of hate on chinese made products that you can't even look at the data for yourself, so you just blindly believe whatever people tell you to believe.
FYI, i wasn't calling the guy on TW an internet armchair expert.. I was calling you out since you can't substantiate any of your claims. You just use emotional appeal and bias as the sole basis of supporting your argument. You literally discredit yourself.
Again this is the internet... everyone is an expert. If you try to qualify yourself, all you are doing is losing more credibility.
Seriously, stop shitting in my thread. I'm running out of toilet paper for you.
Go start your own thread, and cry elsewhere.
bye felicia ---- MIC DROP
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2016 trail 4runner, twin locked on 34's.
Can read more of my build here (2 parts):
https://www.lasfit.com/blogs/news/ho...ad-build-part1
Last edited by mrblah; 10-31-2021 at 07:25 PM.
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11-03-2021, 12:30 AM
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#26
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2011 Starfire Pearl GX460 stock base ;)
2012 Blizzard Pearl SR5 | 285 Toyo OC AT3 | Level 8 Slam | YotaWerx ActiveDuty | Die Hard AGM w/ArcLightLeds V2 Booster | Borla 40665 | URD Y & MAF Cal TRD | C4 Center LP | Maxbore 2mm TB "loaner from my boy Dave" | X20 10k Factor55 | Shrockworks Armory | RCI LCA skids | TC Gusset | LFD Offroad 7/8 | TJM Airtec dry aFe HPS coupler w/TRD CAI tube | B8 6112 | 650# King | ICON Delta Joint | Fox 2.0 VS| SAW 1.5" |230k|
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11-03-2021, 12:52 AM
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#27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Akkording
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2016 trail 4runner, twin locked on 34's.
Can read more of my build here (2 parts):
https://www.lasfit.com/blogs/news/ho...ad-build-part1
Last edited by mrblah; 11-03-2021 at 12:55 AM.
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11-03-2021, 12:55 AM
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#28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblah
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__________________
2011 Starfire Pearl GX460 stock base ;)
2012 Blizzard Pearl SR5 | 285 Toyo OC AT3 | Level 8 Slam | YotaWerx ActiveDuty | Die Hard AGM w/ArcLightLeds V2 Booster | Borla 40665 | URD Y & MAF Cal TRD | C4 Center LP | Maxbore 2mm TB "loaner from my boy Dave" | X20 10k Factor55 | Shrockworks Armory | RCI LCA skids | TC Gusset | LFD Offroad 7/8 | TJM Airtec dry aFe HPS coupler w/TRD CAI tube | B8 6112 | 650# King | ICON Delta Joint | Fox 2.0 VS| SAW 1.5" |230k|
| 03 DCSB Tacoma OME equipped, +320k Still Truckin |
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11-03-2021, 01:07 AM
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#29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Akkording
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Lol.
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2016 trail 4runner, twin locked on 34's.
Can read more of my build here (2 parts):
https://www.lasfit.com/blogs/news/ho...ad-build-part1
Last edited by mrblah; 11-03-2021 at 01:15 AM.
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11-03-2021, 01:18 AM
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#30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblah
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__________________
2011 Starfire Pearl GX460 stock base ;)
2012 Blizzard Pearl SR5 | 285 Toyo OC AT3 | Level 8 Slam | YotaWerx ActiveDuty | Die Hard AGM w/ArcLightLeds V2 Booster | Borla 40665 | URD Y & MAF Cal TRD | C4 Center LP | Maxbore 2mm TB "loaner from my boy Dave" | X20 10k Factor55 | Shrockworks Armory | RCI LCA skids | TC Gusset | LFD Offroad 7/8 | TJM Airtec dry aFe HPS coupler w/TRD CAI tube | B8 6112 | 650# King | ICON Delta Joint | Fox 2.0 VS| SAW 1.5" |230k|
| 03 DCSB Tacoma OME equipped, +320k Still Truckin |
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