12-07-2021, 01:44 AM
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#16
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Location: Fruita, CO
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Sorry, but you're never going to get a decent alignment (caster wise) with stock UCAs with 2.5" increase in ride height. If you're lucky and get the best alignment guy in the world who really wants to waste his day, you might get something like 2.3.
With OEM style (including Bilstein) shocks, you can remove the top nut with the springs compressed by the vehicle weight, so there is no need to mess with spring compressors.
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12-07-2021, 01:52 AM
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#17
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Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: Virginia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeremy556
Sorry, but you're never going to get a decent alignment (caster wise) with stock UCAs with 2.5" increase in ride height. If you're lucky and get the best alignment guy in the world who really wants to waste his day, you might get something like 2.3.
With OEM style (including Bilstein) shocks, you can remove the top nut with the springs compressed by the vehicle weight, so there is no need to mess with spring compressors.
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I realize I’m not going to get caster where I need it, but I’m hoping to do better than where I’m at.
I was thinking about what would happen if I remove the top nut with the vehicle down the other day. Any chance you can elaborate on this method? Does it go back together just as easily?
Edit: never mind. I found the write ups on this. Thanks for the suggestion.
Last edited by woodsby; 12-07-2021 at 02:04 AM.
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12-07-2021, 02:19 AM
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#18
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Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Fruita, CO
Age: 43
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Senior Member
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Age: 43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woodsby
I realize I’m not going to get caster where I need it, but I’m hoping to do better than where I’m at.
I was thinking about what would happen if I remove the top nut with the vehicle down the other day. Any chance you can elaborate on this method? Does it go back together just as easily?
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Lift vehicle from under the front LCA, then remove the top nut from the hole in the coilover mount in the frame, the vehicle is compressing the spring. You can then lower the jack to uncompress the spring very safely and easily. Reassemble the same way. I'm sure there are plenty of good how tos on youtube, it's fundamentally the same setup as 2003+ 4runner, all FJC, and 2005+ Tacomas.
I've got a very expensive spring compressor to safely deal with 700inlb King/Icon/Fox/Saw/etc coilovers, but for the stock design with a top nut, the vehicle is the best tool by far.
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12-08-2021, 05:02 PM
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#19
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Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: Virginia
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Following up on this - my alignment was a bust. The tech was either lazy or inexperienced. Fortunately, I got a recommendation from Scott@hightech for another tech in the area.
That said, I happened to be standing next to the truck when my wife opened the door to grab something from inside. When she shut the door, I saw that the rocking side to side seems to be coming from the tires (275/60r20 Toyo AT3).
The vehicle wasn't rocking relative to the wheels - meaning the distance/angle between vehicle/fenders and rims wasn't changing. The vehicle and wheels were rocking relative to the ground. I'm wondering if my tires are overinflated... maybe causing them to bounce side to side a bit.
I'll have to air them down slightly when I get time and see if that helps a little bit.
Of course I’ll still have to deal with the slower rocking I’m experiencing when I hit larger dips and humps in the road. I’m guessing/hoping stiffer springs will help with that.
Last edited by woodsby; 12-08-2021 at 05:11 PM.
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12-08-2021, 10:13 PM
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#20
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Join Date: May 2021
Location: Greenville, SC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woodsby
Following up on this - my alignment was a bust. The tech was either lazy or inexperienced. Fortunately, I got a recommendation from Scott@hightech for another tech in the area.
That said, I happened to be standing next to the truck when my wife opened the door to grab something from inside. When she shut the door, I saw that the rocking side to side seems to be coming from the tires (275/60r20 Toyo AT3).
The vehicle wasn't rocking relative to the wheels - meaning the distance/angle between vehicle/fenders and rims wasn't changing. The vehicle and wheels were rocking relative to the ground. I'm wondering if my tires are overinflated... maybe causing them to bounce side to side a bit.
I'll have to air them down slightly when I get time and see if that helps a little bit.
Of course I’ll still have to deal with the slower rocking I’m experiencing when I hit larger dips and humps in the road. I’m guessing/hoping stiffer springs will help with that.
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That is an interesting observation. If it is the tire pressure, keep in mind that an increase in pressure will result in and increased spring rate and a smaller deflection per force and higher natural frequency. The inverse is true, lower pressure = lower spring rate, larger deflection per force, and lower natural frequency.
So, you may actually need to increase pressure in your tires... hard to say just based on your text description.
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12-09-2021, 11:19 AM
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#21
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did you torque the front end components in the air? the UCA and LCA bushings will bind. They need to be torqued with the weight of the vehicle on the ground. That can also cause bouncing like its a spring issue.
I've also seen a proper alignment help everything settle. This is stuff i've learned from wrenching on a titan back in the day, but its the same style front end.
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2016 TE : Grocery Getter, 34/10.5R17 Toyo at3, Prinsu Rack, King Coilovers, DuroBumps, ToyTec HD 2.0 springs, King shocks, King hydro bumps, Total Chaos mounts, DirtKing Fabrication UCA, VIVID RACING Tune, URD Y pipe, RCI skids, Marlin Crawler gussets, DRKDSS everything
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12-09-2021, 11:54 AM
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#22
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You know, I did not. I pulled the two bolts at the LCA on either side of the ball joint, loosened the cam bolts and gently dropped the LCA to pull the shocks/springs.
When complete, I jacked the LCA’s back up and put everything together and torqued - some weight on the suspension, but certainly not full vehicle weight.
I guess I should jack up the frame, loosen the bolts, retighten to wrench tight, then lower the vehicle to the ground and torque?
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12-22-2021, 06:09 PM
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#23
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So, to follow up on this, I have done:
Replaced rear OEM springs and 2” spacer with OME 2895E
Replaced rear OEM sway bar links with Skyjacker extended links; used energy poly bushings on the links
Replaced front OEM springs with OME 2884 and dropped the 5100 circlip to zero lift
Installed Dobinsons front sway bar relocation bracket
I had a 1/2 top out spacer on the fronts - I got rid of that.
Dropped/extended all bump stops (I know this is superficial for my problem)
On the short ride I just took, it’s a massive improvement. No more squishy bouncing. No more uncomfortable leaning into dips in the road.
Have an alignment and UCA replacement scheduled for tomorrow - hopefully that makes the highway wandering go away, and improves my camber as well. I’d have done the UCA myself, but the shop didn’t want much to change them and I don’t have a convenient second set of hands to work the long bolt out.
I’ll post back in a couple days. Thanks to all that have helped.
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12-22-2021, 06:15 PM
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#24
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So spacers are a no go for anyone thinking about trying them? Did you have X-REAS in place with the spacers?
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12-22-2021, 06:31 PM
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#25
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I did for a couple of days, and it certainly felt better with XREAS than with the 5100’s, but a couple of my coworkers commented that the truck looked like it was bouncing too much front to back, and that got into my head. And I read so many positive things about the 5100’s and some negative things about XREAS. In hindsight, XREAS is a good system, but inability to maintain the system kind of pisses me off.
I will say that preloading OEM springs definitely feels worse than stiffer lift springs. That said, I do keep a minimum of 200 lbs extra in the rear and about 70-80 lbs extra under the hood.
Also, keep in mind, to keep XREAS, I’m pretty sure you have to install a shock spacer in the rear as well. I used the Revtek kit cheap off Mercari, but that shock spacer looks cheesy.
Last edited by woodsby; 12-22-2021 at 09:44 PM.
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12-23-2021, 05:23 PM
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#26
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Following up... got my UCA's replaced and got a proper alignment today - camber and toe close to 0, and caster around 4.5. I'm happy to say I love driving this truck again. Looks great and rides great.
Just have to take a heat gun to the little mud flaps and put the skid plates back on.
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12-23-2021, 05:33 PM
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#27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woodsby
Following up... got my UCA's replaced and got a proper alignment today - camber and toe close to 0, and caster around 4.5. I'm happy to say I love driving this truck again. Looks great and rides great.
Just have to take a heat gun to the little mud flaps and put the skid plates back on.
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im glad you got this all resolved, now go out and enjoy that bad boy!!!
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Can read more of my build here (2 parts):
https://www.lasfit.com/blogs/news/ho...ad-build-part1
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12-23-2021, 08:00 PM
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#28
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reading this from the beginning I was thinking to myself that the XREAS trucks have to have a really soft spring considering how the shocks do a lot to control sway so the combo with 5100's and stock springs had to be interesting. I have eibachs and 5100's in mine with JBA arms and poly sway bar bushings. On 285/70/17's. It's no slot car but it handles FAR better than it should.
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12-23-2021, 08:10 PM
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#29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woodsby
Hi, just installed bilstein 5100’s set at 2.5 in the front and a 2” spacer in the back on my 2021 Limited. I kept the stock springs, and installed Toyo AT3’s 275/60R20 on the stock wheels. Now the car feels considerably bouncy both front to back and side to side. This isn’t a stiff bounce… it’s a soft rocking bounce. When I pull down on the roof rack to one side, it seems to rock side to side at least two times (two times noticeably plus some minor residual bounce). A couple of notes:
1. My caster in the front is low ~1.4 - scheduled for an alignment with a shop that knows an alignment is more than just getting the toe right (don’t ask).
2. My tire pressure was around 37 psi when I checked this AM. I’m guessing this is high for the larger tires, but again, the bounce feels soft, not stiff.
3. I have not yet installed extended rear sway bar links and poly bushings or the front sway bar relocation kit - still waiting on those. Still on factory sway bar end links/bushings in the rear.
4. Maybe this is normal - never lifted a vehicle before. Forgive my ignorance here.
Any thoughts on what the issue is? Sway bar, track bar, springs, something else? Most of what I read seems to indicate a stiffer ride after a lift.
I’ve noticed a couple of times the front end seems to sink a bit low if I’m going downhill and turning into a parking lot and hit a dip or bump as I turn in. One time I heard an unnerving clunk.
Any help is appreciated.
Edit: I’ll add that I have around 200 lbs of gear in the back, and an added battery under the hood on the passenger side along with a bunch of cabling. Although I never noticed this added weight with the stock tires/suspension.
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are your rear bilsteins long enough to accommodate the rear spacers.
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2016 TE : Grocery Getter, 34/10.5R17 Toyo at3, Prinsu Rack, King Coilovers, DuroBumps, ToyTec HD 2.0 springs, King shocks, King hydro bumps, Total Chaos mounts, DirtKing Fabrication UCA, VIVID RACING Tune, URD Y pipe, RCI skids, Marlin Crawler gussets, DRKDSS everything
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12-23-2021, 08:11 PM
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#30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woodsby
Following up... got my UCA's replaced and got a proper alignment today - camber and toe close to 0, and caster around 4.5. I'm happy to say I love driving this truck again. Looks great and rides great.
Just have to take a heat gun to the little mud flaps and put the skid plates back on.
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oh NVM. looks perfect!
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2016 TE : Grocery Getter, 34/10.5R17 Toyo at3, Prinsu Rack, King Coilovers, DuroBumps, ToyTec HD 2.0 springs, King shocks, King hydro bumps, Total Chaos mounts, DirtKing Fabrication UCA, VIVID RACING Tune, URD Y pipe, RCI skids, Marlin Crawler gussets, DRKDSS everything
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