01-05-2022, 04:06 PM
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#16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetboy
I believe there are some pre production ICON rear bypasses out in the world. Part of the Omega series like they do for the Slinky setup for Land Cruisers. I don't know how they perform. But they look the part at least.
The other outside the box thought would be to try a set of TRD Pro bypass fox shocks. Maybe they're fantastic. I don't know anyone who really uses a TRD Pro with the OEM suspension that pushes it really hard and I've never had the opportunity myeslf to try it with a TRD Pro fox suspension setup. But it could be great. Could be crappy. Just don't know. I'd bet they're at least decent given the resources Toyota has and the internal design being pretty good.
Along the lines of the TRD Pro 4R rear shocks - I don't know how the fit would be for a lifted 4R to use Tundra TRD Pro rear bypass shocks. I considered some take off Raptor rears, weight is actually pretty close, but they're way too long to even install. They're about 4 inches too long. Tundras are basically the same length as 4Runners though. So they might work as another alternative with firmer valving.
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Have a buddy with a GX install these, though it's not lifted. Did really well on our fast paced trip through Anza Borrego to Superstition OHV.
To the OP, in order to compare shocks that not listed as OEM direct fits, you just need to get the extended and collapsed lengths and it will tell you if it's the same or close. Being straight axle in the back, there's a 1:1 motion ratio so the travel number of the shock will be equal to the travel of the rear suspension. If you can find out the travel and/or extended and collapsed lengths then you can use these to shop for any bypass that fits within tolerance. Might need to extend your bumpstops if longer body shocks and possibly run limit straps if a non-OEM replacement shock as they're not meant to be your droop limiter and could be damaged internally if they were.
Last edited by dezertbomber; 01-05-2022 at 04:14 PM.
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01-11-2022, 01:32 AM
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#17
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Join Date: Oct 2015
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAST4R
The 8000 series is linear damping.
Why do you want progressive, which would suck on pavement? Also, don't assume that King is progressive. You need to call them and see what damping they actually use in their OEM replacement kits for 4Runner.
I guess they use linear and not progressive for this kit.
Also, it is totally an option to have 8100 rears with Fox front or King front.
I like Radflo and they are cheaper but I have also heard complaints that their quality is inconsistent.
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Good points. I've always been told that the kings and fox are progressive.
Ya just learned that the 8100s are linear because they are bypasses. Could be a very good option. Just watched the shock surplus video on the bilsteins. They seem pretty awesome. Should I be really saving for long travel?
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01-11-2022, 01:36 AM
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#18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by honda250xtitan
few guys have bypasses. I believe the issue is the tube layout for clearance. hit up DOM (DRkdss) on IG hes running them. Hydraulic bump stops are also a great add on for the rear. ICON has their in the spring setup, i'm running the total chaos mounts and the king threaded bumps on the outside of the frame rails. is bueno.
the back end on ours feels pretty dialed considering its stock pivots. Kings, Wheelers (toytec HD when were loaded up) King bumps. No bucking.
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I hit up drkdss hes a wealth of knowledge
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01-11-2022, 01:40 AM
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#19
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Join Date: Oct 2015
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetboy
I believe there are some pre production ICON rear bypasses out in the world. Part of the Omega series like they do for the Slinky setup for Land Cruisers. I don't know how they perform. But they look the part at least.
The other outside the box thought would be to try a set of TRD Pro bypass fox shocks. Maybe they're fantastic. I don't know anyone who really uses a TRD Pro with the OEM suspension that pushes it really hard and I've never had the opportunity myeslf to try it with a TRD Pro fox suspension setup. But it could be great. Could be crappy. Just don't know. I'd bet they're at least decent given the resources Toyota has and the internal design being pretty good.
Along the lines of the TRD Pro 4R rear shocks - I don't know how the fit would be for a lifted 4R to use Tundra TRD Pro rear bypass shocks. I considered some take off Raptor rears, weight is actually pretty close, but they're way too long to even install. They're about 4 inches too long. Tundras are basically the same length as 4Runners though. So they might work as another alternative with firmer valving.
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Very interesting. When the fox bypasses started coming on the trd pros I was really curious how they would perform. I've looks for people's thoughts but maybe not hard enough. I like the thought of the tundra rears that would be pretty cool to try out. I wonder if they are rebuild able and would take a tune.
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01-11-2022, 01:47 AM
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#20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dezertbomber
Have a buddy with a GX install these, though it's not lifted. Did really well on our fast paced trip through Anza Borrego to Superstition OHV.
To the OP, in order to compare shocks that not listed as OEM direct fits, you just need to get the extended and collapsed lengths and it will tell you if it's the same or close. Being straight axle in the back, there's a 1:1 motion ratio so the travel number of the shock will be equal to the travel of the rear suspension. If you can find out the travel and/or extended and collapsed lengths then you can use these to shop for any bypass that fits within tolerance. Might need to extend your bumpstops if longer body shocks and possibly run limit straps if a non-OEM replacement shock as they're not meant to be your droop limiter and could be damaged internally if they were.
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He installed the trd pros or the 8100s?
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01-11-2022, 09:55 AM
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#21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4runick
I hit up drkdss hes a wealth of knowledge
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Yes! He's a good guy!
__________________
2016 TE : Grocery Getter, 34/10.5R17 Toyo at3, Prinsu Rack, King Coilovers, DuroBumps, ToyTec HD 2.0 springs, King shocks, King hydro bumps, Total Chaos mounts, DirtKing Fabrication UCA, VIVID RACING Tune, URD Y pipe, RCI skids, Marlin Crawler gussets, DRKDSS everything
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01-11-2022, 02:40 PM
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#22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4runick
Good points. I've always been told that the kings and fox are progressive.
Ya just learned that the 8100s are linear because they are bypasses. Could be a very good option. Just watched the shock surplus video on the bilsteins. They seem pretty awesome. Should I be really saving for long travel?
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Talk about a huge question!
HondaTitan thinks so. I dunno.
It all depends on use. If HondaTitan wants to be the guinea pig on the 2", I would love to learn from him. I guess we are some of the few people who can use LT. And I can benefit from it on harder trails as well.
But I am very concerned with race style components in terms of maintenance, noise, and harshness until the 4Runner remains the do-it-all family wagon.
Maybe we get a Rivian in a few years and then...
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2018 TRD OP non-kdss, well armored, well used
(6112s/650lb at 1.25"-1.5" lift, 8100 rear with Bilstein B12 1.5" springs, Mickey Thompson ATZ P3 LTE 265 70 17, RCI set of front 3/16 skids, Shrockworks step sliders and 3/16 steel gas tank skid, C4Fab rear diff skid, Rockmen rear LCAs, Total Chaos rear LCA bracket skids, Diode Dynamics SS3 white fog lights).
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01-11-2022, 04:11 PM
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#23
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After a closer look, the tundra TRD pro wouldn't fit. The problem is the reservoir being hard mounted on the bottom. Tundra and taco use a lower mounting post that is lateral to the chassis and the 4runner is longitudinal. Basically they're 90* from each other. So the reservoir on the tundra shock would interfere with the lower rear control arms. I'm sure a solution could be fabricated but it's not worth the effort. They're not that much different from the 4runner OEM fox bypasses that will just bolt on.
There's just not that much travel to work with so having an inch or two of softer valving from a bypass might not do much more than a flutter stack would in a regular monotube or even a good valving set in a twin tube. Without a side by side test drive it's really hard to make even a subjective comparison. It's easy to get carried away with a lot of shiny hardware that doesn't translate to better performance.
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01-11-2022, 05:56 PM
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#24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4runick
He installed the trd pros or the 8100s?
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The TRD Pro Fox's with internal bypass.
And I would say yes to saving up for long travel if you like going faster in the 4R. Very worth it for higher speed driving.
To do long travel right, you're going to want to run:
- coilovers and a bypass up front
- air bumps all around
- califab's 3 link in the rear (see their black GX with long travel)
- fiberglass up front
- wheel spacers in the rear to reduce difference in width compared with the front's increase
- must run extended front cv axle shafts to retain functional 4WD
- if you'd want to keep sway bars they'd need modified end links, or go full custom, but that's $$$.
- most kits come with extended tie rod adjusters, but going with all new billet tie rods with heims is best for handling the harder, more frequent impacts.
- limit straps since shocks at this level aren't meant to be droop limiters
List goes on and on, but again doing right affords you some rad abilities and amazing experiences.
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01-11-2022, 10:27 PM
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#25
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Join Date: Oct 2015
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetboy
After a closer look, the tundra TRD pro wouldn't fit. The problem is the reservoir being hard mounted on the bottom. Tundra and taco use a lower mounting post that is lateral to the chassis and the 4runner is longitudinal. Basically they're 90* from each other. So the reservoir on the tundra shock would interfere with the lower rear control arms. I'm sure a solution could be fabricated but it's not worth the effort. They're not that much different from the 4runner OEM fox bypasses that will just bolt on.
There's just not that much travel to work with so having an inch or two of softer valving from a bypass might not do much more than a flutter stack would in a regular monotube or even a good valving set in a twin tube. Without a side by side test drive it's really hard to make even a subjective comparison. It's easy to get carried away with a lot of shiny hardware that doesn't translate to better performance.
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Bummer also seems like they are sometimes hard to come by. I was reading they are rebuild able though and could take a tune. That's pretty cool stuff.
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01-11-2022, 10:31 PM
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#26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dezertbomber
The TRD Pro Fox's with internal bypass.
And I would say yes to saving up for long travel if you like going faster in the 4R. Very worth it for higher speed driving.
To do long travel right, you're going to want to run:
- coilovers and a bypass up front
- air bumps all around
- califab's 3 link in the rear (see their black GX with long travel)
- fiberglass up front
- wheel spacers in the rear to reduce difference in width compared with the front's increase
- must run extended front cv axle shafts to retain functional 4WD
- if you'd want to keep sway bars they'd need modified end links, or go full custom, but that's $$$.
- most kits come with extended tie rod adjusters, but going with all new billet tie rods with heims is best for handling the harder, more frequent impacts.
- limit straps since shocks at this level aren't meant to be droop limiters
List goes on and on, but again doing right affords you some rad abilities and amazing experiences.
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Ya that seems like a serious investment.
I think maximizing a mid travel setup might be the best way to go and keep it fun. Perhaps do some bypasses in the rear and adding some hydro bumps all the way around would be good. Also might look into the stock length lowers and possibly squeezing a bypass in there for extra damping.
I've noticed the state rangers at ocotillo can bomb around everywhere at pretty good speed with just a mid travel setup. Those cars have to run all winter long. Wondering if it's just an aggressive tune.
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01-11-2022, 10:34 PM
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#27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAST4R
Talk about a huge question!
HondaTitan thinks so. I dunno.
It all depends on use. If HondaTitan wants to be the guinea pig on the 2", I would love to learn from him. I guess we are some of the few people who can use LT. And I can benefit from it on harder trails as well.
But I am very concerned with race style components in terms of maintenance, noise, and harshness until the 4Runner remains the do-it-all family wagon.
Maybe we get a Rivian in a few years and then...
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Ya I don't want all the maintenance of long travel. I think I'll stay in my lane ha. I think maximizing mid travel might be fun.
Camburg just came out with a long travel kit that utilizes oem performance shocks but it's still $4k and some fab work.
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01-12-2022, 12:55 AM
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#28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4runick
Ya that seems like a serious investment.
I think maximizing a mid travel setup might be the best way to go and keep it fun. Perhaps do some bypasses in the rear and adding some hydro bumps all the way around would be good. Also might look into the stock length lowers and possibly squeezing a bypass in there for extra damping.
I've noticed the state rangers at ocotillo can bomb around everywhere at pretty good speed with just a mid travel setup. Those cars have to run all winter long. Wondering if it's just an aggressive tune.
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I bomb pretty hard with my simple setup of 6112's w/650lb spring, Dirt King UCA's, Ironman 4x4 HD rear 2" springs, Ironman FCP's (had 5160's but they're too lightly valved for the HD springs), and Durobumps all around.
With actual performance shocks all around tuned right and air bumps, you could prob be just fine out there. Won't be trophy truckin' through the big stuff, but there's plenty of desert out there without 3ft whoops.
Do you ever go to Superstition? There's a section that goes from the train track road to pole line that is a ton of fun and good for mid travel trucks.
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01-12-2022, 09:58 AM
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#29
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Join Date: Feb 2016
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4runick
Ya I don't want all the maintenance of long travel. I think I'll stay in my lane ha. I think maximizing mid travel might be fun.
Camburg just came out with a long travel kit that utilizes oem performance shocks but it's still $4k and some fab work.
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theyre working on the kits for KDSS as well from what it sounds like. Whats cool is you can upgrade to it whenever. instead of dropping 10k all at once. spend 3k on the front end, later on add the camburg kit. i'm hoping to buy it this year at some point.
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2016 TE : Grocery Getter, 34/10.5R17 Toyo at3, Prinsu Rack, King Coilovers, DuroBumps, ToyTec HD 2.0 springs, King shocks, King hydro bumps, Total Chaos mounts, DirtKing Fabrication UCA, VIVID RACING Tune, URD Y pipe, RCI skids, Marlin Crawler gussets, DRKDSS everything
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01-12-2022, 09:59 AM
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#30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dezertbomber
I bomb pretty hard with my simple setup of 6112's w/650lb spring, Dirt King UCA's, Ironman 4x4 HD rear 2" springs, Ironman FCP's (had 5160's but they're too lightly valved for the HD springs), and Durobumps all around.
With actual performance shocks all around tuned right and air bumps, you could prob be just fine out there. Won't be trophy truckin' through the big stuff, but there's plenty of desert out there without 3ft whoops.
Do you ever go to Superstition? There's a section that goes from the train track road to pole line that is a ton of fun and good for mid travel trucks.
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this x2....we kept up with stock raptors. at no point were we the ones holding the group back except on the highway lol. I'm sure they had a nice plush drive and we were mobbing but still.
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2016 TE : Grocery Getter, 34/10.5R17 Toyo at3, Prinsu Rack, King Coilovers, DuroBumps, ToyTec HD 2.0 springs, King shocks, King hydro bumps, Total Chaos mounts, DirtKing Fabrication UCA, VIVID RACING Tune, URD Y pipe, RCI skids, Marlin Crawler gussets, DRKDSS everything
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