User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 06-07-2022, 06:34 AM #16
Mark Linkous Mark Linkous is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Redwood Curtain
Posts: 67
Mark Linkous is on a distinguished road
Mark Linkous Mark Linkous is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Redwood Curtain
Posts: 67
Mark Linkous is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by ovmiowa View Post
Hi all, Our local Toyota dealer quoted me $10,000 to fix the KDSS system on my 2010 4R Trail, with 220K miles. The KDSS light comes on now and then, and they said it was very rusty (salty upper Midwest roads) and leaking slightly from the unit. The $10K is to replace the unit and all four lines. Does this sound right to you? Many thanks for sharing your insights!!
How bad is the rest of the frame? It really is a bummer how 5Gís are so susceptible to rust and if l lived in the rust belt, I would not own one.

It really might be time to beat it on down the line as even a $3-$4000 repair would be tough to swallow if the rest of the frame is rusting badly as well.
Mark Linkous is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-07-2022, 09:11 AM #17
Pedro367 Pedro367 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: Denville, NJ
Posts: 643
Pedro367 is a glorious beacon of light Pedro367 is a glorious beacon of light Pedro367 is a glorious beacon of light Pedro367 is a glorious beacon of light Pedro367 is a glorious beacon of light
Pedro367 Pedro367 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: Denville, NJ
Posts: 643
Pedro367 is a glorious beacon of light Pedro367 is a glorious beacon of light Pedro367 is a glorious beacon of light Pedro367 is a glorious beacon of light Pedro367 is a glorious beacon of light
$10k is absolute insanity. KDSS is really nothing high tech and shouldn't be that hard to replace. Hell, it's a $1750 option from Toyota.

If it were me, I'd just buy new suspension for about $1000. I have a Dr. KDSS switch in mine with Fox 2.0 suspension. You can definitely feel the difference with it off, but it's certainly tolerable on the road. I'm sure it's still better than a stock SR5 or TRDOR without KDSS based on what everyone says about nose dive and body roll on them.
__________________
Pete - 2018 Silver TRDORP w/ KDSS. 2" Fox 2.0s and 285/70r17 Maxxis Razr ATs
Pedro367 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-07-2022, 09:29 AM #18
Jetboy's Avatar
Jetboy Jetboy is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Utah
Posts: 4,715
Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute
Jetboy Jetboy is offline
Senior Member
Jetboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Utah
Posts: 4,715
Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute
Like everyone else has said, it shouldn't be that complicated to fix. And it shouldn't be that expensive. It's unlikely that it needs new lines. Unless stainless steel lines are rusting now. KDSS failures are very few and far between. I wish my fox suspension lasted as long as KDSS.

A complete control actuator/accumulator from a low mile GX 460 will run you about $5-600. Lexus GX460 Stabilizer Control Actuator w/ Accumulator 2010-2020 OEM | eBay

New ones are only about 1500.

The hardlines are stainless. Seems pretty unlikely that they are rusted.

I think you may need to find a new dealer.
Jetboy is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-07-2022, 12:46 PM #19
2021nightshade4x4 2021nightshade4x4 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Posts: 1,230
2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice
2021nightshade4x4 2021nightshade4x4 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Posts: 1,230
2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice
$10K KDSS Repair!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetboy View Post
Like everyone else has said, it shouldn't be that complicated to fix. And it shouldn't be that expensive. It's unlikely that it needs new lines. Unless stainless steel lines are rusting now. KDSS failures are very few and far between. I wish my fox suspension lasted as long as KDSS.

A complete control actuator/accumulator from a low mile GX 460 will run you about $5-600. Lexus GX460 Stabilizer Control Actuator w/ Accumulator 2010-2020 OEM | eBay

New ones are only about 1500.

The hardlines are stainless. Seems pretty unlikely that they are rusted.

I think you may need to find a new dealer.

If braided steel lines can fail on my water heater in 12 years (lines that do not flex daily, and are only subject to line pressures of 60 PSI) I imagine they can fail in automobiles a lot sooner. Rust was not even a factor. Pinholes in the underlying rubber.

For hard pipe, ask any plumber why do pipes leak in the middle where thereís not even a joint? Corrosion from the inside. No visible rust may be present upon observation. Iím thinking some sort of galvanic reaction?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Last edited by 2021nightshade4x4; 06-07-2022 at 12:54 PM.
2021nightshade4x4 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-07-2022, 12:57 PM #20
02SE 02SE is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Here, There..
Posts: 3,638
02SE is a splendid one to behold 02SE is a splendid one to behold 02SE is a splendid one to behold 02SE is a splendid one to behold 02SE is a splendid one to behold 02SE is a splendid one to behold 02SE is a splendid one to behold
02SE 02SE is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Here, There..
Posts: 3,638
02SE is a splendid one to behold 02SE is a splendid one to behold 02SE is a splendid one to behold 02SE is a splendid one to behold 02SE is a splendid one to behold 02SE is a splendid one to behold 02SE is a splendid one to behold
A 10k quote is that dealer basically saying that they don't know how to, or simply don't want to work on it.

A ridiculously high quote so you'll go away. In other words.

I worked at some places back in the day that used that tactic. That and other examples of poor customer service is why I walked away from consumer car repair, in disgust.

Good luck OP.
02SE is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-07-2022, 03:44 PM #21
Jetboy's Avatar
Jetboy Jetboy is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Utah
Posts: 4,715
Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute
Jetboy Jetboy is offline
Senior Member
Jetboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Utah
Posts: 4,715
Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute Jetboy has a reputation beyond repute
Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2021nightshade4x4 View Post
If braided steel lines can fail on my water heater in 12 years (lines that do not flex daily, and are only subject to line pressures of 60 PSI) I imagine they can fail in automobiles a lot sooner. Rust was not even a factor. Pinholes in the underlying rubber.

For hard pipe, ask any plumber why do pipes leak in the middle where thereís not even a joint? Corrosion from the inside. No visible rust may be present upon observation. Iím thinking some sort of galvanic reaction?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Kind of apples and oranges here. The lines on KDSS are pretty different from the lines on your water heater. They're closer to an oversized brake line. The soft line portion is short. Most of the KDSS line system is rigid stainless steel. Just like the brake lines. I wouldn't be surprised if it's all the same material just scaled up for the fluid volume KDSS requires. Brake lines can wear through, or fail for other reasons like metal fatigue from flexing. But it's pretty darn rare for that to happen. Replacing flexible brake hoses isn't a common maintenance item and they typically last for the life of the vehicle. KDSS lines should be the same way. And it seems to be for the vast majority of Land cruisers and 4Runners.

In the case of stainless steel and aluminum together, aluminum will be the anode so the aluminum will corrode, not the stainless. I suspect that's the case in the corrosion examples I've seen on KDSS systems. Add enough electrolyte and water and the aluminum will start to corrode.

Without seeing the actual problem it's pretty much impossible to tell what's going on in this case.

It would be nice if Toyota built an easy way to flush the fluid like they did on the LX570 AHC. I don't know that that helps a lot for longevity though. There are so few problems with KDSS or AHC that there's really no way to tell which one is more reliable.
Jetboy is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-07-2022, 03:47 PM #22
2021nightshade4x4 2021nightshade4x4 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Posts: 1,230
2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice
2021nightshade4x4 2021nightshade4x4 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Posts: 1,230
2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice 2021nightshade4x4 is just really nice
Can I interest you in an X-REAS system K KDSS Repair!!K KDSS Repair!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
2021nightshade4x4 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-07-2022, 03:55 PM #23
CutthroatSlam CutthroatSlam is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Last Great Place
Posts: 950
CutthroatSlam is a splendid one to behold CutthroatSlam is a splendid one to behold CutthroatSlam is a splendid one to behold CutthroatSlam is a splendid one to behold CutthroatSlam is a splendid one to behold CutthroatSlam is a splendid one to behold
CutthroatSlam CutthroatSlam is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Last Great Place
Posts: 950
CutthroatSlam is a splendid one to behold CutthroatSlam is a splendid one to behold CutthroatSlam is a splendid one to behold CutthroatSlam is a splendid one to behold CutthroatSlam is a splendid one to behold CutthroatSlam is a splendid one to behold
Quote:
Originally Posted by wcjeep View Post
We really like our Kdss. OP has 220k miles in the rust belt. Probably not many of the competition vehicles from 2010 still on the road in high salt use areas.
Just not seeing the cost/reward benefit. Downside risk of costly repairs. Upside is that corners with less body sway at 70 mph….err wrong vehicle for that use anyway.

Last edited by CutthroatSlam; 06-07-2022 at 10:20 PM.
CutthroatSlam is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-07-2022, 03:58 PM #24
chrisridebike8 chrisridebike8 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Hawaii
Posts: 58
chrisridebike8 will become famous soon enough
chrisridebike8 chrisridebike8 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Hawaii
Posts: 58
chrisridebike8 will become famous soon enough
for that price, I think I would look into an aftermarket setup like Currie Antirock. And I'm not sure if it works, but it looks like there are threaded holes up front where the non-KDSS sway bar would bolt up. And then you could maybe get someone to fab up the mounts for the rear sway bar. Just get rid of the system all together
__________________
2021 MGM 4Runner TRD Off Road, KDSS
Eibach | Falken | CaliRaised | Sherpa| Joe's | Rago | Odyssey | Redarc | Rigd | Waterport | Baja Designs | Diode Dynamics | MaxTrax | Level 8 | OVS | S-Tech | Dr. KDSS | ARB | JLT | Anzo
2010 Black/Black C63 AMG, 460 whp (I miss this car every day)
chrisridebike8 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-07-2022, 04:31 PM #25
bayaz bayaz is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 142
bayaz will become famous soon enough
bayaz bayaz is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 142
bayaz will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by ovmiowa View Post
Hi all, Our local Toyota dealer quoted me $10,000 to fix the KDSS system on my 2010 4R Trail, with 220K miles. The KDSS light comes on now and then, and they said it was very rusty (salty upper Midwest roads) and leaking slightly from the unit. The $10K is to replace the unit and all four lines. Does this sound right to you? Many thanks for sharing your insights!!
Spoke about KDSS wear and replacement at my local dealer in California. He said that once it fails it canít really be fixed but has to be replaced. Also, KDSS has finite life, so 220k miles is a good run. Dealer Said they just did it and it was about $4k, but could be more because itís very labor intensive (about $2k in parts and $2k in labor). A viable alternative he suggested is asking the dealer to remove KDSS. Itís cheaper and gives you more aftermarket options.
bayaz is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-07-2022, 10:19 PM #26
jasxn's Avatar
jasxn jasxn is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Marina del Rey
Posts: 446
jasxn will become famous soon enough jasxn will become famous soon enough
jasxn jasxn is offline
Member
jasxn's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Marina del Rey
Posts: 446
jasxn will become famous soon enough jasxn will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutthroatSlam View Post
Just not seeing the cost/reward benefit. Downside risk of cost repairs. Upside is it corners with less body sway at 70 mphÖ.err wrong vehicle for that use anyway.
lol i like to hit my corners hard. kdss gives me confidence lol.
but i've been in a 3rd gen with the sways pulled. omg it was the scariest experience. i swear i thought we were going to tip over all the time lol.
__________________
i got the stuff
jasxn is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-07-2022, 11:48 PM #27
BlackWorksInc's Avatar
BlackWorksInc BlackWorksInc is offline
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Bend, OR
Posts: 9,915
BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold
BlackWorksInc BlackWorksInc is offline
Elite Member
BlackWorksInc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Bend, OR
Posts: 9,915
BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold BlackWorksInc is a splendid one to behold
That seems a little excessive... when you say "unit" what are you referring to?

There's a cylinder front and rear, a central pump/valve assembly, and the lines in-between all of them. If your vehicle is as rusty as you say, it wouldn't surprise me if they've quoted every single bracket, bolt, retaining clip, etc. along with additional labor to Sawzall and torch things off. Still seems a bit high for all that, but I haven't priced out a KDSS system or looked into the labor for replacing the entire system.

One horribly rusty Sequoia I worked on needed a Sawzall and our oxy-acetylene torch to remove the old shocks, brake lines, and other bits (they spent way too much money on this thing when it should have been junked). Much of the brake system, power steering lines, and such including brackets were zip-tied to the frame or strapped because the frame had holes or was soft in spots.
BlackWorksInc is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-08-2022, 04:56 AM #28
RAVL 2016 RAVL 2016 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2021
Location: Washington DC metro
Posts: 27
RAVL 2016 is on a distinguished road
RAVL 2016 RAVL 2016 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2021
Location: Washington DC metro
Posts: 27
RAVL 2016 is on a distinguished road
There is always more to these stories.

What they are telling you with that price is they don’t want to do the work/. The truck is too rusty and they don’t want the headache associated with taking it apart and having problems for which they will be responsible. So instead of telling you that they give you a high price to send you somewhere else.

Unfortunately frame rust is an issue on all these trucks as they age/. Have some friends who live in Pittsburgh and the cars and trucks there last about 10 years max even with good care. Just too much continuous salt.
RAVL 2016 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-08-2022, 08:28 AM #29
ovmiowa ovmiowa is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: iowa
Posts: 3
ovmiowa is on a distinguished road
ovmiowa ovmiowa is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: iowa
Posts: 3
ovmiowa is on a distinguished road
Thanks everyone for your helpful replies. On a few people's advice, I took the vehicle to a Lexus dealer. The KDSS warning light turned off on the hour-long drive to the Lexus dealer. They found an older stored code C1851, "Low Pressure Malfunction in KDSS system". They believe the KDSS valve may have been stuck and worked its way free. So for now, I will wait and see what happens next. I do park my 4Runner on a non-level surface.
ovmiowa is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-08-2022, 08:38 AM #30
RobS10's Avatar
RobS10 RobS10 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 578
RobS10 has a spectacular aura about RobS10 has a spectacular aura about
RobS10 RobS10 is offline
Member
RobS10's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 578
RobS10 has a spectacular aura about RobS10 has a spectacular aura about
Quote:
Originally Posted by ovmiowa View Post
Thanks everyone for your helpful replies. On a few people's advice, I took the vehicle to a Lexus dealer. The KDSS warning light turned off on the hour-long drive to the Lexus dealer. They found an older stored code C1851, "Low Pressure Malfunction in KDSS system". They believe the KDSS valve may have been stuck and worked its way free. So for now, I will wait and see what happens next. I do park my 4Runner on a non-level surface.
Did the Lexus dealer give you an idea how much it would cost to fix had the valve stayed stuck, just to compare to the other estimate?
__________________
2022 Barcelona Red TRD ORP, KDSS, Moonroof
1999 4Runner SR5, bone stock, just turned over 200K
RobS10 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Reply

Tags
$10k , kdss , midwest , replace , unit

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
KDSS - Is there an Aftermarket Repair Option NC[4]Runner 5th gen T4Rs 40 08-19-2022 07:58 PM
5th Gen. KDSS vs. Non-KDSS handling performance & sway bar diameter differences. CS223 5th gen T4Rs 60 12-08-2021 06:48 PM
New 4R Purchase: KDSS vs Non-KDSS with Modified Suspension and Added Weight? yellowdog 5th gen T4Rs 5 12-13-2017 01:32 PM
KDSS Repair Dealer? Marcocopuffs So Cal 4 06-01-2016 04:57 AM
Woman rams repair shop after non-repair Sac State Off Topic 3 04-29-2005 06:50 PM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.2

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:24 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2023 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2023 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2023 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
***This site is an unofficial Toyota site, and is not officially endorsed, supported, authorized by or affiliated with Toyota. All company, product, or service names references in this web site are used for identification purposes only and may be trademarks of their respective owners. The Toyota name, marks, designs and logos, as well as Toyota model names, are registered trademarks of Toyota Motor Corporation***Ad Management plugin by RedTyger
 
Copyright © 2020