[Kandor]

CR is not exactly a fan of the current 4Runner, if you have seen any of their recent reviews, but apparently their readership sees things a little differently.

Toyota had 7 of the top 10 most reliable vehicles reported in their survey with the 4Runner listed as number 1.

"The magazine doesn’t try to build a representative sample of cars or buyers. It surveys its subscribers. They’re asked if their car has experienced problems in 20 common areas in the prior 12 months.

This year, CR got data “on more than 330,000 vehicles as reported by their owners, covering the 2000 through 2023 model years, including some early 2024 models.”

That method has strengths – it gives CR a solid picture of the reliability of the cars its members tend to buy. But it also has weaknesses – it limits CR’s picture to the cars its members tend to buy. Not everyone would pay a subscription fee for access to lists of reliable products. CR readers are a subset of the population, filtered to find the pickiest.

But when you’re making a five-or-six-figure purchase, that’s not a bad group to join."

Consumer Reports Lists Ten Most Reliable Cars - Kelley Blue Book

[DougR]

I participated in a CR survey a few months ago, offering responses on my 2011 Salsa Red Trail which has been 100% reliable, requiring only routine maintenance. I recently decided I wanted another 4Runner and bought a 2023 ORP in Barcelona Red. Thanks to this forum, I'm able to do all the routine maintenance and perhaps a repair if I ever need one.

[CutthroatSlam]

Originally Posted by DougR

I participated in a CR survey a few months ago, offering responses on my 2011 Salsa Red Trail which has been 100% reliable, requiring only routine maintenance. I recently decided I wanted another 4Runner and bought a 2023 ORP in Barcelona Red. Thanks to this forum, I'm able to do all the routine maintenance and perhaps a repair if I ever need one.

We have a 2014 SR5 with 342K miles and a 2023 ORP with 18K miles. I do all the maintenance and repairs, save for the recent fan clutch failure and resultant fan blade disintegration. This happened with my wife drive 900 miles away, so the repair work got done at Toyota. Otherwise, I do it all and will post up here.

[thatoneguy]

Regardless of how reputable Consumer Reports may or may not be, the venerable current generation 4Runner garnering a top reliability rating is not a surprise to the initiated. This is a vehicle that is on a 2003 chassis, with a 2003 V6 updated with dual VVTI in 2010, backed by a 2005 transmission with only 5 forward speeds, with no hybridization, stop/start, or most any other potential extra problem points, save for TSS (which I seldom hear serious problems about). All built by the automaker that takes reliability the most seriously... produced in one of their finest Japanese factories. Engineered well from the start, built well since the beginning, and only slowly and carefully changed. The damned thing doesn't even have a locking fuel door, which my '99 did...

[02SE]

Originally Posted by thatoneguy

Regardless of how reputable Consumer Reports may or may not be, the venerable current generation 4Runner garnering a top reliability rating is not a surprise to the initiated. This is a vehicle that is on a 2003 chassis, with a 2003 V6 updated with dual VVTI in 2010, backed by a 2005 transmission with only 5 forward speeds, with no hybridization, stop/start, or most any other potential extra problem points, save for TSS (which I seldom hear serious problems about). All built by the automaker that takes reliability the most seriously... produced in one of their finest Japanese factories. Engineered well from the start, built well since the beginning, and only slowly and carefully changed. The damned thing doesn't even have a locking fuel door, which my '99 did...

FWIW, the chassis of the 4th gen was the 120 series chassis. The chassis of the 5th gen is the J150 chassis.

The single VVTi 1GR-FE in the 4th gen has almost nothing in common with the dual VVTi 1GR-FE in the 5th gen. Other than they are both 4 liter V6 engines.

The block is different, the crankshaft, the cylinder heads, the intake and exhaust, etc.

The dual VVTi 1GR-FE makes more power throughout the rev-range compared to the single VVTi 1GR-FE.

IMO, Toyota should have changed the designation of the engine in the 5th gen, to something like 1.5GR-FE, to differentiate the two.

[thatoneguy]

Originally Posted by 02SE

The single VVTi 1GR-FE in the 4th gen has almost nothing in common with the dual VVTi 1GR-FE in the 5th gen. Other than they are both 4 liter V6 engines.

The block is different, the crankshaft, the cylinder heads, the intake and exhaust, etc.

The dual VVTi 1GR-FE makes more power throughout the rev-range compared to the single VVTi 1GR-FE.

IMO, Toyota should have changed the designation of the engine in the 5th gen, to something like 1.5GR-FE, to differentiate the two.

That's interesting. I would like to read more about that, on exactly how substantial the changes were. Sometimes I hear people claim that a new engine version has an "all new" block, when they've changed the location of a couple bolt holes or other pretty minor but "new!" things. The fact they didn't even bother changing the internal engine name leads me to believe that the initial groundwork is still there, at a minimum. Naturally the dual VVTI version makes more power and torque virtually everywhere compared to the single VVTI; it has more freedom to adjust and optimize more parameters.

[02SE]

Here's a quick description of the differences.

1GR-FE Toyota engine

[thennen]

My 2019 lost the passenger headlight a while back, at 120k miles. What kind of junk are they selling these days, when a headlight only lasts 4 years? I was so mad I replaced 'em both.

Still on the original key fob battery, though.

[like2lean]

Too funny! I'm a long time subscriber and fan of CR, they and all the other syndicated reviews I've seen have been very unflattering. How they must have hated revealing those stats!

[thatoneguy]

Originally Posted by thennen

My 2019 lost the passenger headlight a while back, at 120k miles. What kind of junk are they selling these days, when a headlight only lasts 4 years? I was so mad I replaced 'em both.

Still on the original key fob battery, though.

Forget the "4 years" part and focus on the "120,000 miles" part. Did you drive with the headlights on for most/all of those 120,000 miles? That's roughly how long I've had cars go on their original halogen headlights before one finally gave out.

Curious if the 2020+ LEDs go 300k+

[thatoneguy]

Originally Posted by 02SE

Here's a quick description of the differences.

1GR-FE Toyota engine

Thank you. That was a good read.

Perhaps it's a matter of agreeing to disagree, but after reading that, I'm sticking to my initial casual opinion that this is a 2003 era V6 that got some moderate updates in 2010--it is still substantially the same engine, with tweaks here and there. I can't in good faith call this a significantly "new" engine, any more than I could cherry pick a 2003 Honda J-series V6 vs a 2007 Honda J-series V6. It's nice they went through it thoroughly and made all those updates, improving upon the core design.

[02SE]

Originally Posted by thatoneguy

Thank you. That was a good read.

Perhaps it's a matter of agreeing to disagree, but after reading that, I'm sticking to my initial casual opinion that this is a 2003 era V6 that got some moderate updates in 2010--it is still substantially the same engine, with tweaks here and there. I can't in good faith call this a significantly "new" engine, any more than I could cherry pick a 2003 Honda J-series V6 vs a 2007 Honda J-series V6. It's nice they went through it thoroughly and made all those updates, improving upon the core design.

Hey, you can disagree if you want. But with virtually no interchangeable parts between the two, it's essentially a complete redesign. Now that I think about it, there may be some common bearing shells.

Signed, former Toyota master tech

[thennen]

Originally Posted by thatoneguy

Forget the "4 years" part and focus on the "120,000 miles" part. Did you drive with the headlights on for most/all of those 120,000 miles? That's roughly how long I've had cars go on their original halogen headlights before one finally gave out.

Curious if the 2020+ LEDs go 300k+

That was my version of humor. 4 years, 120k miles, only failure being a headlight.

[Rocko9999]

Originally Posted by thennen

My 2019 lost the passenger headlight a while back, at 120k miles. What kind of junk are they selling these days, when a headlight only lasts 4 years? I was so mad I replaced 'em both.

Still on the original key fob battery, though.

Bulbs?

[meridian]

Not surprised and I don't think CR is contradicting themself either.

We're here since we're interested in a specific set of off-road suited/old school traits the 4Runner has but if you take away off-road driving and preferring older designs, the 4Runner becomes a thirsty, expensive SUV to a typical buyer.

I like mine a lot but I don't think I'd recommend it over a Highlander or Passport to the average Joe in suburbia.

Since new car reviews don't usually touch on historical reliability much (I think Alex on Autos/ABG has a decent video on the difficulty of predictions) so I can see why publications easily put the Sorento I just got rid of above it without batting an eye at the time it was new.

Back then it was great packaging, interior design/fit+finish, comfortable but in typical fashion it'd turn out that 2/3 of it's engine options were garbage, corner-cutting causing big trouble later, etc.

I'd be lying though if I said I didn't miss having that under-floor trunk storage or not-bolted-on-top-fold-flat third-row that IRS makes room for though!