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Old 02-17-2022, 11:42 PM #31
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Originally Posted by RobS10 View Post
If you want a reliable 6th Gen, I would wait until at least 2024 or '25.
As it looks now 2024 will be the first model year of 6th GenÖso better wait for MY25 or 26 for improved reliability.
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Old 02-18-2022, 08:54 AM #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baystate4Runner View Post
As it looks now 2024 will be the first model year of 6th GenÖso better wait for MY25 or 26 for improved reliability.
Definitely, if 2024 is the first Gen 6 model year...maybe even '27. Wonder what prices will be like, given all the totally new tech going into the drive system.
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Old 02-18-2022, 12:58 PM #33
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Originally Posted by Pedro367 View Post
Geeze, man. The truck has been out for 5 minutes. There is a reason why you shouldn't by a first year model and it's to sort out the kinks. Give them a year to work it out and then make a decision. I'm sure it will be great.

I don't disagree that the 5th gen is the pillar for reliability, but every time a new model comes out, regardless of brand, everyone just complains about how the old one is better and then they finally get the new one and realize it's way better. Or there is an issue with the new one with a tiny percentage of the vehicles having said issue and all of the sudden the whole thing is junk and their 1987 model is way better. It's hilarious.
I expect some issues in the first MY but Toyota and their supporters, Like David (automotive press), have been saying this tt v6 has been out for 4-5 years with millions of miles in testing being done by Toyota to ensure no major issues. I would say turbos failing after 50 miles is a massive failure in engineering and QC. The amount of body trim issues just shows sloppy work. Rear differentials leaking all of the fluid out, AC not holding a charge and so on.

I thought about holding out for the 2023 4Runner but didn't want to risk a model change being announced too late to order the last MY of the 5th gen. It's been 2 months since I put my deposit down and ordered one and still no word on allocation. I'm assuming the order will get filled before summer. There has been a reduction in production of the 4Runner. The 22 Tundra has reinforced the "never buy the first year of production".
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Old 02-18-2022, 03:52 PM #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetboy View Post
One case I know of locally - owner bought new tundra 5.7. Cam broke on a road trip in BFE. Toyota had local dealer go get him and his trailer. Engine swap takes a bit to get parts and do the work. So Toyota setup a free temporary lease on another new one so the guy could get on with his trip. Moved his stuff to the new truck and off he went. After the new engine was installed, Toyota shipped the truck to him and took the leased truck back. Toyota also extended the warranty, paid for 2 months of the car payment, and apparently tossed in a TRD Exhaust to compensate for the hassle. <- That is how you handle initial issues well. Toyota corporate is basically ghosting owners with the turbo issues from what I can tell. We'll get it fixed when we get it fixed. Go home. We'll probably call you in a month or two.
That seems to be the old way vs the new way in other areas as well. The Chinese virus has changed the way medicine is practiced in the US. Shortages of staff and supplies have created blase or jaded attitudes among those that are still working. In the former way you often gained a customer for life; in the latter people just get pissed off. It must be frustrating for automotive companies not to have anything to sell.
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Old 02-19-2022, 01:39 AM #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetboy View Post
I don't think there were many questions about reliability - mostly because the 5th gen was mostly just a reskin of the 4th gen. The only meaningful changes with respect to the rolling chassis and drive train were the dual VVTI engine change and the rear axle was upsized slightly. Otherwise just cosmetics.

My issue with the 2022 tundra is less that it has some turbo issues, but more that Toyota did not design it for ground level serviceability. That's a significant change in the entire vehicle design philosophy. No repairs I'm aware of on the 2nd gen Tundra - or the 4runner - require cab to come off. It appears that cab-off is a designed part of service now. That means no more DIY repairs for anything you can't easily access on top. That's a big deal for me.

The second issue I have is that Toyota is doing a remarkably poor job of handling the teething issues. In 2007 when the 5.7 had some cam shafts seize and break (according to toyota it was bout 20 total engines), toyota was on top of it. Toyota issued press releases that explained the issue and what was going on. It was a no-question full engine swap.

One case I know of locally - owner bought new tundra 5.7. Cam broke on a road trip in BFE. Toyota had local dealer go get him and his trailer. Engine swap takes a bit to get parts and do the work. So Toyota setup a free temporary lease on another new one so the guy could get on with his trip. Moved his stuff to the new truck and off he went. After the new engine was installed, Toyota shipped the truck to him and took the leased truck back. Toyota also extended the warranty, paid for 2 months of the car payment, and apparently tossed in a TRD Exhaust to compensate for the hassle. <- That is how you handle initial issues well. Toyota corporate is basically ghosting owners with the turbo issues from what I can tell. We'll get it fixed when we get it fixed. Go home. We'll probably call you in a month or two.
I traded my 4Runner in on a Ď21 Tundra, the last year of the 2nd gens. Absolutely love it. And, until the 3rd gen was released, I loved the Tundra forum. Now it is a dumpster fire. Ok, maybe itís not that bad, but there are several threads to avoid. Lots of hate for the 3rd gen. Mostly because of the looks, but also because of exactly what you said: the commitment to ease of self-maintenance appears to be completely gone. I bought my truck because it was a 14-year-old brand new truck. I have over 23,000 miles on it already and no complaints.

The 3rd gen is a more complicated vehicle by an order of magnitude or two. One guy on the Tundra forum says he got his passenger side turbo replaced without taking the entire cab off. But most of them seem to have the cabs taken off first thing. Yikes. Iíd hate to have a brand new truck that has had the cab, entire front end, and one of the turbos taken apart and put back together at the dealership before I even put 500 miles on it. And I would like to think the apparent nose dive in Toyota customer care is supply chain driven. But I guess time will tell.
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Old 02-24-2022, 09:40 PM #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobS10 View Post
I always say, never buy the first year of ANYTHING as big as a vehicle, especially if they're making the major changes to the 4Runner that they say. If you want a reliable 6th Gen, I would wait until at least 2024 or '25. Buying the last year of a model's generation pretty much guarantees all the major bugs have been worked out. Looking forward to our 2022 ORP .
My 1990 was the first year of the 2nd gen but it had the same driveline as my 86 Xtra cab.
Wife and I were going to have a baby in 1991 and we both had 2 seaters so we both had to change rides. The runner was our primary family car for 14yrs, brought both my boys home from the hospital with it and the youngest used it at college to get his Engineering Masters. It is an adopted member of the family.
No one wanted the 4cyl runners in 90, I got this leftover one-at-this-price (zero options)stripper for $12k with the factory AC kit and roof rack at dealer cost. A good friend/dealer mechanic helped me install the AC and for a case of beer he brought it into work and pumped it down and back-filled it with Freon. Still blows ice cold 32yrs later. 240k miles, runs perfect and doesn’t use oil. Replaced Timing chain guides, water pump, front seal, clutch and brake pads….that’s it. It still has the original discs and ball/U joints. I aways kept them greased. PS steering box is just starting to weep…..oh darn.
Totally stock except for a rear TruTrac and hubs.
I have retired and our new house backs up to millions of acres of BLM so it has become my poor man’s air conditioned SxS. Lots of new “pinstripes” and getting more every week. Best and the most versatile vehicle I have ever owned.
The 2022 has a tuff act to follow.
Edit: forgot, I did replaced the CVs when I added the hubs. Got the hubs and TruTrac off Craigslist for $100 for BOTH. I also replaced the rubber throttle body intake boot.

Last edited by MY1990-22re; 02-25-2022 at 10:48 AM. Reason: Forgot stuff
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Old 11-28-2022, 09:26 AM #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetboy View Post
I don't think there were many questions about reliability - mostly because the 5th gen was mostly just a reskin of the 4th gen. The only meaningful changes with respect to the rolling chassis and drive train were the dual VVTI engine change and the rear axle was upsized slightly. Otherwise just cosmetics.

My issue with the 2022 tundra is less that it has some turbo issues, but more that Toyota did not design it for ground level serviceability. That's a significant change in the entire vehicle design philosophy. No repairs I'm aware of on the 2nd gen Tundra - or the 4runner - require cab to come off. It appears that cab-off is a designed part of service now. That means no more DIY repairs for anything you can't easily access on top. That's a big deal for me.

The second issue I have is that Toyota is doing a remarkably poor job of handling the teething issues. In 2007 when the 5.7 had some cam shafts seize and break (according to toyota it was bout 20 total engines), toyota was on top of it. Toyota issued press releases that explained the issue and what was going on. It was a no-question full engine swap.

One case I know of locally - owner bought new tundra 5.7. Cam broke on a road trip in BFE. Toyota had local dealer go get him and his trailer. Engine swap takes a bit to get parts and do the work. So Toyota setup a free temporary lease on another new one so the guy could get on with his trip. Moved his stuff to the new truck and off he went. After the new engine was installed, Toyota shipped the truck to him and took the leased truck back. Toyota also extended the warranty, paid for 2 months of the car payment, and apparently tossed in a TRD Exhaust to compensate for the hassle. <- That is how you handle initial issues well. Toyota corporate is basically ghosting owners with the turbo issues from what I can tell. We'll get it fixed when we get it fixed. Go home. We'll probably call you in a month or two.

How is the serviceability of other turbos from Lexus and Toyota? I guess itís too early for Highlander but maybe Nx might be a good comparison since itís been out the longest. It sucks that Toyota seems to be going the route of bmw and others on making their vehicles hard to service ó discouraging owners to work on their own vehicles.
If that were to happen with next gen 4R that would be a significant negative in my books.


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Old 11-28-2022, 10:05 AM #38
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I completely agree on the price. I have a 2007 with 175,000 miles and part of me would love to get a sixth generation to have a slightly more updated and refined interior and exterior styling. But at the same time I just donít think, or at least I am suspicious, that the updates will be worth the cost. I hope Iím proven wrong. But Iím sticking with my fourth generation for at least a couple more years.
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Old 11-28-2022, 02:40 PM #39
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Seeing the trend of pricing for big cars (SUVs/Trucks) is enough to steer me away from getting one thats brand new. While the idea of having a modern car (the newest car I drive is an '06 tundra) is appealing, my '90 4runner does all that I need it to do. I do plan on at least going to the dealer when the 6th gen comes out and trying to test drive one. Maybe in that moment I'll change my mind.
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Old 11-28-2022, 06:30 PM #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cordial.salt6147 View Post
How is the serviceability of other turbos from Lexus and Toyota? I guess itís too early for Highlander but maybe Nx might be a good comparison since itís been out the longest. It sucks that Toyota seems to be going the route of bmw and others on making their vehicles hard to service ó discouraging owners to work on their own vehicles.
If that were to happen with next gen 4R that would be a significant negative in my books.


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This depends a lot on the specific make and modep and engine. If you look at the new 3.3 diesel from Toyota - night and day difference. The turbo and EGR cooler sit right on top of the engine where they are easy to access. I don't recall seeing a "hot v" gas turbo, but presumably it's possible to do. That's how the 3.3 Toyota diesel is.

My 6.0 powerstroke turbo was on top as well and could be pulled in about 30 minutes. It was a horrible piece of shit. And almost everything was hard to reach and many things required the cab to come off. But at least the turbo was easy to get to. And a good thing because they needed work pretty regularly.

Turbo access in the Lexus LS is effectively an entire car strip apart. It's something crazy like 20 hours of labor to get one out. No bueno. Older models like the Mk4 supra are really easy to access.

The is200t is also easy to access. I think that's probably the closest thing to what I'd expect in a 4cyl turbo 4runner. I'm not aware of any other 8ar or any T24A (engine most likely to be used) in a longitudinal orientation. I think the IS200t was the only 8AR setup that way.
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Old 01-29-2023, 05:48 PM #41
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I just want one change, give it an 8 speed to improve mileage and don't change anything else. :-)

I like my doors and roof to stay attached, and the rear window to retract.
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