im more into mud then rockcrawling

any suggestions about what tires i should get?

plz add in how long they last for before you have to get new ones (how many years or months?)

been looking at the superswamper thornbird(if you had or know any one with experience with these tires plz tell)

thanks

I've had Bridgestone Dueler A/T Revos (the 10 plys) for a little over two years now. I drive like a mad man and dont rotate my tires alot and they have lasted 2 years. Roughly 25k miles. Still have plenty of tread. I havent gotten stuck in up to 1' of snow or about 4-5"s of mud.

If you deal with larger amounts of mud, snow, rock. Then i reccomend BFG M/Ts (little louder on the freeway), Goodyear MT/Rs (some have bad feelings about them, but all mine have been good).

Dont know from experiance but i hear the TSL and TSL radials are good too.

Nitto makes a MudGrappler that competitively priced and has had some positive reviews in a couple of 4wd mags.

http://www.nittotire.com/tires_mudgrappler_features.asp

http://www.offroaders.com/tech/AT-MT...d_Grappler.htm


Here's a review

http://www.jpmagazine.com/techarticl..._mud_grappler/

You have many choices...all depend on how much you want to sacrifice. I have been researching MT's for over 2 weeks...reading everything there is to read about these tires...so here is my review of them based on everything that i have read (a summary if you will):

The popular choices are BFG MT and Goodyear MT/R. These tires are from big companies with proven history. BFG MT is very popular among most off-roaders. MT/R is very popular among the rock-crawling population.

MT/R is a sticky soft compound strong-as-hell rock tire. MT/R clogs up with mud easily and does not clean mud well, but looks really aggressive. It is noisy and is hard to balance according to some people. In addition, they go out-of-balance easily and wear down quickly due to soft rubber compound. You will be lucky to get 30K miles from them...they tend to get noisy with wear.

BFG MT is better than MT/R in mud due to better self-cleaning treads. It does well on rocks. Sidewall may not be as strong as MT/R but it still has 3-plies. It is noisy on highway, more so than MT/R at least initially. Some say that GY MT/R gets noisy as it wears. It may last a bit longer than MT/R but it's not a big difference.

Neither of these tires are very good in rain or ice due to no factory siping. Snow is OK because they dig well in deep snow. If you were going to buy these tires, then i would recommend siping the middle lugs...most people do NOT sip the outer lugs because this may weaken these lugs when rock crawling (aka more chipping and chunking). Here is info on siping: http://www.discounttire.com/dtcs/tireSiping.dos.

There are 3 additonal MT's that have caught my eye. I have read up on them as much as possible: Toyo Open Country M/T, Firestone Destination M/T, and Cooper Discoverer STT. Along with MT/R and BFG MT, these are the front runners after reading all the reviews.

Toyo Open Country M/T...from what i have been reading, these tires are probably the quietest MT tire on the market. It's a hard tire to get (and can be $$$$)...very few distributors around US...so, not many people have them. From the few that have them, these are relatively quiet for a MT...a bit noisier than average AT tire. Handling & braking on-road is relatively good. They handle well in rain and snow/ice because they do come with siping from the factory. Mud traction is good and they do well on rocks, but not as sticky as MT/R on rocks though. The one major negative (other than hard to find & $$$$) about these tires is the weight. It is well-constructed, but it weighs quite a bit more than all other MT tire...we're talking at least 10-15 lbs more PER tire than your average MT. So, keep that in mind because this may affect handling, braking, ride comfort, and fuel economy. However, despite this, they do ride well enough because their sidewall is a bit softer than MT/R. Treadwear is pretty good...probably at least 40K miles on average.

Firestone Destination M/T...these are very good MT tires. From reviews, they are quieter than MT/R and BFG MT on-road. This is for sure. Some people claim them to be the quietest MT...while a few other complain about the noise. So, these tires are most likely not as quiet as BFG AT KO or other AT tires, but they do better than the popular MT tires. They ride very well, and do well enough in rain due to soft tread compound despite lack of siping. However, they may not do well on ice or slick snow (most MTs do not). I would advise that you sip them, esp. if you live in an area that gets snow. They are pinned for studs if you need it for winter. Off-road, they are supposedly very good. They are very good at self-cleaning in mud. In fact, if you drive these tires over your lawn, these tires will rip your grass up from the roots! They bite into the ground...good for rocks and mud. This may not bold well in sand, unless you air down quite a bit. These tires can air down as low as 8-10 psi without any problems with the beads. On rocks, i have read that a few owners have chipped their lugs on sharp rocks...very few complain of this. My brother complained that his MT/R chips too easily...so, it's all relative. The sidewall is extremely strong, easily on par with MT/R and BFG MT. Treadwear is pretty good, probably at least 40K miles.

Cooper STT...from what i have been reading, these tires are pretty darn good and relatively cheap too. They come with siping from factory and is apparently very well made. Cooper is a USA company and has a good reputation, but in 2004, they did have to settle a few lawsuits due to material mishap resulting in a few deaths (similar to what Firestone went thru). Cooper tires are distributed everywhere in the world...and they are well known in Australia. These tires do well on-road...relatively quiet (probably on-par with Firestone M/T), do well in rain and snow/ice due to well-placed siping (similar to Toyo M/T above). They do well in mud from what i hear. They self-clean better than MT/R. On rocks, i hear that they are OK. Apparently, the rubber compound is hard...so these tires don't stick to rocks like MT/R (and some of the other MTs)...a review mentioned that this resulted in sliding sideways on rocks. Other people had no complaints about these tires on rocks. Treadwear is pretty good too, similar to above two tires.

As you can see, each MT tire has strengths and weaknesses. If you want to rock crawl, then there is not a better tire than Goodyear MT/R...but they are noisy, hard to balance, wear quickly, and don't do well in clay mud. BFG MT is a good all-arounder, but they are noisy also and treadwear is not that great. However, these two tires are from big companies with great reputations and proven history. The rest of the MT tires above don't have the same pedigree. But they are a bit quieter on-road, wear longer, and do better as an all-season tire.

Hope this helps.

Nittos are factory siped.

I would put the Nitto Mud in the same category as Swampers...they are for the extreme sport, not liveable for daily life. If you plan on trailering your off-road rig to the site, then Nitto Mud or Swampers are perfect. But, if you have to drive your off-road SUV to the site, then it's not gonna be a nice trip.

I figured he wanted a little more of an extreme tire since he mentioned the Superswampers.
Yeah,it would be hard to imagine a tolerable ride for a few hours on the Nittos out on the highway.

You're right...if that's what he wants, then i would get BFG Krawler!!

http://www.bfgoodrichtires.com/bfgap...rawlertakx.jsp

Here are some review internet links that i have collected for Firestone Destination M/T and Cooper Discoverer STT:

Firestone:
http://www.bridgestonetire.com/tires...productID=1058
http://www.4x4review.com/products/ti...ination-MT.asp
http://www.expeditionoverland.com/sponsors.htm
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....675R6DESTMTOWL


Cooper:
http://www.coopertires.com/us/en/Pro...ht+Truck+Tires
http://www.bajataco.com/bajastires.html
http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/showthread.php?t=3561
http://home.earthlink.net/~jandastavola/cooper-stt.jpg
http://www.guidebooks.com.au/LOE%202005%20Part%20II.htm
http://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.p...discoverer+stt


Hope this helps.

Nittos still look cooler with those reptilian side lugs yo'.

WOW!!! thanks a lot for the info

i am planning to use these tires for daily drive...i maybe change my mind... and just change tires everytime i go offroading...

i never really thought about highway driving... i should add that into my choices...that is if i choose to use them as my daily drivers

i dont think i will really do rockcrawling because dont want any body damage or paint scratches, maybe i go a few times and try it out

more into mud

i really like thoughs BFG KRAWLERS, are they good for mud? since they are more for rockcrawling

BFG Krawlers should do well in mud...but they are expensive...basically, they are for professional competitions.

For you, i would definitely look at the above tires with the exception of Goodyear MT/R (not good in mud).

Very true....

i've also been looking at pro comp tires like x-terrians and there mud terrains

also BFG's mud terrians

anyone have experience on any of thoughs tires?