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Old 10-01-2019, 04:24 PM #16
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So I finally ditched my KO2s today, and I'm pretty happy so far... after an ~8 mile drive home .

When I was at the dealer getting them installed today, I spent some time talking to Southeast Toyota's tire "rep" about this tire and many of the others that I considered. A few interesting notes from him:
  • He said that he's had good experiences with the Hankook tires, and has never seen a complaint with their AT tires
  • Mentioned seeing and hearing lots of complaints about balancing the Falken Wildpeaks over the years and said it would be "mid-pack" for him, in my position
  • Agreed that the KO2 is a great tire if you spend a considerable amount of time off paved roads, but is more than I needed
  • I told him I came down to Geolandar and Terra Grappler G2, and he said he'd give a slight nod to the Geolandar because of road noise and wet traction.
  • He did mention that the TG G2 is basically a cut rate KO2 with a P-rated option, and that's not a bad thing, but for my needs, the Geolandar would probably serve me better


So, they don't look as aggressive as KO2s but they also don't look as basic as a passenger tire. A nice in-between, IMO.









The difference in ride quality and noise was immediately noticeable. I do still think of the KO2 as a great tire... it's just more than I needed. Being back to the smoothness of a P-Rated tire with these Yokos feels like my old LS 430 in comparison to the KO2 though. Also a little quieter, but I never felt like the KO2s were "too loud." Last but not least, losing ~5lbs per corner, the truck does feel a little quicker on its feet, which is exactly what I wanted.

I have a road trip coming up later this week, so I can report back with more opinions later. Thank you to @Thai and @MAST4R for helping me in this search. Happy with where I ended up so far.
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Old 10-01-2019, 05:16 PM #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gecko View Post
So I finally ditched my KO2s today, and I'm pretty happy so far... after an ~8 mile drive home .

When I was at the dealer getting them installed today, I spent some time talking to Southeast Toyota's tire "rep" about this tire and many of the others that I considered. A few interesting notes from him:
  • He said that he's had good experiences with the Hankook tires, and has never seen a complaint with their AT tires
  • Mentioned seeing and hearing lots of complaints about balancing the Falken Wildpeaks over the years and said it would be "mid-pack" for him, in my position
  • Agreed that the KO2 is a great tire if you spend a considerable amount of time off paved roads, but is more than I needed
  • I told him I came down to Geolandar and Terra Grappler G2, and he said he'd give a slight nod to the Geolandar because of road noise and wet traction.
  • He did mention that the TG G2 is basically a cut rate KO2 with a P-rated option, and that's not a bad thing, but for my needs, the Geolandar would probably serve me better


So, they don't look as aggressive as KO2s but they also don't look as basic as a passenger tire. A nice in-between, IMO.









The difference in ride quality and noise was immediately noticeable. I do still think of the KO2 as a great tire... it's just more than I needed. Being back to the smoothness of a P-Rated tire with these Yokos feels like my old LS 430 in comparison to the KO2 though. Also a little quieter, but I never felt like the KO2s were "too loud." Last but not least, losing ~5lbs per corner, the truck does feel a little quicker on its feet, which is exactly what I wanted.

I have a road trip coming up later this week, so I can report back with more opinions later. Thank you to @Thai and @MAST4R for helping me in this search. Happy with where I ended up so far.
You should see improvement in your fuel economy too.

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Old 10-02-2019, 10:28 PM #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gecko View Post
So I finally ditched my KO2s today, and I'm pretty happy so far... after an ~8 mile drive home .

When I was at the dealer getting them installed today, I spent some time talking to Southeast Toyota's tire "rep" about this tire and many of the others that I considered. A few interesting notes from him:
  • He said that he's had good experiences with the Hankook tires, and has never seen a complaint with their AT tires
  • Mentioned seeing and hearing lots of complaints about balancing the Falken Wildpeaks over the years and said it would be "mid-pack" for him, in my position
  • Agreed that the KO2 is a great tire if you spend a considerable amount of time off paved roads, but is more than I needed
  • I told him I came down to Geolandar and Terra Grappler G2, and he said he'd give a slight nod to the Geolandar because of road noise and wet traction.
  • He did mention that the TG G2 is basically a cut rate KO2 with a P-rated option, and that's not a bad thing, but for my needs, the Geolandar would probably serve me better


So, they don't look as aggressive as KO2s but they also don't look as basic as a passenger tire. A nice in-between, IMO.









The difference in ride quality and noise was immediately noticeable. I do still think of the KO2 as a great tire... it's just more than I needed. Being back to the smoothness of a P-Rated tire with these Yokos feels like my old LS 430 in comparison to the KO2 though. Also a little quieter, but I never felt like the KO2s were "too loud." Last but not least, losing ~5lbs per corner, the truck does feel a little quicker on its feet, which is exactly what I wanted.

I have a road trip coming up later this week, so I can report back with more opinions later. Thank you to @Thai and @MAST4R for helping me in this search. Happy with where I ended up so far.
So I'm in a similar boat as you. However I planned to get new wheels but stay with 20's on the limited. Besides looks the main reason is that I dont want to mess much with the driving dynamics of the LE. I love how it handles ramps and twisties more like a car than a truck. I tend to drive 10+ mph over the speed limit almost all the time. I'm not sure how much of that is due to xreas or the 20's with lower sidewalls ie less flex. I rented an Sr5 for a week once and couldnt stand the floaty bouncy drive. I plan to go up to a 275-60-20 as I was told by my local deal thats the highest I can go without rub or mod. The stock geolanders havent been horrible and I've done a few light trails and plenty of beach driving in them. But I'd prefer a more aggressive look as well. So my question on this topic is...did you notice much of a change in the driving specific to those characteristics when you moved to a 17?

Next question...How come the continental terrain contact a/t didnt make your list?

Continental was highly rated (except snow) by official Tire Rack comparo and was the top all terrain tire on Consumer Reports testing, although other reviews say snow isnt an issue with them.

Conversely, I'm surprised the Pirelli made your list as it fared the worst in the Tire rack comparo.

Interested to know your thoughts since I'm sure you came across them in your research and interested to hear you trip report.
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Old 10-03-2019, 01:26 AM #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthYota View Post
So I'm in a similar boat as you. However I planned to get new wheels but stay with 20's on the limited. Besides looks the main reason is that I dont want to mess much with the driving dynamics of the LE. I love how it handles ramps and twisties more like a car than a truck. I tend to drive 10+ mph over the speed limit almost all the time. I'm not sure how much of that is due to xreas or the 20's with lower sidewalls ie less flex. I rented an Sr5 for a week once and couldnt stand the floaty bouncy drive.
Howdy! I guess my experience was a little different, because I absolutely hate how the truck handles with the stock 20s. That wheel and tire combination, in my opinion, is a terrible choice for a 4Runner... a nearly 5k lb SUV has no business riding on 7"wide wheels with 245 rubber. People don't joke about them being wagon wheels for nothing

I drive somewhat aggressively and taking quick turns on those stock 20s always required additional correction to get the 4Runner straight and not feel like it was going to flip. The biggest change I noticed with my wheel/tire choices has been overall stability and smoothness. X-REAS does a good job of controlling body roll, but it does so at the expense of ride quality. I would say the Limited is actually the least-smooth 4Runner unless you're on freshly paved, perfect roads.

Not sure what the roads are like in your part of the country, but here, they can be pretty bad and the stock 20s with low profile tires were fairly bouncy and harsh on broken pavement and impacts. Again, X-REAS doesn't help. Going to a tire with more sidewall and more width made it feel much more stable and planted, as well as much smoother. If I was in your shoes, I would go for a 17" or 18" wheel that is at least 7.5 inches wide, and wearing 265 width rubber. Maybe a 265/70R18?


Quote:
I plan to go up to a 275-60-20 as I was told by my local deal thats the highest I can go without rub or mod. The stock geolanders havent been horrible and I've done a few light trails and plenty of beach driving in them. But I'd prefer a mor aggressive look as well. So my question on this topic is...did you notice much of a change in the driving specific to those characteristics when you moved to a 17?
I probably answered most of your questions above. I am not sure what load ratings are available for 275/60R20 tires, but if you are trying to preserve ride quality, I would try to stick to P-rated. A C or E rated tire + 20" wheels + X-REAS is a recipe for early veneers, IMO.

Quote:
Next question...How come the general grabber A/TX, continental terrain contact a/t, Bridgestone Dueler A/T Revo 3, or toyo open country AT2 didnt make your original list?

Grabber is pretty highly rated on Tire Rack by consumer feedback. Continental was highly rated (except snow) by official Tire Rack comparo and was the top LT tire on Consumer Reports testing, same with Bridgestone with respect to Tire Rack, and Toyo OCAT2 is pretty well known.

Conversely, I'm surprised the Pirelli made your list as it fared the worst in the Tire rack comparo.

Interested to know your thoughts since I'm sure you came across them in your research.
I read mainly positive things about the General Grabber except for some complaints about highway noise, but noise was a big factor for me, so I passed on it. The Continental hadn't come up in my search, nor the Bridgestone... and I should have really looked at that one. I had Bridgestones on some of the Lexus cars I drove, and loved them. I primarily found reviews of the Toyos in E load range, and far fewer for the P-rated version. I know that is another tire that many love, however.
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Old 10-03-2019, 02:43 AM #20
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totally agree about the 7" wide wheels...makes no sense to me, which is the main reason Im going to get new wheels. besides differentiating me from the rest of the world.

funny how we have such a different response to the ride.

I know a lot of people say it's harsh, and occasionally I notice it but for the most part I dont. So I'm either used to it, or maybe our roads arent that horrible? I'm in northern VA. DC road suck but out in the burbs it's generally pretty decent except for tail end and right after winter.

With the exception of my previous car (chevy equinox) to the 4runner, my cars over the last 15-20 years as an adult have all been german sports sedans. So their ride is a little tighter than most anyway.

Coming down from Keystone to Denver in that SR5 on a big sweeper on I-70 at 75mph had me on edge. I was praying i wouldnt need to make an emergency maneuver. At any moment I might shoot across the lanes or was on the verge of tipping. The LE might seems a bit harsh but to me feels planted and not going anywhere I dont point it (except emergency braking nosedive is a little hairy) and I typically drive around 75-85 on the highways. If you're not first, you're last.

A few of the wheels I'm looking at are 20x9. Would definitely be going P rated. Even though the ratio is still a 60, given that Im going up to a 275 I'd get the higher sidewall anyway over the stocks. But I'll take a look at the 18's, specially if Im about to drop 2-4 g's.

Yeah I went back and looked at the weight for the Grabbers. They were 13lbs per tire more than the G015. So I whacked them from the list.

Toyo's havent been updated in 10 years...so old tech and I need to use some kind of criteria to eliminate choices and not be stuck in analysis paralysis. I mean if they were spectacular tires still, I pick up, but reviews didnt indicate that.

Revo 3's are the most expensive, $50 per tire more than the G015 for seemingly not much of a significantly better tire. Previous gen had bad wear/longevity issues. Havent seen a whole lot of people mention this gen either.

SO..... I'm down to the G015 and the TerrainContact's. TC's are $20 more on tirerack so thats somewhat negligible. I do have an affinity for german engineering. TireRack says the G015 are only fair in wet braking but Consumer Reports gives them a slightly better mark for hydroplaning, snow, and ice. Oddly the TC's score 4 points higher on CR.

Not that the TC's look bad but initial reaction is the G015's look better.

aaaarrrrggggggg! lol
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Old 10-05-2019, 06:05 PM #21
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totally agree about the 7" wide wheels...makes no sense to me, which is the main reason Im going to get new wheels. besides differentiating me from the rest of the world.

funny how we have such a different response to the ride.

I know a lot of people say it's harsh, and occasionally I notice it but for the most part I dont. So I'm either used to it, or maybe our roads arent that horrible? I'm in northern VA. DC road suck but out in the burbs it's generally pretty decent except for tail end and right after winter.

With the exception of my previous car (chevy equinox) to the 4runner, my cars over the last 15-20 years as an adult have all been german sports sedans. So their ride is a little tighter than most anyway.

Coming down from Keystone to Denver in that SR5 on a big sweeper on I-70 at 75mph had me on edge. I was praying i wouldnt need to make an emergency maneuver. At any moment I might shoot across the lanes or was on the verge of tipping. The LE might seems a bit harsh but to me feels planted and not going anywhere I dont point it (except emergency braking nosedive is a little hairy) and I typically drive around 75-85 on the highways. If you're not first, you're last.

A few of the wheels I'm looking at are 20x9. Would definitely be going P rated. Even though the ratio is still a 60, given that Im going up to a 275 I'd get the higher sidewall anyway over the stocks. But I'll take a look at the 18's, specially if Im about to drop 2-4 g's.

Yeah I went back and looked at the weight for the Grabbers. They were 13lbs per tire more than the G015. So I whacked them from the list.

Toyo's havent been updated in 10 years...so old tech and I need to use some kind of criteria to eliminate choices and not be stuck in analysis paralysis. I mean if they were spectacular tires still, I pick up, but reviews didnt indicate that.

Revo 3's are the most expensive, $50 per tire more than the G015 for seemingly not much of a significantly better tire. Previous gen had bad wear/longevity issues. Havent seen a whole lot of people mention this gen either.

SO..... I'm down to the G015 and the TerrainContact's. TC's are $20 more on tirerack so thats somewhat negligible. I do have an affinity for german engineering. TireRack says the G015 are only fair in wet braking but Consumer Reports gives them a slightly better mark for hydroplaning, snow, and ice. Oddly the TC's score 4 points higher on CR.

Not that the TC's look bad but initial reaction is the G015's look better.

aaaarrrrggggggg! lol
I think the TerrainContact is a great tire. You can't go wrong. Report back and let us know what you choose!
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Old 10-05-2019, 06:08 PM #22
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Also, I picked up 1 MPG so far just from the tire change. Not too shabby.
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:59 PM #23
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Thanks to OP @Gecko for his detailed analysis and to all respondents. I found this to be quite a valuable thread during my new tire deliberations. I'd had a long term plan to move to 33's (255/80/17). By long term, I mean years - to the point where I have had a Zuk-built 4.88 rear elocker and matching front diff sitting here awaiting installation for months now. The SPC 25460 UCAs are here too, as yet unopened... That will soon change.

Initially I was set on Nitto Ridge Grapplers. I then switched the plan to Falken Wildpeak A/T3Ws. What caused purchase pause was the E load rating for all 255/80s and the minimum weight of 51+ lbs per tire.

This thread, along with sage advice from vocal forum contributors such as @absalom , caused me to reevaluate 33s and consider moving from the existing 265/70/17 to just 255/75/17. I came really close to joining @Gecko by buying Yokohama Geolandar G015s; but today, I had Firestone Destination X/Ts in LT255/75/17 load C installed on my SCS Stealth 6 17x8.5 wheels. I was an early adopter when the previous Cooper A/TWs were released in 2015 (meh - bad oxidation cracking @just 3years) and it seems I'm again diving into uncharted waters.

At just 40lbs, with 3-peak severe snow rating and C rated sidewalls, I figured it's worth the gamble. Plus, Firestone offers their 90-day satisfaction / replacement guarantee for these tires.

I weighed a wheel with the 35k mile Cooper vs the new Destination X/T today and it was just a 3lb increase. Now I just hope I'll still be happy with 4.88s on 32s... Don't fear the gear, right?

I'm pleased with my final choice so far and though I went a different direction, I remain very appreciative of the excellent discussion above.

Here's what they look like in comparison:
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BFG KO2 vs. Terra Grappler G2 vs. Falken Wildpeak vs. Other P-Rated AT Tires-img_20191204_105732~2-jpg 
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Old 12-07-2019, 08:42 PM #24
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Quote:
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Thanks to OP @Gecko for his detailed analysis and to all respondents. I found this to be quite a valuable thread during my new tire deliberations. I'd had a long term plan to move to 33's (255/80/17). By long term, I mean years - to the point where I have had a Zuk-built 4.88 rear elocker and matching front diff sitting here awaiting installation for months now. The SPC 25460 UCAs are here too, as yet unopened... That will soon change.

Initially I was set on Nitto Ridge Grapplers. I then switched the plan to Falken Wildpeak A/T3Ws. What caused purchase pause was the E load rating for all 255/80s and the minimum weight of 51+ lbs per tire.

This thread, along with sage advice from vocal forum contributors such as @absalom , caused me to reevaluate 33s and consider moving from the existing 265/70/17 to just 255/75/17. I came really close to joining @Gecko by buying Yokohama Geolandar G015s; but today, I had Firestone Destination X/Ts in LT255/75/17 load C installed on my SCS Stealth 6 17x8.5 wheels. I was an early adopter when the previous Cooper A/TWs were released in 2015 (meh - bad oxidation cracking @just 3years) and it seems I'm again diving into uncharted waters.

At just 40lbs, with 3-peak severe snow rating and C rated sidewalls, I figured it's worth the gamble. Plus, Firestone offers their 90-day satisfaction / replacement guarantee for these tires.

I weighed a wheel with the 35k mile Cooper vs the new Destination X/T today and it was just a 3lb increase. Now I just hope I'll still be happy with 4.88s on 32s... Don't fear the gear, right?

I'm pleased with my final choice so far and though I went a different direction, I remain very appreciative of the excellent discussion above.
Many thanks for this post.

Please do provide updates. Considering your location, I am especially interested in how the Destination XT does on pavement and particularly in rain.

I would love to have someone compare it to LTC KO2 in the desert but that's quite a bit far away from you....

I love the weight of the 255 75 17 and with my current suspension I am no longer concerned with going from 9.0 tread width to 8.1 Besides, the stock tire was only 8.3" wide anyway. Maybe the narrow tread will help a bit with mpg.

I am now more concerned with being able to air down to smooth out the ride over small stuff and that's not something I am comfortable doing on P metric tires. The Icon 2.0 rear shocks perform very well but the ride on the back seat can be a little rough on trails on which embedded rock is common.

I firmly believe that suspension and tires need to work in unison and whereas the P Wildpeaks were a great fit for me until I got the 6112/Icon combo, allowing me to drive all sorts of trails without airing down, I am now considering getting back into LT.
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