Hey all,

As you guys may know, i had Nitto TerraGrappler at one point on my G500. I compared it's sidewall thickness to my stock Yokohama Geolander H/T (not HT-S) and found that the sidewall on the Yokos were slightly thicker. And when i put them on my G, the sidewall bulge out significantly, but did not think much of it because my rims were narrow. Anyway, just FYI, here are some pics of Nittos getting torn apart by RR owners:

http://rangerovers.net/forum/viewtop...=115302#115302

Although it is presumptuous for me to comment on this since i was not there, but you can easily see the carnage. And these guys are in luxury SUVs...so, i doubt that they did any hardcore-for-Jeep Rubicon-only stuff. But they did rock crawl and this is why i recommend people Goodyear Wrangler SilentArmor or BFG AT KO when they want an all-terrain tire and off-roading is part of their activity.

You be the judge from the pics....

So,BFGs never suffer damage? One blown tire doesn't make for a review of a tire not knowing the circumstances. Did it go flat and he continue to thrash the tire?

Also that is a lower profile version of the TerraGrappler and having less sidewall could be a problem.

I've wheeled with mine for over two years and hit some pretty harsh rocks over that time and my nittos are fine. I've yet to see anybody report any issues on the trails from the Nittos over on yotatech and there's plenty of members with them. Actually having a sidewall might be a big diff in my tires being fine.

All tires will fail time time but if I was off roading I wouldn't be using low profile tires period.

Maybe a good reason you can't buy BFGs in that size or can you?

Still not enough to make be spend a couple hundred more for the BFGs and suffer poor wet performance on pavement.

Thai, do you have any knowledge or experience on how well the Cooper Discoverer STT would compare in regards to sidewall strength?

There are 18" sizes for BFG AT KO...there is a new size 265/18 but it's hard to find. You can see the multiple scars/slashes/cracks on the sidewall. My guess is that he probably aired down on an already low-profile tire.

You're right...all tires fail at one point, but when i saw this pic, it reminded me of my experience with the Nittos.

But, i always remind people...you get what you paid for.

It should do fine...it is a mud tire and has 3-ply sidewall. Although the number of plies does not always equal increased strength, it should give you a general idea.

See my review of it here: http://www.toyota-4runner.org/showth...t&pagenumber=1

Scroll down.

"Cooper STT...from what i have been reading, these tires are pretty darn good and relatively cheap too. They come with siping from factory and is apparently very well made. Cooper is a USA company and has a good reputation, but in 2004, they did have to settle a few lawsuits due to material mishap resulting in a few deaths (similar to what Firestone went thru). Cooper tires are distributed everywhere in the world...and they are well known in Australia. These tires do well on-road...relatively quiet (probably on-par with Firestone M/T), do well in rain and snow/ice due to well-placed siping (similar to Toyo M/T above). They do well in mud from what i hear. They self-clean better than MT/R. On rocks, i hear that they are OK. Apparently, the rubber compound is hard...so these tires don't stick to rocks like MT/R (and the other MTs)...a review mentioned that this resulted in sliding sideways on rocks. Other people had no complaints about these tires on rocks. Treadwear is pretty good too, similar to above two tires."

If you follow the thread the guy driving the LR3 flattened 3 tires that day, only two of which were Nittos. Looks like driver error to me. Another Rover on that same trip was running Nittos and had zero problems.

YMMV

True...it all depends on if that other guy took the same path. From my understanding, the guy with the white RR is new to the terrain, while the guy in LR3 is more experienced. And the guy in the RR Sport is quite experience since he's into modifying his RRS. So, who knows, but don't we all make errors when rock crawling at some point?? And those rocks look typical of most places i go.

AGREED! This picture doesn't tell us anything other than that he continued to thrash the tire after it had punctured. I would expect any other tire to look worse for wear in this situation.

I do think there is a difference between the low profile version and the more common size tires. Even Discount lists the low profile versions separatly.

I've had my Nitto's sidewalls pressed into some jagged rocks and I admit I was nervous but they never even left a mark. If my Runner was just a weekend warrior I might stick with BFGs but my truck sees alot of pavement and on my truck my Nittos offer me a lot more perfromance than spending 25% more for BFGs.

If my Nittos fail when I don't think they should have I'd be the first to post the tale.

whats the pants hanging in the front grill guard? to ward off evil spirits?

I have no idea, but could it be to cover the winch during water crossings??

So does this mean that the Toyo Open Country tires are also weaker in the sidewall? The Toyo and the Nittos are basically the same right?

I would think so.

We live in a time when many so called A/T tires are not really A/T tires at all but a hiway tire with a little more "Bite". You can't really blame the tire co's for this change, over the years with A/T tires joe public wanted it that way. Many people wan't the look of an A/T tire but don't wan't the hard ride or all the noise so now you get a nice soft sidewall to go along with that nice quiet A/T tire.

Years ago an A/T tire ment a heavy duty tread with a strong sidewall but today There are just a handfull of real old school A/T tires. I think if I was doing any real off road I would go with a lite mud tire.

This is the reason I decided to try the Mastercraft Courser A/T-2 tires on my runner the Courser A/T-2 is not "P" rated or "LT" rated but it's a mid range tire between both. It has a deep tread and the sidewall is neither to lite or to stiff. I will keep the 4runner crew posted on how they wear as time goes on but so far so good.

My brother in law just bought some Firestone Destination M/T tires for his F-250 and im quiet impressed by them both on the road and off ............ He has had many M/T tires over the years and I would have to say I think this is the best one yet.

Your bro-in-law has good taste in tires! I love my Firestone Dest. M/Ts.