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Old 01-25-2008, 05:17 PM #61
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Quote:
Originally posted by webshot
Huh? You can drive on or off road in 4wd in a AT FJ. You just shift it to 4 hi.

90% of the time you dont need 4wd so having it in 2wd saves fuel big time. Either way, the FJ still has traction control like the 4runner and even better, it has A-Trac and locking rear diff for the hardcore stuff.

http://www.toyota.com/vehicles/minis...?section=1.2.1
My main point is the 4Runner is able to wheel in 4wd-low, without being center locked -- something no FJ can do. All FJ configurations are center locked when in 4wd-low, I believe. Wheeling in 4-low, unlocked, has to be experienced to be appreciated, imo. Easy steering for multi-point turns or turning around, no worries about driveline binding on rock, etc. (MT FJ owners, of course, can't help but experience 4wd high, unlocked).
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Old 01-25-2008, 05:19 PM #62
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Quote:
Originally posted by Thai
Yes, you can but only in a straight line on dry pavement. It's a part-time system...therefore, it canNOT be used on dry pavement unless you're just going straight. It is the same system that you see on the Tacoma. It is NOT the same system as you see on the 4runner. The manual tranny FJ has a similar system to the 4runner's.
From what I can tell, even the MTs are center locked when in low range. I appreciate the 4Runner more than ever.
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Old 01-25-2008, 05:24 PM #63
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Quote:
Originally posted by JB.
From what I can tell, even the MTs are center locked when in low range. I appreciate the 4Runner more than ever.
the FJ does not need a center lock, but yes it may be. It has A-Trac instead and a rear locking diff in addition.

I've owned a V8 4runner Limited, and yes it is a good car, but I have no real need for 4wd on dry hard paved roads.

If the road conditions are icy, wet, or anything but dry, I shift it to 4 hi.

Last edited by webshot; 01-25-2008 at 05:33 PM.
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Old 01-25-2008, 05:30 PM #64
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Quote:
Originally posted by Thai
Yes, you can but only in a straight line on dry pavement. It's a part-time system...therefore, it canNOT be used on dry pavement unless you're just going straight. It is the same system that you see on the Tacoma. It is NOT the same system as you see on the 4runner. The manual tranny FJ has a similar system to the 4runner's.
How are you guys driving your 4runners that you require awd or 4wd on dry pavement? Are you drifting with it or something?
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Old 01-25-2008, 05:46 PM #65
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Quote:
Originally posted by webshot
How are you guys driving your 4runners that you require awd or 4wd on dry pavement? Are you drifting with it or something?
Full-time 4wd on dry pavement can be advantageous when the weather varies. Even in rain, i would not put a part-time system in 4wd...not enough slippage. What if there is an oil slick in the middle of the highway?? You do not have time to go into 4-HI.

Or how about going over washboards at high speeds?? You can't be in 4-Hi all the time because what if you need to make turns? That is where full-time system works well.

Basically, having a center differential and full-time setting allows for more flexibility.
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Old 01-25-2008, 06:00 PM #66
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Quote:
Originally posted by webshot
the FJ does not need a center lock, but yes it may be. It has A-Trac instead and a rear locking diff in addition.

Sorry, but this sentence isn't making any sense to me. All Fjs have a center locked mode. It's the lack of a center unlocked mode that I'm talking about. Atrac has nothing to do with the center.
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Old 01-25-2008, 06:02 PM #67
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Quote:
Originally posted by webshot
If the road conditions are icy, wet, or anything but dry, I shift it to 4 hi.
This is actually WRONG to do! You shift into 4-Hi, and you shut OFF stability control! Therefore, not only is your steering limited (due to 4-HI engagement), but you have no electronic nanny to save your butt from spinning out (aka oversteer or understeer). I would trust VSC over 4HI on wet pavement anyday of the week!
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Old 01-25-2008, 06:58 PM #68
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Quote:
Originally posted by Thai
This is actually WRONG to do! You shift into 4-Hi, and you shut OFF stability control! Therefore, not only is your steering limited (due to 4-HI engagement), but you have no electronic nanny to save your butt from spinning out (aka oversteer or understeer). I would trust VSC over 4HI on wet pavement anyday of the week!
I stand corrected you are right. This would probably only work off road in snow conditions. I would not put too much faith in the VSC though.
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Old 01-25-2008, 07:00 PM #69
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Quote:
Originally posted by JB.
Sorry, but this sentence isn't making any sense to me. All Fjs have a center locked mode. It's the lack of a center unlocked mode that I'm talking about. Atrac has nothing to do with the center.
Perhaps I misunderstood.

What do you gain by having an unlocked center diff in 4low?
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Old 01-25-2008, 07:02 PM #70
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Quote:
Originally posted by webshot
I would not put too much faith in the VSC though.
I can tell that it's better than 99% of drivers on the road today. There is a reason why stability control will become mandatory on all cars, trucks, and SUVs by 2012. It works. It saves lives. Nothing more to it.
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Old 01-25-2008, 07:05 PM #71
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Quote:
Originally posted by webshot
Perhaps I misunderstood.

What do you gain by having an unlocked center diff in 4low?
Towing a boat out of water...hehehe, this is the only example that i could think of. I guess that having a center diff also allows you to make a tight turn while off-roading in 4-LO without having to go back into 2wd.
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Old 01-25-2008, 07:16 PM #72
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Quote:
Originally posted by Thai
I can tell that it's better than 99% of drivers on the road today. There is a reason why stability control will become mandatory on all cars, trucks, and SUVs by 2012. It works. It saves lives. Nothing more to it.
Very true.

The one thing I hate about the Toyota VSC that I noticed happens on both vehicles is that delay when you step on the gas right at the worst time when you need to GET GOING!

I've certainly learned not to put myself in those situations, but it happens.
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Old 01-25-2008, 07:20 PM #73
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Quote:
Originally posted by webshot
Very true.

The one thing I hate about the Toyota VSC that I noticed happens on both vehicles is that delay when you step on the gas right at the worst time when you need to GET GOING!

I've certainly learned not to put myself in those situations, but it happens.
Yeah, you're right...it happens with most (if not all) stability control systems. I think that, as drivers, we just need to adjust our driving habits, similar when we have to adapt to keep our foot on the brakes while ABS works.
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Old 01-26-2008, 04:51 PM #74
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Quote:
Originally posted by webshot

What do you gain by having an unlocked center diff in 4low?
Easing steering and no driveline stress.

When center locked, even on dirt there's always a little driveline stress before it gets relieved via a slipping wheel. On rock there can be considerably more. Even more than on pavement in some circumstances. The sharper the turn, the more the bind and the harder the steering. Most off-roading is on slippery dirt, but aired-down tires can wrap around rocks barely sticking out and it's not all that uncommon to find yourself on dirt, having to turn sharply, with the traction on all 4 tires considerably higher than just being on dirt alone. I don't like the hard steering feedback indicative of driveline stress so I don't lock unless I have a reason.

It mostly has to be classified as a luxury, but if driveline stress is cumulative, I can easily see it being beneficial to longer drive train life for frequent off-roaders. It's something that takes a lot of hours in the seat to appreciate, I think, and probably seems like a non-issue to most, but I'm thoroughly spoiled by it.

In my view, having the Torsen-3 center with a complete range of setting choices, including 4wd low, unlocked, is one of the most distinguishing advantages of the 4Runner over many other SUVs. For those who don't off-road much -- think roll down rear window. It's that cool.

Is it necessary? No. Is it nice to have? Definitely.
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Old 02-14-2008, 08:06 PM #75
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I bought a 07 limited 4runner v8 last month after getting out of a lifted 2wd 00 Tundra. Loved it at first, then thought it was too "tame" and not aggressive enough for me. Saw a sick TRD FJ at a local dealer and drove by it day after day. I went in one day and looked for it and it was gone. Actually test drove another 07 FJ with the 6speed. It seemed cool for a few minutes although I didn't care for the 6speed (long throw and long pedal play). But I wasn't the TRD one so I just left and thanked the salesman. As soon as I got back in my 4runner I fell in love with it all over again!

FJ's are what they are, as are the 4runners. If hardcore weekend off-roading is what you want then go for the FJ.

4Runners are what they are, sweet on road vehicles with a serious off road capability but more for the weekender snow drives and moderate offroad trips for camping.

Overall I think the 4runner could be every bit of an offroad vehicle the FJ is if there were some aftermarket products for it. But there isn't
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