Liberty? Get atta here.....

Canadian prices yes......in BC no less, so sticker price usually = selling price.

No such thing as rebates here until the 07's start to come out and they try to clear out the 06's....even then you'll be lucky to get $1000 or 2 off full sticker.

I think you need to get some good seat time with the 4th gen traction control off-road. Not the equal of a locker but I'm betting it's much closer than you think.

Put 32" tires and sliders on a 4th gen V8 and you'd have to look pretty hard for a trail that would admit the FJ and stop the 4runner.

For me, i would get the 4runner over FJ anyday...add in 32" tires and ARB rear locker. Remember, it is possible to get 97% of FJC's capability in a 4runner, but it is impossible for FJC to get anywhere close to 4runner's practicality. I have looked under FJC underbody...not much different than 4runner. No more clearance. 4runner also has significantly better visibility.

Now, add in FJC's "market value adjustment" pricing bullshit and lack of incentives, there is no comparison between 4runner and FJC. In addition, you can get V8 power in 4runner for a bit more $$. FJC has no such option.

As it stands now, the FJC has too many on-road/off-road compromises. I don't see where the intensive off-road research went in the FJC...it's frame, suspension, and powertrains are nearly identical to 4runner/Taco. Basically, Toyota use the Prado's short-wheelbase frame (overseas GX470/4runner) and then add in 4runner's powertrain and a rear locker. They made the ATRAC system a bit more aggressive. That's it. And this is Toyota's dedicated off-road answer to the Jeep Rubicon and Hummers?!

When i crawled underneath FJC, i noticed that the underbody behind rear axle is completely empty...a waste of space. BTW, this space is where the spare tire on the 4runner goes. FJC carries the spare tire on the rear cargo door. I wish that they could move the fuel tank to that space and clear up the underbody b/w the axles...thereby increasing breakover angle and underbody clearance. I know...this may create problems with rear crash testing. However, if you reinforce the area right, then it will do well. Or, at the very least, Toyota could have made a deep waterproof storage well to throw in your stinky muddy stuff. It should be deep enough without affecting departure angle.

For me, i would get the 4runner over FJ anyday...add in 32" tires and ARB rear locker. Remember, it is possible to get 97% of FJC's capability in a 4runner by adding bigger tires and rear locker, but it is impossible for FJC to get anywhere close to 4runner's practicality. 4runner also has significantly better visibility, which is very important in both daily driving and off-roading.

And of course, a solid B-pillar is always better than suicide doors in a side crash and over the long haul. I wonder if the body's integrity will be affected down the road (e.g. after many miles of off-roading) due to lack of solid B-pillar.

My opinion.

I'm sure Toyota is hoping that people like us would still prefer the 4Runner to the FJ......it wasn't made to steal 4Runner buyers away guys

Marketing and sales issues aside, from an off-road buyer's standpoint, I was a little surprised, too. Why not better angles and ground clearance? I haven't seen any mention of a long-travel gas pedal when in low range. This is a feature I lust over and it seems conspicous by its absence. Judging by the early reactions, they'll probably sell a boatload of 'em, though.

I agree. I would also have liked: 4:1 Low range, KDSS (from GX470), and more clearance underneath.

4:1 Low range: this is standard on Jeep Rubicon and on Adventure Hummer H3. This is a great off-roading tool to have for any off-roader. 4:1 crawling also prevents damage.

KDSS: well, i know...this is exclusive to Lexus. However, since the new '07 Rubicon will have optional sway-bar disconnects, i think that Toyota should step up and offer KDSS for FJC. IMHO, FJC is where KDSS belongs. This will help out the relative lack of wheel travel on the FJC (as compared to Rubicon or even the Hummer H3). According to MotorTrend, H3 has a better RTI rating (521 vs. 491). If you were to add in KDSS, then FJC should easily match (or beat) H3. Of course, the new Rubicon has RTI of 832 with the disconnects!

When i crawled underneath FJC, i noticed that the underbody behind rear axle is completely empty...a waste of space. BTW, this space is where the spare tire on the 4runner goes. FJC carries the spare tire on the rear cargo door. I wish that they could move the fuel tank to that space and clear up the underbody b/w the axles...thereby increasing breakover angle and underbody clearance. I know...this may create problems with rear crash testing. However, if you reinforce the area right, then it will do well. Or, at the very least, Toyota could have made a deep waterproof storage well to throw in your stinky muddy stuff. It should be deep enough without affecting departure angle.

I wonder if there will be another Highlander then? I personally would have the 4R over the FJ any day.

But the FJ should be a great off roader... I was browsing through the Toyota website and for accessories, they offer sliders. Toyota calls them something else though, side rails or something to that tune.

Oh definetly.....the Highlander, FJ, 4Runner and RAV all appeal to different buyers/market segments.

well i went from Raleigh to Greensboro Sunday and spotted on the otherside of the highway a yellow, black, and blue FJs all in a line coming back to Raleigh, i got excited and im sure i scared the hell out of my mom

All arguing and opinions aside I'd still take a Runner over the FJ due to the type of driving I would use it for and that being a DD the FJ just doesn't have the comfort a Runner has and never will.

I like the new 4Runners but I also like aguing too. This board needs these threads to be busy since some just die off too quick.

I think the FJ is pretty cool but personally I like my 06 4R better . I was a little disappointed in the FJ styling , ground clearance , stance , ect.... I'm sure it's a cabable truck/SUV for offroad but I think with the right driver the 4R could pretty much go 90% where the FJ would go.

I also kind of think it's geared to to dip into the H2 or mainly the H3 market. personally I think most of the people who buy the H3 will never go off road and do not even have a clue about offroading.

I really like the Tacoma Sport look's and stance and would love it if my 4R was on that chasis , I think it would look so tough.

Here's one with good pics from an owner over on yotatech.

http://www.yotatech.com/showthread.php?t=82254

What is Toyota's love affair with the Dunlop Grantrek AT20's all about?!?!?! Do they have to put them on every SUV they make?? I know their cheap, but come on!

I test drove one at lunch today. A yellow one and I felt like I was driving a schoolbus. The whole dash and windshield is completely different than anything I've ever driven.

The drive was nice and the pickup was good but right now there are just too many compromises to my 4Runner to justify trading for one.

If you can use mirrors then I don't see any rear vision problems. It is all the little things that I would miss in the 4Runner.



If a convertable comes out I WILL buy one as a second vehicle.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by OUTRNNR
What is Toyota's love affair with the Dunlop Grantrek AT20's all about?!?!?! Do they have to put them on every SUV they make?? I know their cheap, but come on! [/QUOTE


They do that because when they MFG a truck / car or whatever it's put out to bid for the size and spec's they want and who ever come's in with the cheapest bid for that amount of volume of tire needed.