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Old 01-13-2021, 02:58 PM #46
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For sure, keeping it until I die; I have my 95 Taco or Wifes Camry to drive if I need to save on gas.
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Old 01-13-2021, 03:38 PM #47
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Convert it to propane.
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Old 01-13-2021, 05:52 PM #48
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Yes. First, it would be hard to sell a semi-gas-guzzler at that point, and second, I too have an alternative, a 2006 Scion xA that averages around 37mpg combined. In light of recent developments, $3.50 gas in the midwest by end of summer won't surprise me.
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Old 01-15-2021, 11:54 AM #49
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Interesting thoughts on this. $8/gal gas for an extended period of time would probably lead to some pretty big changes in transportation - at least in less urban areas. My 4Runner would get a lot fewer miles and I would look at different options. I agree with Jay Leno that no matter the price at the pump electric vehicles will eventually make all internal combustion engine vehicles a hobby.
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Old 01-15-2021, 05:15 PM #50
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Convert it to propane.
Piss off climate goons who refuse to acknowledge that NYC was ice-free BEFORE modern man was around, and that "global warming / climate change" is CYCLICAL depending on the orientation of the sun and Earth.



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Old 01-15-2021, 05:23 PM #51
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I'll pay what I have to pay. It's better to keep driving a 20,30,40 year old machine that a brand new EV. Lithium mines are just raping the earth in another way. The voltages in an EV can easily be fatal - there is very little system repair you can do yourself, etc., etc......That said, the writing is on the wall. We are relics.
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Old 01-15-2021, 05:49 PM #52
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Piss off climate goons who refuse to acknowledge that NYC was ice-free BEFORE modern man was around, and that "global warming / climate change" is CYCLICAL depending on the orientation of the sun and Earth.



Pipe down! This is about $/gallon nothing to do with climate change which is real by the way.

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Old 01-15-2021, 06:51 PM #53
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Here's a visual that might contribute to the conversation. Looks like 4Runners are sort-of in the upper middle-ish of the pack in terms of costs to operate, but boy do they pollute. (The two dots waaay out in the upper right are . . . surprise . . . both Toyotas too: Sequoia and Lexus GX460.)

Source: Carboncounter.com | Cars evaluated against climate targets
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Old 01-15-2021, 07:05 PM #54
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Pipe down! This is about $/gallon nothing to do with climate change which is real by the way.

Yeah, it is real. It is NATURAL.
I used to be in the field. I know more about it than you.
Not trying to be an ass, but EDUCATE others.

And yes, higher gas prices cause people to drive less, and that is their ultimate goal. Wait till the tax PER MILE starts.

So, tell me, what happened to the glaciers over NYC?
When did they retreat?
How were the Finger Lakes formed?
How did Glacial Erractics end up in Central Park and all over the Northeast?
How is it that we are actually entering a new ice age, but it won't be for another ~9,000 years and "WE" will never see it?
If humans did not put out wildfires, and they burned out of control, what happens?
Why is it okay to clear-cut forests to install solar farms when black panels absorb the most radiation?
How does the tilt of the Earth play into all this?


What happens if you put ice into a cup and fill it to the brim with water?
Why doesn't it over flow?

What happens when sediment displaces water in dams? which is a HUGE problem for capacity. Apply that with sediment from land into the oceans.

What happens when tectonic action allows volcanoes to form under the ocean, which also displaces water?

I already have the answers, so it is just food for thought.
Earth IS a giant recycling facility.
The oceans are the largest carbon sink, yet they focus on trees that, again, they clear-cut for solar.
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Old 01-15-2021, 07:13 PM #55
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Pipe down! This is about $/gallon nothing to do with climate change which is real by the way.
It kinda is about climate change, because belief in man-made climate change is what fuels a lot of the push toward EV, which would drive the price of gasoline. There’s no proof of man-made CC, only theories. And the CC that we can prove historically is indeed cyclical. Scientists say we’ve had 5 ice ages. We didn’t participate in any of them, it seems.
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Old 01-15-2021, 07:16 PM #56
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I'll pay what I have to pay. It's better to keep driving a 20,30,40 year old machine that a brand new EV. Lithium mines are just raping the earth in another way. The voltages in an EV can easily be fatal - there is very little system repair you can do yourself, etc., etc......That said, the writing is on the wall. We are relics.
Carbon will be released and recycled no matter what.
If that process stopped, so would life.

Ever see the older aerial shots of Sudbury, Ontario around their nickel smelter?
NASA used to train and test moon vehicles there.
Sudbury was a mineral training ground for NASA astronauts - Northern Ontario Business
NASA reps visit Sudbury to test Moon mining robots with NORCAT - Northern Ontario Business


(The pics are hard to find. I am looking now)
Okay. I spent a few minutes looking.
They were once easy to find, now it seems they do not exist.
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Old 01-15-2021, 07:17 PM #57
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It kinda is about climate change, because belief in man-made climate change is what fuels a lot of the push toward EV, which would drive the price of gasoline. Thereís no proof of man-made CC, only theories. And the CC that we can prove historically is indeed cyclical. Scientists say weíve had 5 ice ages. We didnít participate in any of them, it seems.


Bingo. And you and I will not see the next one, so they figure "why not profit"...
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Old 01-15-2021, 07:50 PM #58
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It kinda is about climate change, because belief in man-made climate change is what fuels a lot of the push toward EV, which would drive the price of gasoline. Thereís no proof of man-made CC, only theories. And the CC that we can prove historically is indeed cyclical. Scientists say weíve had 5 ice ages. We didnít participate in any of them, it seems.
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Bingo. And you and I will not see the next one, so they figure "why not profit"...
You are both wrong. Oil is traded like a commodity. Half of each gallon of gas is directly related to the price of gas the rest is refinery stock and distribution . To the contrary EVs don't raise the prices of gas. The oil cartel countries try to control the supply of crude but it has less effect here. Infact US was the largest producer of crude in the last couple of years. A debate' "Believing that climate change is natural and not man made" should be in the off topic section.
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Old 01-15-2021, 08:08 PM #59
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You are both wrong. Oil is traded like a commodity. Half of each gallon of gas is directly related to the price of gas the rest is refinery stock and distribution . To the contrary EVs don't raise the prices of gas. The oil cartel countries try to control the supply of crude but it has less effect here. Infact US was the largest producer of crude in the last couple of years. A debate' "Believing that climate change is natural and not man made" should be in the off topic section.


I'll "agree" with you just because...

When oil goes away, what happens to the roads?
Our roads are paved in black gold.
Roofing shingles?
Sealants?
Solvents?

Ahhh, what can be produced with oil...


And if you cared so much, you should not be driving around in a 19MPG 4Runner, nor should anyone modify their vehicle BEFORE the stock parts are worn out...
And you would not be going off-roading, tearing up the skin of the Earth...
You would be sitting home in a dark house, no phone, no TV, no internet, because THAT is green!
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Old 01-15-2021, 08:09 PM #60
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You are both wrong. Oil is traded like a commodity. Half of each gallon of gas is directly related to the price of gas the rest is refinery stock and distribution . To the contrary EVs don't raise the prices of gas. The oil cartel countries try to control the supply of crude but it has less effect here. Infact US was the largest producer of crude in the last couple of years. A debate' "Believing that climate change is natural and not man made" should be in the off topic section.
You may be partly correct, but if EVs grow enough in popularity, they certainly will affect the price of gas. And agreed, the man-made climate change discussion belongs elsewhere, but that belief does affect many people’s decisions on vehicles. But again, that has nothing to do with me keeping my 4R if gas hits $8. Discussions simply tend to spawn other discus.
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