In Texas, to get conceal handgun license:

1. Class Part 1: full 12 hours of gun ownership lesson and test taken afterwards
2. Class Part 2: after 12 hours, you then go to a gun range and have to shoot your gun and score a minimum on the point system to pass
3. Wait 3-6 months (if not longer) while your background and everything gets checked out at both state AND federal levels.

"Gun control advocates argue that the police are there to protect us from criminals and the military from invaders. But in 1992, the National Guard and police refused to engage hoodlums during the Los Angeles riots, effectively abandoning people to their fate. Nevertheless many Korean merchants successfully used firearms with high-capacity magazines, which Congress has since banned, to fend off rioters. Their stores still stood after the riots."

"Texas is a good example. In the early 1990s, Texas’s serious crime rate was 38 percent above the national average. Since then, serious crime in Texas has dropped 50 percent faster than for the nation as a whole. All this happened after passage of a concealed-carry law in 1994."

That's interesting DC...you post your "background" as if we supposed to believe it. Fine. You have "seen" the real raw data...yet have not posted them. You criticize my data as being bias...yet post nothing to dispute them except "trusting" your words.

oops, DC deleted his post. NEVERMIND.

STOP!
Did you even read my comment? No one is saying take your guns away you hick.
AHHHHH.

Ok. I won't try. All I will say is this. You are killing the GOP. You and Rick Perry and everyone else to f'ing stupid to think about options.

You think calling someone a "liberal" gives your argument power, when all it does is signal to everyone that you haven't an original thought in your head.

Your argument about Katrina is laughable. KEEP YOU GUN. No one has suggested you give it up. The point, which you seem to have missed, is that effective police force keep and manage crime.
Not eliminate. I get it. Keep your gun for the zombies you are planning for. I get it.


Katrina happens all the time. Want to know what solves it, the entrenchment of police forces. Tell you what, cowboy, go on over the Somalia and see if owning a gun solves anything.

In Katrina. In The L.A. Riots. In Earthquakes. After major civic disruptions, know what re-installs piece and order? It isn't crazy hicks. It is civic order returning.

You want data. You are welcome to look at it. Usually it isn't as neat and pretty as people want.

So. Do what I do. All the info is widely available.

Wander over to the FBI/ Census and pull stats. Then, do a multivariate analysis.

For example. When you look at crime data from 1980 to now, you see several things. A peak in crime, per capita in roughly the mid-80's and then a sharp decline.


Now. Do you understand the difference between a correlation and causal relationship? This is vital to understanding how data interacts.

Well, when you look at crime stats you see several things.

Causal relationships: We have seen that these key things seem to impact crime
1. Density of population
2. Economic factors
3. Police Force


Non-Causal :
Relationships that fail to show a cause and effect
1. Demographics - Race makeup (contrary to popular mythology)
2. Gun Ownership

But, lets be honest. There are 2 things you don't try to convince people about.

1. Abortion
2. Guns

Bigger question...did you read my comments? Or better yet, did you read what this thread is about???? It is NOT about crime rate...it is about conceal carry to protect oneself and where to do so while in a car. Sure, i got sucked in by your nonesense. AHHHHHHH. See, i can do that too.

So, with all this smack talk from you, all you can come up with is for me to find the data myself?????? Geez, arguments like yours are real easy! Geez, don't you have access to these data on a daily basis with your "job"?? Why are you directing me to some other site? Post your data here in PDF format.

Where's the beef man?

No, it is because local store ran out of TVs to steal!

Actually, this asian redneck prefer Cain over Perry...so, take that back to your stat analysis!

On Thursday, May 27, 1999, Darrell Scott, the father of Rachel Scott, a victim of the Columbine High School shootings in Littleton, Colorado, addressed a subcommittee of the House Judiciary Committee. He pointed out that the first recorded act of violence occurred when Cain slew his brother Abel:

“The villain was not the club he used. Neither was it the ... the National Club Association. The true killer was Cain, and the reason for the murder could only be found in Cain’s heart.”

He went on to say,

“In the days that followed the Columbine tragedy, I was amazed at how quickly fingers began to be pointed at groups such as the NRA [National Rifle Association]. I am not a member of the NRA. I am not a hunter. I do not even own a gun. I am not here to represent or defend the NRA because I don’t believe that they are responsible for my daughter’s death. Therefore I do not believe that they need to be defended.”

He added,

“When something as terrible as Columbine’s tragedy occurs, politicians immediately look for a scapegoat such as the NRA. They immediately seek to pass more restrictive laws that erode away our personal and private liberties. We do not need more restrictive laws. Eric and Dylan [perpetrators of the Columbine massacre] would not have been stopped by metal detectors. No amount of gun laws can stop someone who spends months planning this type of massacre.... Political posturing and restrictive legislation are not the answers.”

DC, are syaing that gun owners are "Crazy Hicks" or "Cowboys"? Or just people from Texas are Hicks and Cowboys? Even though I live in Georgia, I am from Detroit (Ann Arbor actually) and am far from a southern boy but I like guns. I dont obsess over them but I find them fun to shoot, hell my favorite is my 10/22 and 22/45 from Ruger, super cheap to shoot and I wont go deaf shooting them.

Yeah, for a self-proclaimed "GOP Member of Congress" from TN, owning more firearms than i have ever seen, and his father is sheriff in Montana, he sure speaks poorly.

He works with GAO and CBO everyday...and sees "real stats"...yet, all he can do is point me to some website on the net???

Seriously? Did you read my bio? I am 1. A TN southerner. 2. Member of NRA, 3. Large firearm collecter. 4. Active member for GOP 5. Worker for a GOP member of Congress.

My point is that there are some members of OUR, MY, Whatever party. That refuse to accept reality and cling to time honored opinions, that have been shown to be untrue.


Anyway. No one wants your gun. My point was that a far more effective public policy to reduce crime is to increase the effectiveness of the police force.


Here is an interesting study I stumbled across:
Rates of Household Firearm Ownership and Homicide Across US Regions and States, 1988


Now again. It admits no causality.

In VA:

1. Take 2 hour online course.
2. Take test that a moron could pass and print certificate of completion.
3. Present certificate at courthouse and wait a week for license.

Seriously, didn't touch a gun once in the whole process. It's kind of sickening.

I speak poorly, or I speak OF poorly? Two different things.

Stats. Come on man. Are you in or out of college?

Here. Enjoy. You see, in the big boy world; results are not spoonfed, you have to analyse the data. So do it.

FBI — Uniform Crime Reports


You will see the number of crimes is rising, but not at the same level of the population. IN fact, per capita crime started falling in the 1990's. At this point, more and more states were enacting more effective police departments in response to the 70's and 80's.

Better training. Better funding.

Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS)

The 2012 Statistical Abstract: Crimes and Crime Rates


Everything you need to know is there. I recommend using SPSS for the statistical break down and the R factor determinate.


What you get, after it all is a determinant rating. You take that, you examine other factors.. you copy, rinse and repeat several thousand times.

Here is some for you:
http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/uscrime.htm

There are actually 3..... lets see if I can remember the 3rd - ah - religion