As a newish member here, I've been flipping though many threads and have noticed a few questions about if a particular mod would have warranty implications. Accordingly, I thought that I would provide a bit of information about mods and warranties.

This post is not intended to dissuade anyone from modding their new(ish) car, but is intended to get folks to carefully consider any unintended consequences of a mod.

As far as warranties are concerned, anything that changes the performance characteristics of the vehicle may cause warranty woes. Some mods, like lighting, may not only cause warranty issues but may also cause you to fail inspection. For example, there is NO legal way to modify the headlights on our cars - let me repeat that - all the HID and LED conversions that are sold here are not legal to sell.

Even somewhat innocuous mods like SprintBoosters and suspension can cause issues far beyond the item itself.

About 9 years ago, we started a long discussion on the BMW forum about mods and warranties. While the BMW crowd tended to do more engine/ECU mods than members here, the same basic tenets apply except here it becomes a bit trickier because SEMA vendors frequently mis-quote the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act.

The first to post was Jonathan Spira (the editor of "The Diesel Driver" - now "The Green Car Driver") who said:

"Before we go too far, I wonder, based on the posts I've seen, if anyone besides myself has read Magnuson Moss end to end.

First, the following - which was posted above as being part of the Act, is not part of the Act but someone else's quasi-introductory text which was posted on another Web site.

US Code - Title 15, Chapter 50, Sections 2301-2312

Legally, a vehicle manufacturer cannot void the warranty on a vehicle due to an aftermarket part unless they can prove that the aftermarket part caused or contributed to the failure in the vehicle (per the Magnuson Moss Warranty Act (15 U.S.C. 2302(C)) . For best results, consider working with performance-oriented dealerships with a proven history of working with customers. If your vehicle manufacturer fails to honor emission/warranty claims, contact EPA at (202) 260-2080 or United States Environmental Protection Agency | US EPA. If federal warranty protection is denied, contact the FTC at (202) 326-3128 or Federal Trade Commission | Protecting America's Consumers. For additional information, check out the following links:

1. Consumers Bill of Rights
2. What You Can Do If Your Warranty Is Denied
3. Federal Warranty Laws
4. Vehicle Manufacturer Warranty Contact Phone Numbers

So now that we've gotten that out of the way, I'll explain the Act and why the Act itself has nothing to do with the subject of modifications (if you don't believe my statement, other than what I quoted above is the actual text of the act - there is no language contained therein that addresses this).

Magnuson Moss is the federal law that governs consumer warranties.

What seems to confuse 99% of the population is that it covers tie-in sales provisions, specifically not allowing them. Tie-in sales provisions have little in common with mods.

A tie-in sales provision would mean that the seller requires the purchaser of the warranteed product to buy an item used with or for the product FROM the seller or a specified company in order to be eligible to receive a remedy under the terms of the warranty.

If company x sells photocopy machines, and company x requires you to use ONLY company x toner to ensure continuing warranty coverage, that is a tie-in. Such a tie-in is not permissible. Company x cannot restrict your use of toner from third parties. However, if you use the wrong toner and the machine breaks (and this is NOT covered by the Act, this is just common sense), you have no warranty to speak of.

A mfr. can indeed void a warranty if the purchaser modifies whatever it is they have purchased. Not allowing the mfr. to void the warranty would be inane. But in practice it generally has to be shown that the modification in some way precipitated or was connected with the failure. The example someone gave of putting blackline lights on a car that then has an engine failure is a great example of this, but it has nothing to do with the Act.

My father was involved in the development of Magnuson Moss. The warranty from his company (Spiratone) was used as one example of a a good warranty and he gave testimony in open Congressional hearings on the subject."

I further clarified with this:

"Let me try to explain mods and warranties in logical layman's term. I'm sure that some will come up with all sorts of nebulous arguments but they are not real world.

1. The oft misquoted MM act has nothing to do with performance parts. It was enacted to keep manufacturers from requiring the use of a specific brand of replacement part in order to keep the warranty intact.

Accordingly, the use of a "substantially similar" replacement is OK and the manufacturer must show that the "substantially similar" part caused the failure if they refuse warranty service for that failure.

In practical terms, this means that you can substitute a Osram H7 bulb for the Bosch H7 that the car originally came with.

2. Let's look at performance parts for a moment. By definition, performance parts are not "substantially similar" as they are intended to alter the performance characteristics of a system. Based upon this, performance parts fall outside the scope of the MM act.

In order to refuse warranty service for a failure, the manufacturer (legally) merely needs to show that a part that is not "substantially similar" was used and that this part could have caused the failure. At this point, the burden of proof shifts to the consumer to prove that the part did not cause the failure.

Going back to out lightbulb example, if you have an electrical failure and you've replaced your 55w bulbs with 85w "hyperwhites" or LED's then the dealer is under an obligation to the manufacturer to refuse warranty service on the failure if they believe that the performance bulbs caused the failure.

Simple - right?

Now, let's talk warranty a moment.

3. The term "void the warranty" is often bandied about by both consumers and dealers alike.

Very few things will actually "void the warranty." This was alluded to by other posters but not fully explained. If a car is so badly abused, or modded to the point where virtually every system failure can be traced back to a mod, then the manufacturer can "void the warranty." A flood damaged car or one that was in a severe accident might also be candidates for the manufacturer to void the warranty on the entire car.

Mitsubishi voided the warranty on a bunch of cars that they saw were used at racetracks.

What is commonly referred to as "voiding the warranty" actually refers to a dealer refusing warranty service on a particular service.

Quite simply, if a dealer believes that a modification, chip, performance part, abuse or whatnot caused (or substantially contributed) to a failure, then he has an obligation to the manufacturer to refuse warranty service on that failure.

Accordingly, using our lighting example again, the dealer could refuse warranty service on any electrical failure. This could actually extend to ECUs or the entire electrical system.

Farfetched? Not really. A few years back a guy on VWVortex decided to paint his sidemarker bulbs silver on his brand new Jetta.

The bulb heated up, melted the paint and dripped into the housing. The housing melted and shorted out parts of the wiring loom. Since the Jetta uses a CAN-BUS, the whole thing needed replacement $2500 later the car was on the road again.

4. Why doesn't the dealer give the customer the benefit of the doubt? The manufacturer often asks for parts back to determine the cause of the failure. They are extremely vigilant for failures that often are seen on modded cars.

Fell free to argue until you're blue in the face - but - like it or not, the above is the way it is.

You can always find a lawyer who will argue a different viewpoint, but that doesn't mean it is right.

So, what is the bottom line?

ANY mod may cause warranty woes. Consider ALL the implications of any mod you are contemplating and be mentally and monetarily prepared to pay for the consequences.

Read your owner's manual carefully. It specifically warns against engine (ECU) and suspension mods as examples of mods that will cause problems.

Feel free to mod away, but remember that you might have to pay to play. The other posters who say "just do it" aren't the ones that will have to foot the bill.

As a clarification - there is some heated discussion about the manufacturer's burden of proof regarding the use of "performance parts" but the bottom line remains the same.

In addition, if the manufacturer allows a case to go to court then there is a good bet that he has sufficient evidence to back up their claim."

Again, none of this is intended to keep anyone from modding, but please weigh the upsides against the downsides.

Save all the stock parts.

If there is an issue, reinstall the stock parts and take it back for warranty repair.

Pretty simple really.

Sure. You're on a cross country drive and break down in the middle of Death Valley. You have all of your tools and stock parts with you. You just happen to find a lift behind a sand dune and put all your stock bits in.

Of course you have to be very careful to make sure not to leave any traces of your installs - no holes in the firewall, no scratches on nuts and bolts or you'll end up like the guy with the 335 BMW who had his warranty voided because he removed several mods badly before he took his car in for service.

In his case, he was charged criminally for attempted warranty fraud.

The bottom line is that if you have a failure that normally only occurs with a certain mod - and there is evidence that the mod was previously there - then the dealer has an obligation to refuse warranty service on that failure.

There is a far better way.

Figure out what your mods can break and then budget for that repair if the warranty repair is denied.

Build a relationship with a couple of service advisors. While we frequently talk about "mod friendly dealers" there really is no such thing. What there is, is a reasonable dealer who looks at each fault individually and doesn't unfairly say "caused by a mod" just because he or she sees some sort of a mod.

Be honest about your mods. If you broke something cheap (trim piece, lost a screw etc.), buy it at the dealership and stop by the service advisor, shoot the breeze if it is quiet and commiserate about the part you broke and that you bought another to replace it. That sets the stage that you are willing to own up to your mistakes.

Take your car in for regular servicing periodically. The day following the service, drop off a couple of cases of sodas. This is more effective than tipping, because this causes the techs to say "where did these come from?" and someone will say "the guy with that cool 4R with the orange wheels."

When you go to the dealer with a warranty issue, you'll be the nice guy who fixes his own mistakes, so this must be a warranty issue. They will look for ways to approve your warranty claim rather than trying to find ways to deny it.

Or you can drive around with all your tools and all your spare parts...

Guess how i know you are super fun at a party....

So I'm a party pooper because I think it makes sense to think before you mod?

You willing to foot the bill for every failed mod on this forum?

Cheers.

@cb1111 thanks for the good information! I knew this but not to the extent of your detailed description.

Knowing this, my only mods are going to be LED bars behind the grill fed from an independent sPod. I did add switches mounted in the blanks drawing voltage from the wiper heater to lite the switch but drive the sPod. I knew that if I goofed, it would be “on me”.

Good discussion sir! You can be my lawyer!


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Thanks. These posts are always difficult because you end up coming off like some straight laced NHTSA Nazi or somebody who is anti-mod.

Truth is, it is fun to personalize your car. It is also nice to drive a car a bit, figure out what you don't like (or what you think the car needs) and mod it for your needs.

A manufacturer walks a fine line between capability, fuel economy, comfort and cost. Unfortunately, some parts are at their performance limits and may last 300k miles, but may fail if a related system is modded.

I'm a bit OCD about this stuff so I research everything to death before I buy it. It'll probably be a half year before I get a 4R but by then I'll hopefully know where the weaknesses are and what the workarounds are.

I'll drive it for a couple of months and see what I don't like. Since I've been hanging out here, I'll hopefully know about how to fix what I don't like.

Being on the regulatory side, I often wonder about some of the common mods - do the bull bars/bumpers work nicely with the airbag systems? I know the manufacturers all say "sure", but have they been crash tested? Of course not, so how can we know how the safety systems work?

The only way I know is by having first hand reports of people with those bumpers that have been in an accident - not quite crash testing standards but it might give us an idea.

Don't forget some of us no longer have a warranty.

Don't forget some of don't care if it voids the warranty.

Don't forget some of us void the warranty on every thing we own.

Hasn't personally cost me any unnecessary repair bills yet............remember we drive 4runners, not Jeeps.


The bottom line is if you don't know what you're doing, don't do it.

As an example, if you think it might void your warranty and that warranty is so much more important to you than having a lift, or LED's or anytime backup camera or whatever (insert mod here) THEN DON'T DO IT.

Great post, thanks OP.

It really irks me seeing the sleazy tactics some modders use to try an cover their tracks and get something fixed that was clearly caused by their mod.

I don’t see it much with 4Runners but we also own an F150 EcoBoost and the attempted warranty fraud in that group is epic. 480+ HP modded 3.5L V6 turbos and they cry and whine when the engines pop and the dealer finds tuner codes and refuses warranty. I’d love an extra 100 horsepower, but I’m not willing to risk a $10k engine replacement, nor would I expect Ford to pick up the tab.

The problem arises when everyone winds up paying more for a vehicle because of this nonsense, the manufacturers certainly aren’t going to eat the costs. I also believe that it harms everyone by delaying the warranty process while extra tests for modding are investigated, adding even more cost.

We bought toyotas so we dont have to mess with warranties mod your balls off people

Edit: dont forget resale boost if you're a little different

I just reread this and it's a very solid point about how an aftermarket bumper can mean a lot in court. Previous post was based more on warranty vs liability. I still say mod to what you want though- you only live once and it's still way safer than most

Not normally PC but fess up nazis is a little extreme for a safety group

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Not trying to shill here, but I was looking at the ARB website the other day and their bumper section claims they do crash testing on what they claim are air bag compatible bumpers. Granted ARB is a bit bigger than many of the small shops making custom parts, but if what they claim is true, the data might be available somewhere. Then again, it might just be marketing wank.

ARB USA | Bumpers & 4x4 Protection Equipment - ARB USA

You are correct on a lot of your points that you made but you are not right on the above statement, at least not in the Toyota world.

I was a parts department manager for a large Toyota dealer for many years, so I handled every warranty claim and all warranty parts that Toyota recalled for "inspection". The total volume of all recalled parts was probably less then 5% of total claims, the rest of the parts were simply scrapped. Also if you didn't have the recalled part then you could also file for an exception stating why you didn't have the part. Most of those exceptions were granted as well. Parts that Toyota recalled were interesting as well. Large items like the occasional engine or other heavy items were extremely rare but things like bulbs and fuses were quite common. The reason most of these items for recalled were more for accountability purposes rather than an actual inspection by some engineer to determine a root cause of failure. They wanted to make sure the dealers weren't making bogus claims and that the parts departments were keeping warrantied parts.

On another note. Service writers and techs pay are very heavily weighted on commission. Trust me they want to approve every warranty job they can. If they "void your warranty" they aren't making a dime. No writer or service department in their right mind is running around looking for excuses to deny claims. The only claims I saw denied were cars that were damaged in accidents are something. If you think there a actual service department employees that are there look out for Toyota Corp best interest then you are sadly mistaken. Every single one of them are trying to make money for themselves and provide for their families.

Bringing you vehicle in for regular maintenance and getting to know your service department goes a long way when something comes up that is questionable. Also just being smart when you mod and knowing your limits if you are warranty concerned.

I agree wholeheartedly with each of your comments as long as you go into a mod with your eyes open.

The problem is that often - either through ignorance or because of "forum peer pressure" - some people may jump into mods without considering the downsides.