Tricky Transmission situation...
I know this is long and ridiculous, but please read! I needs your help wizards of T4R! I've read through a number of different threads on transmission fluid and none have yet addressed my unique situation!
So I've run into a sort of odd situation with my transmission and was really hoping some of you guys could help me--I know there are some Toyota service tech geniuses out there! I'm running a 2004 V8 SR5...so no trans dipstick. :Cry: My T4R is needing a transmission fluid change (badly)--just stumbled across the previous owner's receipt for the last trans flush which was at 114,000 miles. It's at 192,000+ at the moment (calm down, only 15,000 are mine) and is just starting to exhibit some mildly different behavior in shifting and at highway speeds operation, which I (in my limited knowledge) attribute to the transmission. If the only receipt I have for a trans flush is indeed the last time the fluids were changed, that puts the fluid at about 78,000 miles. Worse yet, the previous owner had this service performed at a JiffyLube. :ybrick: According to the receipt, they used 10qts of Dexron III and an extra quart of additive (whatever that was) in their flush. So here is my dilemma, as I would like to return to Toyota WS: 1)Are Dexron III and Toyota WS compatible? I've scoured the internet like a frat boy for a drunk chick (no offense frat boys...or drunk chicks) and haven't found any conclusive answers. If they are compatible I would feel safe to do a few drain and fills over a short period of time to rejuvenate the fluids. But if they aren't compatible... 2)Do I do a full flush and replace with WS? Toyota dealers don't recommend doing a flush, however when I spoke to a "service advisor" he said the drain and fill will get rid of 98% of the old fluid...which I think is "slightly" optimistic so I'm not exactly sure how much weight to give his advice. I realize the dangers of flushing a transmission with this many miles, however if it truly hasn't been serviced in 78,000 miles I'm between a rock and a hard place--a flush might "shock" the transmission, a drain and fill with Toyota WS might not be a compatible combination with Dexron III. Then the thought crosses my mind "What if there was another flush performed prior to me buying but I don't have their receipt for it?" And those two combined make me just want to do a flush and refill with Toyota WS so I know exactly what has been done when, and with what fluids; but there I'm back to Toyota saying NOT to flush after so-and-so miles. I realize I'm probably over-thinking things but I would hate to ruin a transmission by flushing it, but would also hate to ruin it by mixing two incompatible AT fluids... Thoughts??? Anyone??? :redbrick: |
No, the Dex lll is not WS fluid and should not be used in your '04 with a sealed tranny. The drain and fill method only changes about 25%, the service advisor is an idiot. I would do a fluid exchange. There are a few write ups in here about it. Basically you take the lines off the tranny cooler and let the tranny pump out old fluid from 1 line and you pour new fluid into the return line. You will need a friend to help you and search on here for the proper procedure to get the fluid level correct. I did mine a few years ago. It was relatively easy on only took us about 30 minutes. Some Toyota dealers will do this, but you have to specifically ask them for full fluid exchange and not drain/fill.
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your issues might be coming from the dipshits who put dexron III in it. im at 103K on my original fluid without any issue. ill be doing the filter and a drain and fill in the next couple of weeks. but it sounds like the dexron has had some adverse effects on the tranny.
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Supposedly there is an additive that was put in with the Dexron III that makes it "pretty much the same" as the WS, according to my local mechanic friend--but even if that's true, I don't like that it's Dexron and I definitely don't like the 78,000 miles on it. I'm gonna buy 12 quarts of WS (already have 4), a new filter and pan gasket, do the flush and pray. :help:
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These A/T's are pretty tough, with a thorough flush (maybe 16-18 qts in your case) I imagine it'll survive just fine. TBH I probably wouldn't bother with the "filter" (more like screen) unless you really suspect something has plugged it up.
I've seen automatics survive worse, some bright spark put Chrysler ATF 4 in my buddy's old Mercedes 300SD and ran that for about 120k without ever changing it again, he swapped the fluid and filter out and it ran like a top another 100k until he sold it, and I imagine it's still going strong. That car actually called for DexII, later replaced with DexIII; but yeah I'd get the DexIII out of yours ASAP. |
1) No they are not. Get the "OEM" fluid. Period.
2) Drain and fill will replace 98% of the fluid? Bullshit. Find a Toyota dealer who has the machine to do a "complete fluid exchange". This machine also checks the operating temp and knows how full it is. Done by Toyota so they will stand by the work. Win. Peace out. |
I think you might be overthinking this one. I've flushed transmissions with more mileage on them and was fine. Tranny fluid with 78k miles on it will be nearing the end of it's service life so you are on schedule to do another flush.
Would suggest you do it yourself as you will care more about the quality of the work that anyone else. If you drain the pan and fill it with WS fluid, as you flush there will be minimal cross contamination with the Dex3 in there. You can go the drain and fill route but you will be doing multiple times and will never quite get all the Dex3 our as drain and fills just minimize contamination but don't truly eliminate it. Agree skipping the filter. If you're worried about fluid fitration, get a magnefine or put a remote filter on. |
Search for the method where you pump out old fluid through the transmission cooler lines. It's easier than changing your oil.
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Additionally, if you do 12qt via drain and fill or with the cooler line method; the fluid will end up looking about the same when you run it a bit and set the fluid. The thing to remember is you want the majority of the old fluid out and new fresh fluid in. Regardless of which method you go with, old fluid and debris will mix with the new stuff no matter how well you flush it. ~ @KaseyMcc Unfortunately that's not a good thing they ran Dexron III (that's "older" than Type IV ATF in the '03) additionally, I'm curious if they even set the fluid level correctly. You might be able to flush the system and get it to work for you. But it's a big if considering that Dexron III has had plenty of time to saturate the internals and friction material. IF the transmission does fail after the flush (not saying it will) I would see what recourse you have since the wrong fluid was used in the vehicle by JiffyLube. Unfortunately since you're not the original owner who paid for the service, it's a long shot you have any options regarding them helping you out worst case scenario. |
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Thanks for chiming in @BlackWorksInc , I was hoping someone of your experience would see this thread...though now I'm scared as hell that changing the fluid to WS is gonna tank my transmission! :faint2: |
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Best of luck, hopefully it'll work out. |
The main diff btw the dex III and the WS is the viscosity. WS is thinner. I saw in a tsb that if non WS is used the car may not move right away when cold, but when it warms up a bit it will. Which makes perfect sense. I highly doubtful mixing the fluid will create a toxic concoction that will destroy your tranny. Only some coolant react if it's mixed. I don't think other fluids do that.
I would not risk a flush. I would do a drain and fill which is around 4 quarts then wait a few months and do another with the WS. It's a super easy diy if you don't round off the fill plug. So relax, I doubt any damage was done. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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You don't have a problem right now and could likely run on the Dex for lots more miles, as it's a fine fluid but just a little thicker than what the car calls for. Don't go force flushing it and cause a problem that doesn't exist now. Plus spend $$. Drain and fill over time.
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