**Rear Coil Spring Discussion - The Perfect 3rd Gen Rear Spring**
I’ve been meaning to start this thread for a while.
@Taylor20
and I have been bouncing ideas and information back and forth about rear springs and I thought we should open it up to the community for disucssion. Let’s talk existing rear coil options and what an “ideal 3rd Gen rear spring” might look like? I realize everyone has different uses and setups, but I feel like there are just so many more options for the 120 Platform Toyota’s than for us 3rd Gen guys.
I for one, would love a LT rear spring capable of staying in the coil buckets at full droop, capable of supporting 200-250lbs of rear weight (over stock) and sitting at 2.5-3” of lift. My ideal spring may be different than yours, but that’s where we can start to collect some data and see if there are some common themes to approach a vendor about a custom spring potentially. I’d love to hear from @Black798 as I know he’s running some 4th Gen Dobinsons or something back there. CURRENT SPRING DATA (thanks for putting this together @Taylor20 ) OME 861's - 220lbs - 480/490mm FH DOBINSON 210V - 160-239lbs - 475/485mm FH DOBINSON 675V - 157-230lbs - 470mm FH TOYTEC Superflex - 240lbs - 495mm FH LC 7.5 Wrap - 160lbs - 473mm FH LC 8 Wrap - 160lbs - 483mm FH If you can confirm and/or fill in the missing info, please reply to the thread and I will update the main post. Let’s talk rear springs! |
Thanks Rick for starting this.
Just to throw some more info out there from my searching. The Dobinson 675v is a LT 4th gen rear coil. It provides the 4th gen's 2.5" of lift on average in stock form. That would provide us with 3.5" of lift due to the OE 4th gen spring providing about 1" of lift to start with. With extra weight it would bring that down some. The Dobinson 210v is the stock height extra weight LC front spring, and from what @Black798 has told me it offers about 3.5" of lift with the extra weight. I did have 861's, rear swingout and drawer system, but almost 5" of lift, it was just too much for me. I will probably order the 675v and see what those provide in the next couple months. Free height is key for a spring not falling out, it would have to be at least 480mm to not leave a worry of them doing so. |
Some more food for thought....
I had my 4th gen on 675V springs after switching from the metal Tech LT springs. They were slightly lower but on a stock truck (factory hitch and no rear bumper) I was closer to 3.5” of lift. I’ll dig in my old build thread and see if I ever posted huh to fender measurements to try and validate that... |
I used Bilstein 5100s paired with OME 880 in the front and 890 in the back, have a slight positive rake. I didn't measure before/after height though. The suspension levels out with a hitch rack loaded with ~300lbs. I didn't take before pictures but there are after pictures in my thread.
https://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-g...ml#post2965726 |
I have used LC ~150k.
One is 8 wraps, white, dark blue, double purple. Free standing it’s 483mm. Other is just over 7.5 wraps, white, light blue, double purple. Free standing it’s 473mm. |
Not sure what Superflex’s your referencing but this thread lists them at 240# spring rate. I haven’t found an alternative reference.
ToyTec SuperFlex Rear Spring INFO Thread |
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OME Landcruiser 80 springs
2851 - Stock/Light Load (0-110 lbs) 2" lift 2850 - Heavy load (110-250 lbs) 2" lift 2850J - Extended Height Coils 3" lift (Requires 60070L Shocks) ** 2861 - Low height heavy load (110-250 lbs) .25" lift |
I have a feeling but I haven't tried it, that the OME FJ Cruiser rear springs 895 medium duty may be the right coil for people looking to carry a little extra weight (2-300lb) and stay around 3" of lift at ride height.
Sent from my JSN-L23 using Tapatalk |
To The Top~
Any more ideas or set ups? Please share- |
Here's an idea: springs are characterized fundamentally by their free length, overall diameter, wire diameter, and number of coils. It may be interesting to include this data on the various options. This would help if we actually wanted to propose a custom spring design.
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FJC rear spring thread. Not much lift, but maybe the ride characteristics and introduces the variable of larger diameter coils.
Solved: FJ Cruiser Spring Lift for 3rd Gen 4Runners I know this thread is “rear coils” but it seems to me that the shocks are equally as important for ride quality. I think the conversation would have to encompass a coil and shock pair. |
I went through the same process on my last 4runner, actually had most of these springs on it at one point or another trying to find the right one I liked.
I used some OME chart to fill in spring rates for most of them, and confirming free heights by hand measurements. The superflex and 891 are progressive so hard to give an exact value for, but superflex definitely felt softer than the 861. IMO the 861 were too stiff. In the end I was most happy with the superflex, and would get that again if I built another t4r. Quote:
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8 wraps
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Sorry I don' have specific data. But..
I've been happy with LC 8 wraps with no internal cone bumpstop. I always run with about 100+ lbs in the rear and it sits at just above 24" so about 3" lift. When I'm fully weighted with camping gear and people shoot probably 300 lbs with all the cooler ice and water/gear.. maybe more. it sits about level with the front 23" Just got out a did a good flex test. Grabbed the coil springs and they were not going anywhere, no chance of them falling out. Running FJ/4th gen 5100, no sway bar, and Rokmen offraod lower links. For me, I don't need any more travel in the rear, I need to concentrate on the front travel. Now if I was running a 200 lbs rear bumper plus all this stuff. It would be to much weight. |
OME 861. You either love em or hate em. The thing is if you have a lot of gear all the time or an actual overland rig buildout in back is where these springs shine the most. Yes unloaded they sit high. No they are not for a rig that doesn’t have a ton of weight in back. A ton of weight would be along the lines of a fridge, slide, storage, support gear, rear tire swing out with fuel etc.... Just like you would re-gear to gain back performance from weight and tire size etc you add these springs to deal with....weight.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
I need a 1" lift coil that holds weight like an 861 and has enough free height not to fall out..... :crazy:
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I will say though, I had it paired with OEM Tokico FJ80 rears and the ride quality was superb for a budget oriented setup. Much better than running a budget aftermarket shock like rough country, pro comp, etc. Similar experience with off the shelf stock replacements from Napa paired with Superflex coils, Highly recommend it to anyone looking for a cheap shock ~75$ for the pair. Sent from my JSN-L23 using Tapatalk |
I just got a Slinky/Icon setup for our FZJ80 - the coils are designed to have multiple dead loops at ride height that work as a helper spring to keep the coil from falling out when drooped. Perhaps the Australian company that makes them would be interested in rolling a 3rd gen solution as well?
80 series Slinky/ICON Long Travel Suspension officially coming to the U.S.A. | IH8MUD Forum https://forum.ih8mud.com/proxy.php?i...2c9d7610d488e5 https://forum.ih8mud.com/proxy.php?i...17d73336c58ff3 |
FWIW in my search for a shorter coil I got this from Dobinson.
C59-137V - 170lbs open -245lbs ride height - 331lbs collapsed - 420mm FH. The 70 mm difference in free height from an 861 or superflex might be an issue. |
So is there a difference between the Dobsinson 210V and the OEM LC springs? WHy would I want to buy one vs the other? Can it handle weight better than the oem but isn't as crazy tall/heavy duty as the OME 861. Cause if that is the case I may be buying them.
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I've had about 6 different rear spring pairs in my 4Runner, with many more sub-combos of packers and air bags. I have both high and variable weight in the back, since I have a 4XI swingout bumper and tow a light car trailer from time to time.
I ended up with the Superflex coils, simply because they have the highest "final" rate of any of the heavily progressive coils and prevent big rake changes with variable weight. This is a huge selling point, especially when they still ride very nicely sans trailer. Unfortunately, air bags aren't quite the silver bullet they'd seem to be for variable weight, since you can't safely run them at 0psi. I always found them a bit harsh unladen, even inside soft coil springs. |
So with your bumper/swing out. Roughly how much lift are you getting from the super flex? Hub to fender would be awesome to know.
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I was thinking more along the lines of what we did in high school to lower rigs. Take a torch and apply heat at the right point until the spring relaxes to the desired height.
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Tough crowd. LOL!
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Good discussion. I might have to try the superflex's but I am worried I will be too heavy for them too...
I am just waiting for someone to try the Dobinsons 675V before I make a move.... any takers? lol |
Is there a front version of this thread? I'm going to get a coastal offroad front bumper (100 lb) plus winch so i want to know which coil and shock to get for about maybe 1" of lift and overlanding with gear in the back.
3rd Gen 4Runner Closed Top Front Bumper Kit - Coastal Offroad I know there's tons of threads on suspension but it changes from year to year and there's too much information overload. |
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What rear spring would be best for about 2-2.5" lift but a soft ride? It won't be off road very much so looking for best ride quality possible. Probably going to run either a 265-75-16 or 285-70-16.
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I'm also debating the fronts. Bought the rig with mish mash of parts. 5100's up front and OME 895s with OME shocks in the rear. Rides like garbage. |
I started to make a spread sheet with all the rear spring options and then decided I was going 890's and I'd change if I don't like it.
890 seems about the best choice for 2.5-3" lift when not carrying lots of weight. Amongst the other 2.5-3" options they seem less likely to fall out. model/spring rate/wire diameter/free height D/P OME 2890 190 .591 17.13/16.73 OME 2891 210 0.63 16.53/16.14 OME 2906 220 .669 15.35/14.96 I bought Tundra TRD coils for the front. |
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rate free H H @1000lb 890 190 17.13 11.87 891 210 16.53 11.77 906 220 15.35 10.80 Note that 890 and 891 have about 1" more lift than 906. I have about a 2" lift with the 906's in my '97 (which is exactly what I wanted), so you'll get closer to 3" lift with the 890/891. I'm quite happy with the ride with the 906's, I don't find them too stiff at all (and I like comfort, so take that for what it's worth). |
That height at 1000# would be good data to have. Would be nice if all this type data was readily available.
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Amazon.com: Daystar, Toyota 4Runner 2.5" Rear Lift Kit, fits 1996 to 2002 2/4WD, all transmissions, all cabs KT09108BK, Made in America: Automotive Amazon.com: Daystar, Toyota 4Runner 1.5" Rear Lift Kit, fits 1996 to 2002 2/4WD, all transmissions, all cabs KT09107BK, Made in America, Black: Automotive |
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For my next front set up I'm considering the Tundra TRD/Tundra bilsteins or Tundra 6112. |
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Hub-to-fender distance is 23.75". Even with the bumper setup, I imagine I'm still short of the 1000lb total load on each spring. https://i.imgur.com/YNtG3ZRh.jpg |
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I'm late to this discussion. I am very interested in this topic though. I currently am running 861's w/ Tokico LC shocks. I love the flex, but wish the ride height was a little lower. Also, they are too stiff. For reference, I have a Bandit design rear bumper with dual swing outs (which is heavy) and 35" spare, rear storage / sleeping platform, fridge, Rago rear window panels (full) and usually my 70lb golden retriever. So I'm guessing 400+lbs. And the 861's are still too stiff. Have you made a decision yet? Is Dobinson the solution? Thanks Durwin |
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