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Old 01-19-2019, 10:22 PM #1
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Fall 2019 Adventure - Need Help Planning (NC to Hoover Dam/Grand Canyon)

Hey everyone! First thread here. I am new to the 4Runner game since May 2018. I have 2018 Silver SR5 with lots of modifications so far. I AM ADDICTED!

But modifications are not what I am in need help of today. I am planning on road-tripping from Pittsboro (Raleigh), North Carolina to the Hoover Dam and Grand Canyon as my end destination. I have two weeks for vacationing!

I am visiting Nebraska (to see a friend), then truly have no clue. Here is a list of places I'd like to visit but they are not set in stone:
- Denver, CO
- Moab, UT
- Hoover Dam, NV
- Grand Canyon, AZ

Where should I go and sight see? Also, where are some awesome basic to intermediate trails (only my puppy and I traveling) with some scenic views?

I want this to be a trip to remember. Thanks for your help in advance!
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Old 01-20-2019, 12:05 AM #2
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Meteor Crater Home Page (can kill an hour or two here)

El Tovar Hotel | Grand Canyon National Park Lodges (stay here for a night if you can get a room. at very least, visit and eat a meal at its most excellent restaurant).

Good luck and have fun.


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Old 01-20-2019, 12:16 AM #3
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Well, you can spend a life off-roading between Denver and the Grand Canyon!

You will have to make some choices unless you want to just take a quick look at everywhere but see nothing for real. What's your offroad experience? Have you driven anything in CO or UT? What is your experience in rock and on tight shelf roads? That should matter a great deal when choosing trails, especially the first few trails of a particular kind (narrow shelf, seriously rocky, narrow and rocky, slickrock fins, etc).

And what is fall for you? The high elevation trails in CO can be closed by the time you are there.

Buy the Charlie Wells Colorado 4-wheel drive trails, Moab, 4-wheel drive trails, and Arizona 4-wheel drive trails. That will be some of the best 100$ you have ever spent. You can start from the most scenic easy trails. We go solo on any moderate (blue) trails in those books, a number of which I have driven in my Outback, too. That said, conditions change, sometimes dramatically; there is no guarantee in anything offroad. The difficult trails, red, vary tremendously in difficulty, from moderate surface plus some "danger" factor to extreme so you will have to read carefully and maybe do your research if you want to drive any of those. I would not start with a difficult trail when new to an area. You will want tires and brakes in great condition. I am sure you know, but...

If you do not want to buy all the Wells guides, join Trail.Damage.com for 12$ for 1 year where you will find an unbelievable collection of CO and UT trails. However, good luck figuring out the TD trail rating system without prior experience. On the plus side, the TD trail descriptions offer GPX tracks that you can download onto a navigator and get turn-by-turn offroad navigation (visual) and nav to TH (with voice).

Either way, do not be the guy who goes with no proper guides. The Peter Massey guides that you will see here and there are also good, but old. They are also focused on easier trails than Charlie Wells'. The TD site has it all from hundreds of dirt roads to dozens of doozies.

If you like maps, buy the Latitude 40 maps. For Moab, pass on the Classic Trails and just get East and West.

SW Colorado:

In terms of scenery, there are many high-elevation options in CO with the only ones I have done being in the San Juans. That is a gorgeous area but also high-traffic in July and August. Pass on the Poughkeepsie Gulch trail and see for how many of the rest you have time. For the Alpine Loop, Engineer is more scenic than Cinnamon, in my opinion. Corkscrew-Hurricane-California-Engineer or the other way round would be about as scenic a route as there is in the world. From Telluride (Brown Dog Pizza is as good as it gets, try the Detroit style), Moab is about 3 hr away to I have never done that particular drive. The only comparatively disappointing trails in the San Juans I have driven are Brown Mountain (not in Wells) as it is far less scenic than the rest, Last Dollar Rd, which is more like a typical mountain trail, and Alta Lakes, which is about the lakes. Ophir Pass offers phenomenal scenery on its western side (better seen going westbound) and a steep short hiking trail from the pass sign up leads to a gorgeous lake. Porphyry Gulch is an absolute gem plus a great short hike at the end with a dog to a superb lake. Clear Lake is unbelievable though everyone drives that. Maggie Gulch is a gem missed by Wells. And so on and so forth. .

Moab.

The grand total of San Juan trails in the most famous area is around two dozen. By contrast, around Moab the options are nearly endless, but there are clear winners when it comes to the most scenic routes, these include Highway 128, which beats most trails easily, and then:

The White Rim Road (permit required, use Canyonlands' site here: Canyonlands Backcountry Permits ) is my top trail alongside the CO route I mentioned above. The big problem for you is that you would need to accommodate the dog in a Moab dog hotel as dogs are not allowed.
The WRR is best done with camping for one night but I have done it in a day also, solo, in my Outback.

There is no direct equivalent but if you have to pass on the WRR, the closest thing would be Hurrah Pass-Chicken Corners. And you can drive Jackson Hole on the way for good measure though I always run out of time for that trail...

So, Hwy 128, WRR, and Chicken Corners, plus the paved road in Arches NP (ok for dogs) cover the basics. Beyond that, the options are so many, it is hard to say.

The section west of CO river and 191 offers the most bang for the buck for a first timer if you ask me. Long Canyon, Spring Canyon Bottom, Deadman point, Rainbow Rocks, and Wipe Out Hill loop are all super interesting and in different ways. One spot to be more careful than usual on moderate trails exists on Rainbow Rocks/Terrace (it is very self-evident). The more famous Gemini Bridges trail would be a gem elsewhere, but I find it just average for Moab. The bridges are nice though and the Bull Canyon trail underneath is interesting.

The NE section, between 191, 128, and I-70 is probably the least interesting for a first timer, except for Arches. In Arches, the one gem trail is Tower Arch--Eye of the Whale. But you will have to ask if a dog is ok as it is not clear from the website and Wells says no. It is also a difficult trail but low-end difficult and the moderate Rainbow Rocks has a harder spot than anything on Tower Arch as of last month.

The section south of 128 and east of 191 and Moab is most famous for Fins and Things and Hells Revenge. That can be a separate conversation. Both are rated difficult with Fins usually driven as the training grounds for Hells. These two trails are a world of their own in that you drive on slickrock fins up and down. Hells has three degrees of difficulty (main route, main route plus reasonable obstacles, and main route plus all obstacles). We did Fins last month but have not yet done Hells (only the main route interests me there).

The section west of 191 and Moab is where Kane Creek rd goes to Hurrah Pass and Chicken Corners. You don't want to go on Kane Creek Tr. unless you are experienced and very well prepared and not solo. Signs point out to Hurrah Pass, so no worries.

The trails further south are not interesting enough for a first visit. As for the Needles district of Canyonlands, there is no reason to visit with a dog. All the good stuff is where dogs are not allowed. Otoh, the paved road that leads there is gorgeous and Newspaper rock is right off that road. There are easy ways to cross the mountain to the south of there and get to Natural Bridges and from there to Mexican Hat. There is also a spectacular to drive section of Stephens Canyon, when it has water. All that is on the TrailDamage site. If driving straight to AZ from Moab, just go 191 to 163.

Northern Arizona:

As you come towards Arizona, there are many unpaved detours. The TrailDamage site has two gem trails there, which are the River House (amazing ruin, phenomenal camping spot at river, fun drive), and Johns Canyon are memorable trails. Monument Valley has a dirt road that you can drive but if you are short on time, the very best views of Monument Valley are when coming south on 163 anyway. Don't take 191 to bypass the best! After Bluff, 191 turns south on the left at 90 degrees. You want to go straight and take 163 till Kayenta where you rejoin 191. If you have time, 163 meets paved 261 which climbs as a dirt road the Mockey Dugway. It is nothing like a trail but the scenery is amazing. On top of that climb, there is a dirt road that in five miles gets you to Mulley Point, one of the best panorama points you will ever see.

From Kayenta, you can go straight to either the north or south rims of the Grand Canyon. The north offers many offroad opportunities and the south offers none worth doing in your case, just some dirt forest roads. The south rim offers the more dramatic views, the north rim has way fewer visitors. I do not believe you will have time for the north rim. Very basic services are available at the North Rim.

And I have barely scratched the surface of the surface...as for the Hoover Dam, it will be nothing to write home about after the above. But if you go North Rim then you can continue on to Zion and return via Bryce and Capitol Reef, some excellent offroad on the way also.

Of course, all of that is way too much for the 10 days or so you will have in the region. Maybe focus on one area, or just do the best of the paved roads with the most representative of the trails. Utah 12 is about as good as a paved road gets especially between Escalante and Boulder. In SW CO, the Million Dollar highway between Silverton and Ouray is simply amazing.
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Last edited by MAST4R; 01-20-2019 at 12:57 AM.
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