3rd Gen Stock OEM Suspension, SR5 versus Limited 4WD.

[Cytronus]

I have a '99 4Runner Limited 4WD all stock and my g/f has a 2000 4Runner SR5 AT (no 4WD) all stock. The SR5 drives so much better, very car like, more stiff, corners really well. I noticed the SR5 also sits a lot lower.

My limited 4WD is more lifted than the SR5 and the ride quality is terrible - very heavy, floaty, disconnected feeling from the road, really top heavy feeling going around turns. I prefer the SR5 suspension as I drive mostly around town and some light trails for mountain biking and camping. I'm not an off roader but may do a little light trail riding here and there.

I'm assuming the Limited 4WD has a completely different suspension make-up from the SR5. Assuming so, does anyone here know what I would need to swap out my Limited 4WD stock suspension to make it identical to the SR5? Is it just springs and shocks? Is it totally taboo to even think about this?

I appreciate any feedback from the pros. Thanks in advance.

 

[1985taylor1925]

I have a '99 4Runner Limited 4WD all stock and my g/f has a 2000 4Runner SR5 AT (no 4WD) all stock. The SR5 drives so much better, very car like, more stiff, corners really well. I noticed the SR5 also sits a lot lower.

My limited 4WD is more lifted than the SR5 and the ride quality is terrible - very heavy, floaty, disconnected feeling from the road, really top heavy feeling going around turns. I prefer the SR5 suspension as I drive mostly around town and some light trails for mountain biking and camping. I'm not an off roader but may do a little light trail riding here and there.

I'm assuming the Limited 4WD has a completely different suspension make-up from the SR5. Assuming so, does anyone here know what I would need to swap out my Limited 4WD stock suspension to make it identical to the SR5? Is it just springs and shocks? Is it totally taboo to even think about this?

I appreciate any feedback from the pros. Thanks in advance.

The 4x2 front suspension is actually softer than yours, even though your limited feels softer. It sounds like your coils are just worn out. And if the coils are worn out then chances are the shocks are too. New OEM shocks and coils would make it feel completely different.

 

[1985taylor1925]

To add to my last post, OEM 99 coils and shocks would probably be a good set up for you. As you may already know, 99 was the tallest coil Toyota made for the 3rd gens. Its around an inch taller than other years (on average, depending on the year really). And the OEM Tokico shocks are good, but I think they are a bit soft. If you wanted a more sporty ride you could go with Bilsteins, or Tokico Trekmasters which are a step up for the regular ones. I wouldnt recomment KYB shocks, as theyre excessively stiff in my experience. But if most of your driving is on road, new OEM coils are your best option. Everyone here (including myself) lifts their trucks. But in fact the off road capability of a 3rd gen 4runner with stock suspension is already better than 99% of other vehicles on the road. For basic off road stuff stock 99 suspension is more than capable.

 

[Cytronus]

Right on, thank you for the response and info.

I definitely plan on getting new coils, bilsteins, new OEM inner/outter tie rods, ball joints and bushings. I think I'd still like to get the ride height down though. Think a set of new 2002 SR5 coils will drop it that 1 inch?

I have Yakima fork mount racks on top and getting the mountain bikes up there takes some reach.

Thanks!

 

[1985taylor1925]

I definitely plan on getting new coils, bilsteins, new OEM inner/outter tie rods, ball joints and bushings. I think I'd still like to get the ride height down though. Think a set of new 2002 SR5 coils will drop it that 1 inch?

I have Yakima fork mount racks on top and getting the mountain bikes up there takes some reach.

Thanks!

Ya if you want to drop it some you could do that. If I remember correctly 2001 was the lowest suspension of all the years. Someone else can probably confirm that. Its either 01 or 02. Either way they will be almost identical for ride height, around an inch lower than stock 99 coils.

 

[THEREALTOR1]

Ya if you want to drop it some you could do that. If I remember correctly 2001 was the lowest suspension of all the years. Someone else can probably confirm that. Its either 01 or 02. Either way they will be almost identical for ride height, around an inch lower than stock 99 coils.

I think its 2002. I think 01 is just a "normal" year, but I think the 02's were an 1" lower than the other years (and approx 2"'s less than the 99's).

 

[Cytronus]

1985Taylor, thank you for taking the time with the detailed replies, I really appreciate it. Now that I've been thinking more about it, I was wondering if you wouldn't mind giving me your opinion on an idea I have.

As I said, my g/f's 2000 SR5 has the perfect, sporty, stiff, corner-able suspension. It's all OEM. No rear sag either. As for my '99 "tall" Ltd, I measured and found the rear is 1/2" lower than the front (negative rake). I want to lower the front an inch to make it a positive 1/2" rake by installing 2000 OEM coils and struts but leave the rear tall stock OEM coils as is. New OEM shock in rear. My concern here is that the rear existing coils are worn out some and new OEM shocks might be taking too much weight and wear out faster. What do you think? Do you think the rake would be too much with this set up?

Also, I may throw on some new, larger 265/75 R16 tires this fall.

Any thoughts are hugely apprecaited all. Thanks to everyone that's chimed in so far.

Oh also, here is the official data on the 3rd gen ride height (based on coil length):

Height 1999–2002: 67.5 in (1,715 mm)
1999–2002 Limited: 68.5 in (1,740 mm)
1996-98: 66.5 in (1,689 mm)
1996-98 Limited: 68.7 in (1,745 mm)

 

[1985taylor1925]

1985Taylor, thank you for taking the time with the detailed replies, I really appreciate it. Now that I've been thinking more about it, I was wondering if you wouldn't mind giving me your opinion on an idea I have.

As I said, my g/f's 2000 SR5 has the perfect, sporty, stiff, corner-able suspension. It's all OEM. No rear sag either. As for my '99 "tall" Ltd, I measured and found the rear is 1/2" lower than the front (negative rake). I want to lower the front an inch to make it a positive 1/2" rake by installing 2000 OEM coils and struts but leave the rear tall stock OEM coils as is. New OEM shock in rear. My concern here is that the rear existing coils are worn out some and new OEM shocks might be taking too much weight and wear out faster. What do you think? Do you think the rake would be too much with this set up?

Also, I may throw on some new, larger 265/75 R16 tires this fall.

Any thoughts are hugely apprecaited all. Thanks to everyone that's chimed in so far.

Oh also, here is the official data on the 3rd gen ride height (based on coil length):

Height 1999–2002: 67.5 in (1,715 mm)
1999–2002 Limited: 68.5 in (1,740 mm)
1996-98: 66.5 in (1,689 mm)
1996-98 Limited: 68.7 in (1,745 mm)

Your welcome man. No problem.

How many miles are on the 99? If you have a negative rake than yes the rear coils have softened over time. Ive personally never heard of a rear coil wearing out to the point that it snapped, which would obviously be dangerous. That would be my main concern. So I dont see why you couldnt just keep the stock rear coils on and just get new shocks like you said. However, the coils will continue to get softer over time, especially with new shocks. And if youre carrying any weight in the back youll be sitting really low. The other thing is, with new shocks and old coils you wont have the intended spring rate to balance the shocks, and your rebound will be slower. But that should be minimal and shouldnt affect the ride much.

With the lower 2002 coils up front you would probably be sitting somewhere between a slight positive rake and level. Youll probably have a stiffer riding front end like you wanted, but a softer back end. So my first choice would be to get the new 2002 coils for the front AND back. But agian, you could give the 99s a try first.

Dropping the suspension lower and adding bigger tires is always a bad idea as youll have increasing problems with clearence, especially in the front. You would want to lift it to accomodate the bigger tires. You could probably get away with 267 75s as long as youre not carrying much weight. Maybe someone else here has run 265 75s with the lower stock suspension and can chime in?

 

[Cytronus]

Hey 1985T, thanks again for your contributions and time. I owe you one. My rig has almost 137 K miles. All suspension components are original, including shocks and struts. You're right, I should just get new springs/shocks/struts all around and get rid of the worn out oldies. They've had a lot of load on them over the years.

Are 267/75s smaller than 265/75s? That might be a great option if they are. I've read from multiple posts here that the 265/75 clearance is just fine on OEM coils, as long as they aren't super worn out and sagging. Some minor rubs reported on worn out fronts but nothing major.

Do you know where I could get the same 1999 "tall" rear springs (same length) in a stiffer aftermarket brand? I think I'm going to go with 2000 - 2002 OEM SR5 front coils and shocks - positive rake for the win.

Lastly, between Billies and Tokicos, what shocks will fair best for heavy rear loads with 3 passengers?

Thanks again!

 

[1985taylor1925]

Hey 1985T, thanks again for your contributions and time. I owe you one. My rig has almost 137 K miles. All suspension components are original, including shocks and struts. You're right, I should just get new springs/shocks/struts all around and get rid of the worn out oldies. They've had a lot of load on them over the years.

Are 267/75s smaller than 265/75s? That might be a great option if they are. I've read from multiple posts here that the 265/75 clearance is just fine on OEM coils, as long as they aren't super worn out and sagging. Some minor rubs reported on worn out fronts but nothing major.

Do you know where I could get the same 1999 "tall" rear springs (same length) in a stiffer aftermarket brand? I think I'm going to go with 2000 - 2002 OEM SR5 front coils and shocks - positive rake for the win.

Lastly, between Billies and Tokicos, what shocks will fair best for heavy rear loads with 3 passengers?

Thanks again!

267 75 was a mistake. I just meant 265 75. 265 75s are a size up from the stock 265 70s. And ya they should be fine with the stock suspension. But myself, I wouldnt want to risk even minor rubbing.

For the 99 coils, I dont really know of an equivelent. I remember someone on the forum getting a set of Gabriel coilovers for the front and liking them. He mentioned that they sat higher than his stock suspension. But I would bet they sag fast. Performance Products coils would give you about an inch of lift over stock 99 coils. Same thing for OME 906s. And both are stiffer. But you could go with 2002 front coils and 1999 rear coils and that would ride well and give you the positive rake you want.

Bilsteins are stiffer than OEM Tokicos and would be a better choice for carrying cargo.

 

[Cytronus]

Coil Spacers?

What do you think about all four 2002 SR5 OEM coils (the 1" shorter ones), then if the rear is level or negative rake, adding coil spacers in the rear to bring it up just a tad for the positive rake look? I know nothing about spacers, the sizes or the potential downside, if any. I think I'll likely go with '99 tall OEM springs in the rear but it would be nice to know all the options out there.


If there is minor rubbing with 265/75 R16s with the above set up, would it be possible to install wheel spacers? Let's say, for example, a hypotehetical rub would go away with an additional 1/8" clearance on the front inside when turning - are there 1/8" wheel spacers out there that I could add on to the hub while still using the OEM hub bolts and lugs or would the OEM hub lug bolts be too short for a 1/8" spacer? I wouldn't mind a wider stance anyhow but I know nothing about wheel spacers or their affect, other than they do put strain on the ball joint the greater the offset of center between the wheel and wheel bearing. But I don't think a spacer of 1/8" or less would be a concern, if the exisitng hub bolts are long enough and lugs have enough bite.

I'll be ordering up all the components this weekend and will definitely do a detailed write up with pics when done. In fact, next month I'll be starting up a build thread detailing everything I've done up to this point and what I'm doing with wheels, tires, suspension, CB radio install, PIAA lights, front camera install, etc.

Thanks again 1985T.

 

[1985taylor1925]

What do you think about all four 2002 SR5 OEM coils (the 1" shorter ones), then if the rear is level or negative rake, adding coil spacers in the rear to bring it up just a tad for the positive rake look? I know nothing about spacers, the sizes or the potential downside, if any. I think I'll likely go with '99 tall OEM springs in the rear but it would be nice to know all the options out there.


If there is minor rubbing with 265/75 R16s with the above set up, would it be possible to install wheel spacers? Let's say, for example, a hypotehetical rub would go away with an additional 1/8" clearance on the front inside when turning - are there 1/8" wheel spacers out there that I could add on to the hub while still using the OEM hub bolts and lugs or would the OEM hub lug bolts be too short for a 1/8" spacer? I wouldn't mind a wider stance anyhow but I know nothing about wheel spacers or their affect, other than they do put strain on the ball joint the greater the offset of center between the wheel and wheel bearing. But I don't think a spacer of 1/8" or less would be a concern, if the exisitng hub bolts are long enough and lugs have enough bite.

I'll be ordering up all the components this weekend and will definitely do a detailed write up with pics when done. In fact, next month I'll be starting up a build thread detailing everything I've done up to this point and what I'm doing with wheels, tires, suspension, CB radio install, PIAA lights, front camera install, etc.

Thanks again 1985T.

Ive never heard of a wheel spacer that small. I know autozone sells general spacers that should fit our 4rd gens that are like 8mm wide.

As far as a spacer for the rear coils, that would work fine for you. It wont affect the ride quality. And unless youre doing some heavy trails it wont affect off road performance either.

 

[Cytronus]

Sticking with the '99 "talls" and ordered new gear!

Okay guys, thanks again for all the advice. Much appreciated. I ordered up 4 new OEM '99 "tall" springs (direct replacement), and all front and rear bushings, ball joints, inner and outter tie rods and Tokico Trekmaster shocks all around.

The current rig is completely OEM, including the shocks, so this will be a welcomed replacement. I'll post pics and feedback on the ride quality soon.

Also, just in case the front end is too high or too level with the new springs, I ordered some used SR5 springs with 0.5 inch spring spacers in case I want to give the front end a little rake but we'll see how it all turns out with the OEM new replacement gear first.

Next is a set of 4 new 265/75/R16s!

 

[dgoll75]

Okay guys, thanks again for all the advice. Much appreciated. I ordered up 4 new OEM '99 "tall" springs (direct replacement), and all front and rear bushings, ball joints, inner and outter tie rods and Tokico Trekmaster shocks all around.

The current rig is completely OEM, including the shocks, so this will be a welcomed replacement. I'll post pics and feedback on the ride quality soon.

Also, just in case the front end is too high or too level with the new springs, I ordered some used SR5 springs with 0.5 inch spring spacers in case I want to give the front end a little rake but we'll see how it all turns out with the OEM new replacement gear first.

Next is a set of 4 new 265/75/R16s!

I have a combination of both your trucks. A 97 SR5 2WD with 99 talls and new KYB shocks/struts. Your going to be very happy with your purchase. My 2WD stuff was shot (152k). Just wanted to improve my ride and add a little lift, not for hard core wheeling, just for the beach (which I can drive on here in FL). Also needed a bit more clearance for my 17" Tundra wheels. I first did the talls with a 1" Daystar spacer, bad idea, took the spacers off after a week. Now that they are gone my ride is like a brand new truck and sits even, as it should be. With the spacers my steering was floaty and jittery, no bueno! Avoid the spacers if you can. Just my .02.

 

[Cytronus]

Shock concerns for 1999 tall springs

Hey guys,

Before I put the new Tokico Trekmasters on, does anyone know if the same shocks are okay to use between both the shorter OEM springs and the '99 talls?

I called Tokico and they said the exact same shock model works for either application. With more than an inch of difference in the coil length, I would imagine that the shocks that work on the shorter coils won't be long enough and perhaps might even be the reason for the springs to wear out and sag over time on the '99 talls. When the shocks aren't providing aid to the coil, the coils tend to wear prematurely. I wasn't very confident with the Tokico reps response to this concern.

If anyone out there has feedback or better yet, precise shock make/model recommendations for '99 tall coils, I'd be most appreciative.