4th gen excessive brake pedal travel

[Will_4R]

Lately I have noticed that there is more travel than usual with the brake pedal. Also, the braking power is weaker than usual. This is something that has developed slowly over the past few months, not something that happened suddenly. The amount of pedal travel seems to vary as well which is annoying. There is no spongyness/softness to braking and I don't feel it pulling to one side.

Brake fluid level is fine. I have done about 35,000 miles (mostly highway) since the pads were last changed.

Any suggestions? I run out of warranty in 1,000 miles and hope to sort it out ASAP but am afraid the dealer will just tell me they work fine until the warranty is out.

 

[Jed]

You might want to bleed the brakes. If you haven't done any kind of brake work, it shouldn't need to be bled, but I know that a "low" pedal can often result from air in the brake lines, even if it doesn't feel spongy at all.

Give it a shot...you have nothing to lose.

 

[DC Dude]

You might want to bleed the brakes. If you haven't done any kind of brake work, it shouldn't need to be bled, but I know that a "low" pedal can often result from air in the brake lines, even if it doesn't feel spongy at all.

Give it a shot...you have nothing to lose.

Bleed is different from flush though, right?

 

[Jed]

The intention of bleeding is to get any trapped air out of the system. The intention of flushing is to remove old brake fluid and replace it with fresh fluid.

Both are basically performed the same way...but with flushing, you're running a lot more fresh fluid through the system than you typically do during bleeding.

 

[Rix]

adjust the rear brakes (or have them adjusted)

 

[Will_4R]

Jed: How would air get into the system? I have not done any work on the breakes so it wasn't that way. Maybe there there is some sort of leak (I don't appear to be losing fluid)?

Rix: what do you mean by adjust the rear brakes? And why just the rear? I have 4 wheel disc brakes, in case that matters.

 

[Rix]

OOPS.
forgot about the 4wheel disc thing.
That generation has been having some trouble with sticking calipers on occasion, might have a thurough (sp?) brake check done (NOT AT LES SCHWAB)
A good pressure flush of the brake system couldn't hurt...

 

[Jed]

Jed: How would air get into the system? I have not done any work on the breakes so it wasn't that way. Maybe there there is some sort of leak (I don't appear to be losing fluid)?

.

There really shouldn't be any air in the system if you haven't done any kind of brake work....but it is possible. Is your brake fluid level low in the reservoir?

Either way, it wouldn't hurt to bleed the brakes or even flush them if your fluid is old. I don't know if it will solve your issue, but it's a quick, easy, and inexpensive way to try.

 

[DC Dude]

Excessive brake pedal travel means the front calipers are seizing. It's an issue with the 4th gens.

I just dealt with it. $650 for both.

 

[Jed]

Excessive brake pedal travel means the front calipers are seizing. It's an issue with the 4th gens.

I just dealt with it. $650 for both.

When my calipers were frozen, I didn't have any excessive brake pedal travel. In fact, I didn't even know they were frozen until I inspected them and noticed that the pads were wearing unevenly.

 

[Will_4R]

Took it into the dealer and just got the diagnosis:

Pistons are starting to stick on all four corners, as well, the pads and rotars are wearing thin and need to be changed. Luckily my warrenty, which expiers in a few hundred miles, covers bran new (not reman) calipers. He said the sticking pistons are a very common problem on the 4Runners (but not their other vehicles).

 

[DC Dude]

Took it into the dealer and just got the diagnosis:

Pistons are starting to stick on all four corners, as well, the pads and rotars are wearing thin and need to be changed. Luckily my warrenty, which expiers in a few hundred miles, covers bran new (not reman) calipers. He said the sticking pistons are a very common problem on the 4Runners (but not their other vehicles).

Sounds like you'll only have to pay for pads and new rotors.

 

[Will_4R]

yup, that is right. About $800 in parts and labour and tax.

 

[DC Dude]

yup, that is right. About $800 in parts and labour and tax.

That sounds high.

I used a brake service/pad replacement dealer coupon for $85. Changing rotors shouldn't cost that much...estimate worst case $200 each.

 

[Will_4R]

That sounds high.

I used a brake service/pad replacement dealer coupon for $85. Changing rotors shouldn't cost that much...estimate worst case $200 each.

I priced it out online, and the dealer quotes seems fair.

rotars: $124.74 each
pads: $102.12 each set
shims kits front: $38.06
shim kit rear: $24.42

That included labour. They charged an extra hour labour to dismantle, service and adjust parking brake. Seemed a little high, but whatever. The parking brake wasn't holding and I asked them to adjust it.

 

[DC Dude]

I priced it out online, and the dealer quotes seems fair.

rotars: $124.74 each
pads: $102.12 each set
shims kits front: $38.06
shim kit rear: $24.42

That included labour. They charged an extra hour labour to dismantle, service and adjust parking brake. Seemed a little high, but whatever. The parking brake wasn't holding and I asked them to adjust it.

Is that in canadian currency?

Most dealers in my area have dual brake service (e.g. pad replacement) for $85 total.

 

[CJ3Flyr]

I priced it out online, and the dealer quotes seems fair.

rotars: $124.74 each
pads: $102.12 each set
shims kits front: $38.06
shim kit rear: $24.42

That included labour. They charged an extra hour labour to dismantle, service and adjust parking brake. Seemed a little high, but whatever. The parking brake wasn't holding and I asked them to adjust it.

Do I understand this? 4 new calipers, 4 new rotors and fresh pads for $520? The pad/shim price is a tad high, USD or CDN, but overall you did very well to come off of warranty with 4 fresh calipers and a brake job:bigok: Congrats on playing that hand very well

 

[Will_4R]

Do I understand this? 4 new calipers, 4 new rotors and fresh pads for $520? The pad/shim price is a tad high, USD or CDN, but overall you did very well to come off of warranty with 4 fresh calipers and a brake job:bigok: Congrats on playing that hand very well

rotars: $124.74 x 4 = $498.96
pad kits: $102.12 x 2 = $204.24
shim kits: $38.06 + $24.42 = $62.48

total before tax = $765.68 all CA$ incl. labour

My total bill including everything was $1,1xx. That included the full brake job with new calipers, servicing hte parking brake and a maintainance packge/inspection and oil change.

 

[Will_4R]

So all that work didn't totally solve my excessive break pedal travel. It somewhat helped, I think, and also might have somewhat helped strengthen the weakend breaking.

Shortly after leaving the the dealer, both my front wheel bearings gave out (http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/71253-both-front-wheel-bearings-shot.html). After having those replaced (at a different dealer since I was away from home on a trip at the time), my breaks suddenly improved to what they used to be: strong, sure, predicatble and without excessive pedal travel. I am not sure if the bad bearings where partly responsible for my break issues, or if when replacing the bearings the second dealer had to remove the capilpers and re-bleed the system.

Anyway, I am glad they are working but a little disapointed that after paying for a maintenance package the first dealer totally missed the bad bearings. Luckily the bearings were also covered by the warranty. The whole ordeal ended up costing me a full day of my road trip which somewhat sucked.