Interesting solution to LBJ bolts backing out

[WeakSauz]

We've all seen it-- Properly torqued, blue loc tite, and they still back out if you wheel hard

Is anyone brave enough to try something like a Nord Lock washer with an OEM bolt?
Nord-Lock Wedge-Locking Washers - Junker Vibration Test - YouTube


I'm an all-OEM kind of guy, but worth a thought!

 

[HiLife]

Interesting. Wasn't there a similar washer product like this in the 80s? Washer with a biting tooth face profile on both sides.
I don't like the way the nord washer bites the mating surfaces too hard and slightly damaging them.
Test don't deny the nord washers work going through that vibration test though.

 

[3bears]

I must not wheel hard enough as I have not had this issue, red loctite ? Of course would be a lot harder to break loose when needed to

 

[WeakSauz]

I must not wheel hard enough as I have not had this issue, red loctite ? Of course would be a lot harder to break loose when needed to

I havent has this issue personally either. I think OEM equipment is good enough for 99% of the population, especially when using brand new OEM bolts.

But, I've seen some threads in my time here where folks are reporting that they will look under their truck during an oil change and have a LBJ bolt (or two!) completely missing.

Just curious if something like a Nord Lock is a fail-safe against that. I am not sure if I'm brave enough to try it on such a critical part haha!!

 

[rkntoy]

I just switched to red loctite and have not had another issue.

 

[JZiggy]

Oooh, neato. Looks like a good solution.

What's the class of the OEM bolt? Can we go up a grade somehow? That would allow you to use more torque -> greater clamp load -> harder to loosen it

 

[brillo_76]

I havent seen any LBJ bolts come loose. But I dont offroad either. These would work great along as they were stainless. If not the rust belt will make then non removable..

Sent from my SM-J337V using Tapatalk

 

[repo]

I've seen two different torque values for the bolts. 37 ft/lbs and 59 ft/lbs. I never figured out which was the correct value. Would you rather they back out or rather they snap I guess haha. There also seems to be 2 different LBJs, one kind has a boot protector on it. Have you been re-using the old bolts?

 

[4Runner4Leon]

I don't see how this solution is any better than a serrated washer.

Yes, there are "ramps" that the two mating pieces would have to go over, but only if you assume that the upper half is "attached" to the bolt head, and the bottom half is "attached" to the body.

But in reality, the only thing that holds the upper half to the bolt head, or the bottom half to the body, is friction due to the serrations. So that's your limiting factor, the serrations.

 

[rideexileex]

Try the ORANGE loctite

 

[shadow247]

I don't see how this solution is any better than a serrated washer.

Yes, there are "ramps" that the two mating pieces would have to go over, but only if you assume that the upper half is "attached" to the bolt head, and the bottom half is "attached" to the body.

But in reality, the only thing that holds the upper half to the bolt head, or the bottom half to the body, is friction due to the serrations. So that's your limiting factor, the serrations.

Well the test is pretty clear that it works. The most severe vibrations can cause torque value loss on all the other types of locking fasteners, but this one barely moved at al, and settled right in after multiple tests. There's a reason Cotter Pins are used on a lot of suspension stuff, because there's almost no way to guarantee the bolt won't back out, even with loctite and a locking washer.

 

[Black798]

I have always used red loctite on mine and have had them back out on several occasions. For me the solution ended up being a small tack weld on the bolt heads and swapping the oem bolts for arps. Haven't had them back out or stretch since then and when I need to get the bolts out a quick zip with the grinder and they unthread no problem

 

[sportscarfan]

Interesting. Wasn't there a similar washer product like this in the 80s? Washer with a biting tooth face profile on both sides.

Maybe you are thinking of a Schnorr washer? Same basic principle with serrations on both sides, but the Schnorr is single thickness and a belleville shape, so it compresses.

 

[4Runner4Leon]

Well the test is pretty clear that it works. The most severe vibrations can cause torque value loss on all the other types of locking fasteners, but this one barely moved at al, and settled right in after multiple tests. There's a reason Cotter Pins are used on a lot of suspension stuff, because there's almost no way to guarantee the bolt won't back out, even with loctite and a locking washer.

Not really, the video only compared a plain nut and a double nut to the Nord-Lock. No other locking nuts were tested for comparison (deformed metallic nuts, nylok, locking compounds, etc). We also have no idea what vibration spectrum was imposed on the assembly.

There are numerous highly effective locking features - the best are usually deformed threads, or locking materials in the thread. If your (or someone else's) life depends on it, you might go to the next level of lockwire, bent tab washers, or cotter pins (I noticed that the video conveniently dismissed these as "labor intensive").

We've tested a number of devices like the Nord-Lok (look up Klincher nuts, Oglaend, etc), and they all rely on preload to keep them from loosening. In our testing, they have not stood up as well as the prevailing torque type locking devices. Then again, we work with aerospace systems, where the vibration input is much higher than automotive or similar industry.

I'd say if you are really concerned about these LBJ bolts, have them drilled for lockwire, or get some correct size bolts predrilled for the lockwire.