So I went with my older son to a Toyota dealership by me on Saturday to see Camry's since my younger son will be inheriting his 99 Pathfinder very soon.

When we pull in, one salesman starts him going with the Camry's when another wants to speak to me about my 4Runner (07 Sport, V8, only 33k miles, meticulous condition). He says they have a new '12 Trail Salsa Red with MSRP $38+k. Told him to forget it. Not interested. Looking at Camry's.

He keeps up with $36k for Trail, $21k for mine. Told him to go away, forget it. Then 3 more times back and forth and I'm getting nuts and my son wants to leave after he drives a couple of Camry's. Nice cars BTW.

This dip-shit salesman comes back with $25k for mine, $32.5k for the new Trail.

That's it, we leave. I've never seen such aggressive salesmen. Good deal though I think....... but still not near interested. I think pre-owned sales of cars and trucks is super-hot these days but thats nut's. Maybe I'm nuts for not doing it but I'm not one for 5th gens and love mine.

He's trying to unload because of sales commission and the 2014 4Runner refresh with HID/LED lights are about to arrive.

I think once the new 2014s hit the lot the price on the 2012 will jump up.

UGLY!!!

Seeing the complete 2014 for the first time with all that business in the front invokes mixed emotions in me. There are aspects like the HIDs and the massive grill that I like, but not sure about the overall shape and lines. Makes me wonder how the aftermarket bumpers will look on these models.

Sorry for the OT JohnnyT and Thanks for the first complete glimps of the 2014 Sungod.

Yeah they are crazy about them... they really didn't even wana sell me one at the dealership that I work at because of my employee discount... theres a pretty decent mark up on those used runner

I can't imagine what I experienced on Saturday had anything to do with the 2014. That 12 they were trying to sell must have been on their lot a good long time.

Wish I was in the market because the Salsa Red is sharp.

Yeah, the 2014 redesign is poorly done in my opinion. I think if they fixed that mess from the bottom of the headlamps down, it'd be fine. They should have gone with the LED strips that the XB's use instead of those out of place round lights... While I understand why they made the front end so... rounded/Mistubishi like for slightly better clearance, I like the boxier look of the older '10-'12 models, if they were that concerned about clearance they should have just offered a CBI, Demello, SW, ect option! LoL

The dealers make so much coin on used cars its ridiculous! Low-ball people on trades, then rape people on the used car prices. After the first time you told him "no", I would have talked to the GM and told him/her I am taking my business elsewhere because of that particular knuckle-head dealer. Hate em all!

Trouble is the GM's policy likely requires the salesman to pursue you in that aggressive way.

Oh it just seems like yesterday people were poo-pooing the looks of the 5th gen in general and it has revived 4Runner sales and saved it from going extinct and while I think the headlmaps are cool the front is a bit funky and unusual but it won't slow down sales.

No disrespect, but I wouldn't trade my truck in for any 5th gen no matter what the price. Even straight up.

The V8 and the ride quality around town and at speed is absolutely outstanding and rock solid.

If the 5th or whatever gen gets that engine, then I'd consider it.

One word for it................FUGLY.

That front end looks like a 'Transformer' in pain, a lot of pain................

Probably a MAJOR improvement over stock! Almost anything will be better.

Anyone wanna try and photochop the XB's LED slits where the 4Runner's oddball foglight goes and sort of "fix the front end" I'm curious if it'd look a bit better that way.

a lot of people dont slap on some heavy, gaudy bumper to their vehicle, just 90% of everyone here does.