2016 Honda Pilot

[NoDak]

The 2016 Pilot features a panoramic sunroof option for the first time, LED accent lighting all over the inside, up to five 2.5-amp USB ports, plus "an auxiliary jack for nearly any audio player, an HDMI port for a gaming console, two headphone jacks, two 12-volt power outlets and a 115-volt outlet to power just about anything

You'll never have to hear your kids yapping again!
A new 3.5 i-VTEC V6 with cylinder deactivation will make the Pilot "more fuel efficient than ever," paired to a new 6-speed or optional 9-speed automatic. FWD and AWD drivetrains will be available.

The SUV is also bristling with safety tech acronyms... here's the whole rundown:

• Honda LaneWatch™ display
• Blind Spot Indicators
• Multi-Angle Rear View Camera
• Collision Mitigation Braking System™ (CMBS)
• Lane Departure Warning (LDW)
• Forward Collision Warning (FCW)
• Lane Keeping Assist System (LKAS)
• Rear Cross Traffic Monitor
• Adaptive Cruise Control
• ...and a Honda-first Road Departure Mitigation (RDM) system.

 

[NoDak]

continuation of pics

 

[Thai]

Kinda like a Chevy Traverse in look, but good nonetheless. Great features IMHO.

My ONLY problem...and this applies to 2016 MDX and RDX as well...the 9-speed ZF transmission. It is simply not a good transmission the more that you read about it. I sure hope that Honda knows what it is getting into...because this transmission is apparently in all their new products (and current TLX). I sure hope that Honda/Acura did not "upgrade" to this transmission for solely marketing reasons!

Link: ZF's 9-Speed 9HP Transmission Puts Dog Clutches On The Leash - The Truth About Cars

Read the whole article, very educational for me. But this paragraph worries me:

"Downshifts are where the 9HP truly feels different. Because of the design, if you’re in 8th gear and want to pass, the transmission will often need to drop 4 or 5 gears to get to a suitable ratio. To do this the transmission has to accomplish the harder task of engaging two dog clutches. To do this the transmission doesn’t use cone synchros like a manual (too bulky) it uses software. Engaging dog clutches requires a longer and yet more severe reduction in torque than the disengagement because the transmission has to align the clutch and then engage it. In most automatics when you floor the car you get an instant feeling of acceleration that improves as the transmission downshifts. Although there would be moments of power reduction (depending on the programming) during this time, the engine is always providing some force forward. The 9HP’s software on the other hand responds by cutting power initially, then diving as far down the gear-ladder as it can, engaging the dog clutches and then reinstating your throttle command. The result is a somewhat odd delay between the pedal on the floor and the car taking off like a bat out of hell. According to Volvo’s powertrain guys, this shift behavior is one of the main reasons they chose the Aisin 8-speed (shared with the Lexus RX F-Sport) over the ZF 9-speed used by Land Rover and Chrysler."

Lexus and Volvo passed on the 9-ZF because drive-ability sucked.

Link: ZF 9-speed Automatic Problems Mount, Chrysler Releases Third Update for Cherokee - News - Car and Driver | Car and Driver Blog

Recent article in C&D.

""Problems with the ZF-designed nine-speed automatic transmission are continuing to pile up, with customer complaints continuing to roll in regarding new Jeep, Chrysler, and Acura models.

As of today, we counted a total of 145 unique owner complaints posted to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, 126 of which explicitly named the 2014 Cherokee’s transmission. Another 10 transmission complaints were lodged for the new 200, and eight have been posted to the TLX’s log file.

Cherokee, 200, and TLX owners have each reported conditions such as sudden lunges from unexpected downshifts, a lack of kickdown upon entering highways, front-axle vibration in low gears, and complete failures in which the transmission shifts into neutral while driving and lights up the dash with warning lights.

Other owners have reported rollaways in which the vehicle indicated it had engaged park when it was actually in neutral.

While NHTSA has not launched an investigation, Jeep dealers are replacing between 12 to 15 transmissions a week, according to AN. Aside from Honda, there have been no recalls for this transmission, only lots of frustrated owners from these first-year vehicles.

“We have had to do an inordinate amount of intervention on that transmission, surely beyond what any of us had forecast,” FCA CEO Sergio Marchionne said at the Detroit auto show last month.""

Link: Acura MDX: 2016 vs. 2015 - Consumer Reports

Consumer Reports similarly is cautious with the transmission....

 

[LittleCaesar]

I usually just bring the duck tape along to keep the kids quiet. After a few times of applying it, like Pavlov's dogs, they learn and learn well.

In reality it looks great though Honda hopefully has shortened its oil life meter duration period. I have a co worker who had a 2009, where at 88k miles the engine began drinking oil. The rings were cooked and there was a decent amount of sludge. They had a 100k platinum warranty, had gotten all oil changes done and documented at the dealer so in went a remanufactured engine last year.

 

[Thai]

Oh, one more thing...according to EPA, the 2016 MDX gets 18/26 mpg (AWD) with the new 9-speed (ZF) automatic transmission.

2014-2015 MDX with 6-speed auto gets 18/27 mpg (AWD) despite weighing a few hundreds pounds more than the 2016.

Explain that to me. :bolt:

Some on Acura forums have argued that EPA protocols do not take into account the 8th or 9th gear of the new transmission because these ultra-high gears are engaged only at high speeds on the highway (70 or 80 mph?), which may be true. But this also means that most of the time, most folks will never use 8th or 9th gear...and thus gets worst fuel economy. So, again, why the heck did Honda pick this transmission to go into all their cars?!! Marketing?

 

[Thai]

I usually just bring the duck tape along to keep the kids quiet. After a few times of applying it, like Pavlov's dogs, they learn and learn well.

In reality it looks great though Honda hopefully has shortened its oil life meter duration period. I have a co worker who had a 2009, where at 88k miles the engine began drinking oil. The rings were cooked and there was a decent amount of sludge. They had a 100k platinum warranty, had gotten all oil changes done and documented at the dealer so in went a remanufactured engine last year.

My MDX uses full synthetic...and oil meter usually tells me to change oil every 7500 miles.

 

[JayceeP]

You can see the Acura undertones for sure. Looks good to me. I like the MDX but a) it sits, or at least appears to sit, too low now b) with a starting price of $50,000 you're quickly over $60,000 with taxes and options.

 

[Thai]

You can see the Acura undertones for sure. Looks good to me. I like the MDX but a) it sits, or at least appears to sit, too low now b) with a starting price of $60,000, I just can't get my around that price tag!

True that it sits lower than prior gen...ground clearance is 7.3". It is basically an all-weather SUV that has decent handling and good practicality. Definitely NOT for off-roading.

Over here in USA, MDX is actually somewhat of a bargain compared to Lexus RX, Mercedes M-class, BMW X4/5, etc..

 

[JayceeP]

True that it sits lower than prior gen...ground clearance is 7.3". It is basically an all-weather SUV that has decent handling and good practicality. Definitely NOT for off-roading.

Over here in USA, MDX is actually somewhat of a bargain compared to Lexus RX, Mercedes M-class, BMW X4/5, etc..

Yeah I just pulled it up, I guess the price difference isn't that extreme especially since awd is the only option on the Canadian models. We just get screwed on sales taxes- 15% where I live. Oh well, I'm just whining now lol.

A client of mine has the new MDX and drives back and forth to Florida all the time and absolutely loves it. Much better road manners, tech, and fuel economy than the last version.

 

[gm350reratliff]

Looks better than the current Pilot. In my opinion, the worst thing about the pilot is driving it. When driving the pilot, you step into a SUV but as soon as you sit in the drivers seat, all of a sudden you are in a minivan. I use to be a honda fan and consumer but their vehicles haven't gained my attention for years now.

 

[NoDak]

Kinda like a Chevy Traverse in look, but good nonetheless. Great features IMHO.

My ONLY problem...and this applies to 2016 MDX and RDX as well...the 9-speed ZF transmission. It is simply not a good transmission the more that you read about it. I sure hope that Honda knows what it is getting into...because this transmission is apparently in all their new products (and current TLX). I sure hope that Honda/Acura did not "upgrade" to this transmission for solely marketing reasons!

Link: ZF's 9-Speed 9HP Transmission Puts Dog Clutches On The Leash - The Truth About Cars

Read the whole article, very educational for me. But this paragraph worries me:

"Downshifts are where the 9HP truly feels different. Because of the design, if you’re in 8th gear and want to pass, the transmission will often need to drop 4 or 5 gears to get to a suitable ratio. To do this the transmission has to accomplish the harder task of engaging two dog clutches. To do this the transmission doesn’t use cone synchros like a manual (too bulky) it uses software. Engaging dog clutches requires a longer and yet more severe reduction in torque than the disengagement because the transmission has to align the clutch and then engage it. In most automatics when you floor the car you get an instant feeling of acceleration that improves as the transmission downshifts. Although there would be moments of power reduction (depending on the programming) during this time, the engine is always providing some force forward. The 9HP’s software on the other hand responds by cutting power initially, then diving as far down the gear-ladder as it can, engaging the dog clutches and then reinstating your throttle command. The result is a somewhat odd delay between the pedal on the floor and the car taking off like a bat out of hell. According to Volvo’s powertrain guys, this shift behavior is one of the main reasons they chose the Aisin 8-speed (shared with the Lexus RX F-Sport) over the ZF 9-speed used by Land Rover and Chrysler."

Lexus and Volvo passed on the 9-ZF because drive-ability sucked.

Link: ZF 9-speed Automatic Problems Mount, Chrysler Releases Third Update for Cherokee - News - Car and Driver | Car and Driver Blog

Recent article in C&D.

""Problems with the ZF-designed nine-speed automatic transmission are continuing to pile up, with customer complaints continuing to roll in regarding new Jeep, Chrysler, and Acura models.

As of today, we counted a total of 145 unique owner complaints posted to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, 126 of which explicitly named the 2014 Cherokee’s transmission. Another 10 transmission complaints were lodged for the new 200, and eight have been posted to the TLX’s log file.

Cherokee, 200, and TLX owners have each reported conditions such as sudden lunges from unexpected downshifts, a lack of kickdown upon entering highways, front-axle vibration in low gears, and complete failures in which the transmission shifts into neutral while driving and lights up the dash with warning lights.

Other owners have reported rollaways in which the vehicle indicated it had engaged park when it was actually in neutral.

While NHTSA has not launched an investigation, Jeep dealers are replacing between 12 to 15 transmissions a week, according to AN. Aside from Honda, there have been no recalls for this transmission, only lots of frustrated owners from these first-year vehicles.

“We have had to do an inordinate amount of intervention on that transmission, surely beyond what any of us had forecast,” FCA CEO Sergio Marchionne said at the Detroit auto show last month.""

Link: Acura MDX: 2016 vs. 2015 - Consumer Reports

Consumer Reports similarly is cautious with the transmission....

well hopefully the new 4Runner only gets a 6 spd. K.I.S.S. is way better in the long run.

that is the biggest problem I see with anything more than 6 spd, the amount of gears you have to jump down to get into a decent power band.

right now as it is with the 2014 transmission, it takes longer than I like to downshift and get moving. I have to compensate by using sport mode and setting up in 3rd and then shifting down to 2nd to get any oomph or wait for the lag.

but it could just be me and the way I like to drive.

 

[NoDak]

grrr, cant edit my post without it going blank.

anyway,

1. center console, where do you put your elbow?
2. at least the digital speedometer is nice and big (my old age the current 4runner dial speedo is hard to read at a glance so I use the digital readout)
3. like the rear seat hvac controls

 

[Antman]

So, ehhhhh- How's it do offroad?

 

[Thai]

1. center console, where do you put your elbow?

It has armrest that folds down from the side of front seat...like minivans. I would love to have that on my MDX vs. a center console cover/pad.

Official pics: http://hondanews.com/releases/all-n...-chicago-auto-show/photos/2016-honda-pilot-14

 

[Thai]

So, ehhhhh- How's it do offroad?

As good as a Honda Accord on heels. (same with my MDX)

These are all-weather vehicles...not for any type of off-roading that you 4runner owners do. Gravel roads is probably max for Pilot and MDX!

 

[Antman]

As good as a Honda Accord on heels. (same with my MDX)

These are all-weather vehicles...not for any type of off-roading that you 4runner owners do. Gravel roads is probably max for Pilot and MDX!

My question was meant to be more of a joke, but... :thumb:

 

[NoDak]

prob didn't have enough coffee yet to get the sarcasm, at least I did

 

[NoDak]

It has armrest that folds down from the side of front seat...like minivans. I would love to have that on my MDX vs. a center console cover/pad.

Official pics: Related Photos Honda News

didn't notice that. guess that's a good way to keep you from fiddling with the gear selector or resting your fingers/hand on the gear buttons.

I kinda like resting my hand on the shift knob. pretty soon shift knobs are gonna be a dinosaur in these new vehicles.

 

[CookieRoe]

didn't notice that. guess that's a good way to keep you from fiddling with the gear selector or resting your fingers/hand on the gear buttons.

I kinda like resting my hand on the shift knob. pretty soon shift knobs are gonna be a dinosaur in these new vehicles.

I was in a Prius the other day and I also have that habit of resting my hand on the shifter. Only in a Prius, it's knob thingie that it somewhat easy to move around. I know if I inadvertently shifted into R, the computer won't let it, but still, not the same feeling.

That shifter button console looks like it came right out of the RLX.

Thanks for sharing

 

[m85476585]

So, ehhhhh- How's it do offroad?

Probably better than you would think. The biggest problem is probably ground clearance. Honda has tended towards low clearance, and the CR-V is barely higher than a Civic. This is 4 wheel IFS, but it's not impossible to lift if someone wanted to put some work into it.

With some custom fabrication it would be easy to make skid plates and maybe some sliders for it. You might end up building a light frame under it to support all the armor, and finding a few attachment points. My Civic had boxed "frame" sections of the unibody where a hitch could bolt on (for a bike rack). It really needed reinforcement for more than the lightest use, though. I think the old Ridgeline (and maybe the Pilot) had a hybrid frame/unibody construction, so if they keep that there should be some good attachment points for stuff.

The front and rear bumpers look like big pieces of plastic, so extensive fabrication might be needed to replace them and improve breakover and departure angles.

If the 9 speed transmission has an extra low 1st gear, that's almost a substitute for a low range. And if you are doing the kind of stuff where you need a low range, this isn't the right vehicle anyway.

If the all wheel drive system is similar to the old Pilot and Ridgeline, it's actually not a bad design (though I haven't driven one). The VTM-4 system is primarily front wheel drive, but it has a rear driveshaft and a left and right electronic clutch to send power to the rear wheels individually. That basically gives you limited slip, which is better than most all wheel drive vehicles. There seems to be room for improvement in the control electronics, and it wouldn't hurt if they made the clutches stronger or able to have a higher duty cycle. Here's a bit about how it works: http://www.ridgelineownersclub.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=34531&d=1227238751 (source: Honda Ridgeline Owners Club Forums - View Single Post - VTM-4 lock doesn't lock both rear wheels?)

It's nice in theory. Left and right rear clutches give it limited slip in the rear, and the VSC system is supposed to be able to do limited slip in the front with the brakes, like auto LSD or TRAC in Toyotas. But it might not work that well in practice:
A little VTM-4 lock action - Honda Ridgeline Owners Club Forums

I think the Ridgeline has a slightly more aggressive system than the Pilot, but I haven't found any evidence for sure, except a slight difference in the marketing-speak that describes each one.