4Runner Vs. Land Rover Discovery

[Ares]

Rust? While LRs do rust well. So do Toyotas. Cheap metal is in Japan, as well as USA and England. I dont think one will rust quicker than the other. Ford, on the other hand. You can watch them rust.

Durable, Thai! Durable! Land Rovers are made to leak fluid. I was told by a Land Rover owner that if a Land Rover isnt leaking, you better check the fluids.

Durable. Im talking you take the truck out and beat the crap out of it. Strength of parts to take a lickin and keep tickin. Land Rovers are notorious for taking a thrashing and coming back for more. I saw some clips of the infamous Camel Trophy competitions. They beat the holy crap out those Land Rovers and they kept on going. The older Land Rovers like the Series, Range Rover Classics, D90s, Disco Series 1 are as durable as they come off the lot. Even the Disco IIs are incredibly durable. They do break down and have their moments, like all makes, but I have to hand it to Land Rover, their stuff can take the abuse better than most. Albeit, they may not see 200k on the odometer like a Toyota.

I love my old Bronco. Its a blast. I like all different kinds of 4wd vehicles. I think it comes down to what fits your personality. I recently have come to admire the Land Rovers as it seems that they are one of the few that have stuck to their mission and provide an SUV that is built to go offroad. Not like some of these other makes that claim to be an SUV and is simply a minivan with bigger tires. However, now that Ford owns Land Rover, I fear for Land Rover's future. The LR3, as much as it amazed me in its off-road capability, it is a driving computer. And offroad and the elements mixed with computers dont mix well. The Rubicon is fantastic offroad and is old fashioned stout stuff built to handle anything you can dish at it. Plus, with the Rubicon, unlike the LR3 and the new 4runners, there is a massive demand for goodies like suspension systems and body protection. This is why I want to get one and not an LR3 (plus, im not at that financial level) But, for a fun weekend truck the Range Rover Classics, and Disco Is make for a great platform to work with. They are cheap. Check ebaymotors, those old trucks go for less than a couple grand. Right now, there is a Disco on there with over $10k in mods alone that will go for half that. Its like buying the modifications for half price and getting a free truck. But, like I said before, better make sure its up to par or it wont make it 3 blocks.

Right now, Im looking for a good truck. One that is reliable and can get me back and forth to work and make a long trip when needed. And, when I have the time, go in the woods for a little jaunt. Im looking at buying a friends 92 4Runner. I think it will fit the bill perfectly.

 

[Ares]

One other tidbit about Land Rovers in general concerning reliability. I saw a recent TopGear program on Land Rover. They stated that 70 percent of ALL Land Rovers built are still on the road today. That sure sounds like reliability to me. Im not sure where they got that stat. I will say this, the diesel Land Rovers apparently are quite reliable and indestructable.

 

[curtis]

Here's an observation from my brother who did two stints in the Peace Corp.....one in Sierra Leone and another in Botswana.

He said it seemed like the Land Rovers were always breaking down, but the Landcruisers just kept going.

 

[Thai]

Rust? While LRs do rust well. So do Toyotas. Cheap metal is in Japan, as well as USA and England. I dont think one will rust quicker than the other. Ford, on the other hand. You can watch them rust.

Durable, Thai! Durable! Land Rovers are made to leak fluid. I was told by a Land Rover owner that if a Land Rover isnt leaking, you better check the fluids.

Ares, i think that you made the argument for me with the first two paragraphs! BTW, aluminum in LR's are notorious for early rusting...earlier than other makes. Aluminum is extremely hard to make right because they can get corroded by contamination at the factory if not done right...see what Ford had to do to make Jaguar XJ unibody.

Anyway, good luck in gettting your friend's 4runner.

 

[Solice]

I'm a little late in this but anyway..

Ares, your right, I never seen an LR3 offroad but I have ran with a few Rubicons and was completely amazed at the punishment they could take from the factory. I wasn't trying to stir you up I only had a gripe about you saying the LR3 was the best of the showroom.

Heck, arguing a point is part of the fun of forums !

Anyhow like Thai said, I hope you get your buddies '92!

 

[Ares]

Here's an observation from my brother who did two stints in the Peace Corp.....one in Sierra Leone and another in Botswana.

He said it seemed like the Land Rovers were always breaking down, but the Landcruisers just kept going.

That same clip I saw on BBC about landrovers said that over 60 percent of the developing world claim the first vehicle they saw was a Land Rover.

I am not surprised that Landcruiser are being used more frequently. I know that if I were in the "woods" of Africa I would trust a Landcruiser. But, the good thing about the old Land Rovers like the Series III, D90s, and 110s is that they can be worked on with simple tools. They were designed that way. So when, not if, they break down, they are easily repaired. I've had the pleasure of helping a friend work on his 98 Toyota p/u and it was a Royal PITA to get to work on.

I just met a guy from S. Africa at work. I will get his experience.

Also, the US Army Rangers use the Land Rover Defender.

 

[Ares]

I'm a little late in this but anyway..

Ares, your right, I never seen an LR3 offroad but I have ran with a few Rubicons and was completely amazed at the punishment they could take from the factory. I wasn't trying to stir you up I only had a gripe about you saying the LR3 was the best of the showroom.

Heck, arguing a point is part of the fun of forums !

Anyhow like Thai said, I hope you get your buddies '92!

Yep, I think its all a mute point. As long as you like what you drive, thats all that matters.

I did get to ride in that LR3 up a trail and immediately upon entry I felt terribly overdressed. The interior on those things are way nicer that what Im used to. The cabin noise was zilch. Couldnt hear a thing. All he did was adjust this knob on the console and pointed the truck and off we went. We had a very good spotter, mind you, but the truck articulated better than any stock truck Ive seen and with a certain selection it had the diffs locked. Very nice, outa my league, but nice. I have to hand it to the owner, he uses it.

I still would rather have a Rubicon if I were buying a new truck to offroad in. Somehow scratching one of those doesnt seem as bad.

Oh, Im pumped about the 92. I see it everyday and it looks nicer and nicer. Hopefully, I will know something soon.

Take care all.

 

[Larry]

I think it would be easyer to improve the off road capabilities of a 4Runner than to make an LR3 a more reliable vehicle. I towed an LR3 a long way to the highway with my 4Runner. The Land Rover just quit running. The owner was a bit unhappy about it because he though he bought something really special. He was thinking of new names for his Land Rover while we were waiting for a tow truck. He came up with quite a few. My dogs went into the back of the 4Runner because they did not like the tone of his voice. The only place he could tow it to was a dealer. No one else hand any idea of what to do with it and would not accept it for repairs. The repairs were not covered under warranty because the dealer said he had abused the vehicle with his off road driving. Between the repairs to get running and the brake job the dealer insisted he needed the bill just just over $2,000....ouch. Plus the big tow bill. My part of the towing was the only no charge part of driving a Land Rover. I like my 4Runner, but if I had more to spend on a luxo suv, I think I would take a Landcruiser over a LR3 any day. My Land Rover friend has more problems, too, leaky transmission, more electrical problems, door lock failed, more brake problems and drive line noise that is getting worse, to the point that I can hear it driving beside him with my window down. Any one of these problems would be unacceptable to a Toyota owner.

 

[Ares]

I think it would be easyer to improve the off road capabilities of a 4Runner than to make an LR3 a more reliable vehicle. I towed an LR3 a long way to the highway with my 4Runner. The Land Rover just quit running. The owner was a bit unhappy about it because he though he bought something really special. He was thinking of new names for his Land Rover while we were waiting for a tow truck. He came up with quite a few. My dogs went into the back of the 4Runner because they did not like the tone of his voice. The only place he could tow it to was a dealer. No one else hand any idea of what to do with it and would not accept it for repairs. The repairs were not covered under warranty because the dealer said he had abused the vehicle with his off road driving. Between the repairs to get running and the brake job the dealer insisted he needed the bill just just over $2,000....ouch. Plus the big tow bill. My part of the towing was the only no charge part of driving a Land Rover. I like my 4Runner, but if I had more to spend on a luxo suv, I think I would take a Landcruiser over a LR3 any day. My Land Rover friend has more problems, too, leaky transmission, more electrical problems, door lock failed, more brake problems and drive line noise that is getting worse, to the point that I can hear it driving beside him with my window down. Any one of these problems would be unacceptable to a Toyota owner.

I would take a Landcruiser over a LR3 anyday too... onraod.

Offroad, an LR3 will tow the Landcruiser were it cant go.

If it was abused, whats your point. If you went out and abused a new Landcruiser, I think the Toyota dealership would do the same thing. And Im not seeing a 4Runner pulling a massive box like the LR3. I dont think most 1-ton trucks could budge it, let alone a 4runner tow it for a "long" distance. I call BS.

It is no debate. The Toyota products are without a doubt more reliable than LR... and most any other SUV on the market in the past and current. And Toyota is one hell of a off-road vehicle. The older ones anyway (like the pre-98 LC) There are good aftermarket mods that make them unstoppable off road. Toyota pickups are freeks of nature. You cant tear them up if you tried. But, even a Toyota owner has to admire the off-road history of the Land Rover.

 

[Larry]

Did you say BS..... you know the insulation of a computer makes brave men out of .... you don't even know me. I'm a very polite person and I expect the same in return. With statements like that you may grow up quickly some day.

I'm telling you a vehicle that may quit running a few too many times in not a good off road vehicle. Most off roading is done in places where a little skill and two wheel drive will do. The LR3 is just not a complete package. I can pick where I go with my inferior 4Runner and only get stuck now and then. I can't pick where a Land Rover is going to break down.

The dealer told him that off road use was abuse. I made no editorial comment. The Toyota dealer I go to has no problem with beating around in the boonies. They say that's what a 4Runner is made for. 4Runners get modified and driven in places where an LR3 owner would never go, and rightly so. The LR3 is the worst kind of poser, it is very capable but a little fragile and way to expensive and heavy, difficult to get service for and almost no after market for modifications. It's a gentlemans suv and a good vehicle for that.

 

[JB.]

And Im not seeing a 4Runner pulling a massive box like the LR3. I dont think most 1-ton trucks could budge it, let alone a 4runner tow it for a "long" distance. I call BS.

This is an odd non sequitur thrown into an otherwise interesting and, up to this point, logical conversation. He didn't say the wheels fell off and he had to drag it.

 

[Ares]

I said BS and the insulation had no factor in my comments. I may should have said it in a different way. For that I apologize. Let me start over.

Your story sounds a bit exaggerated. I just found it very difficult to believe that a 4Runner could tow a massive vehicle like an LR3 a long way... with the wheels on. That is what I find troublesome about your post. But, hey, my perception may be wrong about a 4Runner pulling another vehicle twice its weight. Did you say the LR3 broke down off-road and you pulled it out of the woods and to the highway? Its hard to believe. But, if it did happen, Im amazed with the little 4Runner. Way to go.

Another thing I found troublesome was the LR dealership that refused the warranty claim. I would also like to know what Land Rover dealership this was. The LR3 owner in your experience has a good hard case in my opinion and someone should tell him. Land Rover dealerships are the most off-road friendly dealerships in the US. How many off-road trips does your Toyota dealership take its former and prospective buyers on. I bought a 01 Tacoma TRD and not once did the dealership offer to take me out into the woods and take it through the paces. I had the pleasure of going on a off-road trip sponsered by Charleston Land Rover in WV. Let me tell you, they beat the dog crap out of these vehicles showing their buyers what they were built to do and what they are capable of. I not talking taking a Highlander to the mall and crawling over six inch curbs, Im talking getting a $90,000 Range Rover buried in mud and a $60,000 Range Rover Sport so off camber, the 8 year old in the back seat started crying. An owner of a freelander ripped the rear bumper of on the trip and the dealership fixed it for her the next week... no charge. So, if this LR3 owner took it off road and beat it irresponsibly, then thats one thing, but if he simply went off road and something broke and it was not abused then it should have been replaced under warranty. If the dealership did deny him repairs for a something that was faulty, then in my opinion, he should threaten to sue.

Which LR dealership was this again? I would like to know so I dont buy a vehicle from them.

Again, I apologize for being inappropriate. Im new to this board and really find it a great place to find information about the 4Runner. I am about to buy my first 4Runner (92) beginning of next month, so I look forward to learning more about it from you guys. But, on the other hand I am not new to the world of off-raoding and find it funny when people who own a particular make of vehicle go out of their way to defend it even when it is incorrect. I guess its that brand-loyalty thing. I hate to burst anyones bubble, but as the original post was asking, to compare a new 4Runner to a new LR3 off the shelf OFFROAD only, an LR3 will go above and beyond the 4Runner off-road. That is a point that I, as a future 4Runner owner, can accept. I do, however, look forward to modifying my 4Runner so that I can spend many pleasureable moments with it offroad and hopefully pull out some of the snotty LR3 owners. I do feel that a the aftermarket allows a 4Runner to get it up to and exceed the capabilities of the LR3. I agree with you Larry in that respect. The towing bit was questionable in my mind, but in retrospect I suppose its possible. A Land Rover dealership frowning on off-roading is very difficult to believe.

 

[Solice]

But, hey, my perception may be wrong about a 4Runner pulling another vehicle twice its weight.

The LR3 is hardly twice the weight of the 4Runner:

4Runner's curb weight is anywhere from 4,045 - 4,530 lbs
(http://www.toyota.com/4runner/specs.html)

LR3's curb weight is anywhere from 5,135 - 5,796 lbs
(http://www.landroverusa.com/us/en/Vehicles/LR3/Specifications/Payload and Towing.htm)

I'm not sure why you find it that hard to believe that a "little 4Runner" could tow an LR3 out of the bush. Are you sure your not confusing the 4Runner with the Rav4 or some other "little" SUV? :rolleye2:

 

[Thai]

An owner of a freelander ripped the rear bumper of on the trip and the dealership fixed it for her the next week... no charge. So, if this LR3 owner took it off road and beat it irresponsibly, then thats one thing, but if he simply went off road and something broke and it was not abused then it should have been replaced under warranty. If the dealership did deny him repairs for a something that was faulty, then in my opinion, he should threaten to sue.

but as the original post was asking, to compare a new 4Runner to a new LR3 off the shelf OFFROAD only, an LR3 will go above and beyond the 4Runner off-road.

Well, if the damage occurred while on a ***Land Rover sponsored*** trip, then LR would be embarrassed for not fixing the lady's Freeloader. This is much different than if i took an LR3 out on my own and damage it.

All service/brands have loop-holes in the warranty to deny you if you seemed to "abuse" your vehicle.

 

[Ares]

All service/brands have loop-holes in the warranty to deny you if you seemed to "abuse" your vehicle.

My point exactly. To say that one Land Rover dealership uses the loop hole and one Toyota doesnt use the loop hole isnt saying all Toyota dealerships dont use the loop hole and all Land Rover dealerships do. The guys at Charleston Land Rover did feel a bit responsible since the service manager was spotting the poor girl. But, nonetheless, they took trucks off the lot, wheeled them, and encouraged their customers to do the same either with them or with out them.

Here is a picture I got from them pulling out a brand new Range Rover HSE that one of the service techs thought could make it through a hole the leader said not to. Im not commenting here on the capabilities of the Range, but rather to say how impressed I was that a dealership would put a $90,000 piece of inventory through a mud hole like that. I asked the guy coordinating the day event about how many dealerships do this, and he said all dealerships are encouraged to take prospects and owners on trail rides. I dont see any other manufacturers doing this. Jeep has their Jamborees, but I dont think they are supported by a dealership other than a sponsorship.

As far as the weights, I stand corrected. I didnt think the Toy had that weight. Tow was 5k lb. Not bad. I apologize for thinking the runner couldnt pull it. I was wrong. Sorry Larry.

 

[Solice]

As far as the weights, I stand corrected. I didnt think the Toy had that weight. Tow was 5k lb. Not bad. I apologize for thinking the runner couldnt pull it. I was wrong. Sorry Larry.

And the V8 is rated to pull 7,000 - 7,300 lbs . Way more then enough to drag an LR3 around all day .

 

[Larry]

I towed the Land Rover about 10 miles along a road that did not require four wheel drive but did require crossing some ditches and the use of a snatch line. The tow company would not send a truck down that road. I did not know that a Land Rover weighed twice my 4Runner. My 4Runner weighs about 4,300 pounds, empty, and I would have been impressed that it towed a vehicle that weighed 8,600 pounds. You have a point about doubting that a 4Runner could tow a four ton dead weight. I'm glad you were not there to give us any advise. We might not have made it out of the boonies to an improved road that the tow truck would come down.

Our friend with the Land Rover is not comming out again, because of all the scratches and little dings. He's the one that told us about the warranty claim. I have no idea what was wrong or what he did.

I've driven this Land Rover and I like it off road much better than on the freeway. I like that little button you twist to tell the Land Rover how to drive you. It's like an arcade game. It's great to play with but what do you do when the warranty runs out, punt?

 

[Ares]

I've driven this Land Rover and I like it off road much better than on the freeway. I like that little button you twist to tell the Land Rover how to drive you. It's like an arcade game. It's great to play with but what do you do when the warranty runs out, punt?

Yep, thats why I wouldnt buy one for off-roading. Kinda takes the fun out of it off-roading by turning that knob and just point and shoot.

As is, they are pretty impressive in their capabilities. But, I would rather buy a used truck that I can modify and not cry every time a branch brushes across it.

 

[Thai]

Here's an owner's experience with LR3 on the G-forum (owns both LR3 and G55 AMG):

"...re.LR3. It really drives well on the highway. The offroading I do is purely on the beach, but it is quite often. The LR3 is the only truck I have ever owned that got stuck in the sand so badly I needed to be pulled out by an outside source...twice. I blame it on the fact that the transmission can not be manipulated once it is stuck, like rocking between reverse and forward. Also, the independant supsension gets hung up easily. That being said, as long as you lower the tires religiously to 20 psi, it drives like a dream.
In comparison to the G...There really is none...the G is much more substantial feeling..the LR3 has some Ford like characteristics and the looks are bland.

The LR3 is a better all around vehicle, more car like especially for long trips, and I dont mind when it has three inches of sand and half eaten popsicles stuck to the seat.

In comparison, when I get in the G55 after a couple of weeks just driving the LR3, I feel like I just grew 3 inches,sprouted some hair, and lost 10 pounds."

Another testdrive of LR3 by a G owner:

"Pretty much my short LR3 experience agrees with yours. I was very impressed by the LR3, especially on the road, but overall I just don't see that they are on the same level, as far as ultimate toughness, off-road prowess, or expected reliability are concerned. I also was turned off by the childish video-game look of the LR3. And then when the very first LR3 I drove broke, that really impressed me. The air-suspension failed while I was way up in the Rockies, and I had to limp/scrape/bump it back to the dealer with no working suspension. It did make it though. The secone LR3 was flawless however, and it really is a nice vehicle, a huge departure from Land-Rover's traditional fare."