Battery dies when the car is off

[miniedman]

I got a 1998 used 4 Runner about 6 months ago. Mostly runs great.

But when I turn the car off, pull out the key, and walk away; some of the electrical components stay on.

Once it was the A/C, other times it has been less noticeable, like the gear lights on the dash (Drive, Park, Reverse, etc) or a small light below a push button on the dash, I think it's for the defroster. When I come back to the car hours later, the battery is dead. My mechanic replaced the Alternator (since it tested bad) but that didn't fix the problem.

Any idea what's going on? So frustrating to be rushing off to work or a date and find the battery dead--again.

 

[IBallEngineer]

I got a 1998 used 4 Runner about 6 months ago. Mostly runs great.

But when I turn the car off, pull out the key, and walk away; some of the electrical components stay on.

Once it was the A/C, other times it has been less noticeable, like the gear lights on the dash (Drive, Park, Reverse, etc) or a small light below a push button on the dash, I think it's for the defroster. When I come back to the car hours later, the battery is dead. My mechanic replaced the Alternator (since it tested bad) but that didn't fix the problem.

Any idea what's going on? So frustrating to be rushing off to work or a date and find the battery dead--again.

Do you have an aftermarket alarm system?

 

[miniedman]

It has an aftermarket stereo, but I don't think it has any other aftermarket enhancements.

 

[IBallEngineer]

It has an aftermarket stereo, but I don't think it has any other aftermarket enhancements.

Well if lights are staying on, it makes me want to blame an alarm. But it could also be some other things. No reason for only a few dash lights to stay on, as the circuit is all tied together. If you can isolate the lamps that stay on, document EXACTLY we can look at those circuits. Can't be vague here.

:couch2:

 

[miniedman]

Sorry about being vague. Problem is; most of the time the car (and all the components) turn off when I turn the key and there's no problem at all.

Of the 3% or 4% of the time that there is a problem:

1/3rd of the time the A/C has stayed on...but that is easy to notice and just turn the switch off.

The rest of the time it's one of the following:
If the Park indicator light stay lit, I can't turn it off. Most of the time I don't even see that it is lit in the bright California sunshine.

If the defrost indicator light is lit, I push the button but it won't turn off. I don't even (or ever) have the defrost on...the indicator light turns on when I turn the car off. Many times I don't notice in the bright CA. sunlight.

Please see the attached document.View attachment Indicator lights.pdf

Thanks for helping out. This is really making me a bit crazy.

 

[IBallEngineer]

Sorry about being vague. Problem is; most of the time the car (and all the components) turn off when I turn the key and there's no problem at all.

Of the 3% or 4% of the time that there is a problem:

1/3rd of the time the A/C has stayed on...but that is easy to notice and just turn the switch off.

The rest of the time it's one of the following:
If the Park indicator light stay lit, I can't turn it off. Most of the time I don't even see that it is lit in the bright California sunshine.

If the defrost indicator light is lit, I push the button but it won't turn off. I don't even (or ever) have the defrost on...the indicator light turns on when I turn the car off. Many times I don't notice in the bright CA. sunlight.

Please see the attached document.View attachment 150069

Thanks for helping out. This is really making me a bit crazy.

Just a thought, but maybe some ignition circuit is not turning off with the key. I'll have to scratch my head a bit.

 

[miniedman]

Thanks!

 

[IBallEngineer]

More thoughts,

the park indicator light is powered by the 10A Gauge fuse. if the light stays lit, pull that fuse and see if the light goes out.

The Rear defrost is controlled by the Body ECU, but the switch indicator light is ALSO powered by that 10A Gauge fuse.

Do you have manual A/C controls? And when you say it stays on, is the button lit, or is the fan running, or both?

 

[miniedman]

More thoughts,

the park indicator light is powered by the 10A Gauge fuse. if the light stays lit, pull that fuse and see if the light goes out.

The Rear defrost is controlled by the Body ECU, but the switch indicator light is ALSO powered by that 10A Gauge fuse.

Do you have manual A/C controls? And when you say it stays on, is the button lit, or is the fan running, or both?

Next time the park indicator light stays lit, I will try to pull the 10A Gauge fuse. Thanks for that!

I do have manual A/C controls. When it stays on, the button is lit AND the fan is running.

 

[curbstomper]

Have you tries a parasitic draw test? It's really easy to do. Just need a multimeter and disconnect the negative terminal and test the milliamps. If it draws I believe more the 600 miliamps the then pull fuses until it drops below and that will tell you which circuit has a problem.

 

[RAD4Runner]

My mechanic replaced the Alternator (since it tested bad) but that didn't fix the problem.

Too late but Alternator would not cause issue like you describe.

...
1/3rd of the time the A/C has stayed on...but that is easy to notice and just turn the switch off.

But you said you already turned the key off...
You mean, turn key back on and turn it back of when you catch the problem?

More thoughts,

the park indicator light is powered by the 10A Gauge fuse. if the light stays lit, pull that fuse and see if the light goes out.

The Rear defrost is controlled by the Body ECU, but the switch indicator light is ALSO powered by that 10A Gauge fuse.

Do you have manual A/C controls? And when you say it stays on, is the button lit, or is the fan running, or both?

Concur.
Sounds like the body ECU is getting stuck in on mode.

 

[TXRick]

I have an aftermarket radio installed as well and when I turn my runner off and remove the key it stays on as well as my in dash clock. I did not use a harness, I spliced the wires together individually and ran power directly to the battery. When I pop the face off, they both turn off. I figured since the radio is directly wired to the battery, this makes sense but I don't understand why the clock stays on as well. I don't know why it does this but I thought I'd throw my experience into the mix.

Also, I was having a problem with the runner battery not holding a charge. Battery tested good and i was about to upgrade the alt when I took a good look at all my connections. Turns out the positive cables seemed tight but one wire (white) was haphazardly sandwiched. I rearranged the terminals to where they all have a better connection and success! Battery holds a charge and I no longer fear that my baby wont start.

Over the years, I've had crazy electrical problems in many different vehicles and more often than not its a loose connection on the battery. Cars do weird things when not properly powered.

Short version....check and clean your connections..couldn't hurt.

 

[Brveagle]

I would suspect ignition switch once you have ruled out everything else.

 

[miniedman]

Have you tries a parasitic draw test? It's really easy to do. Just need a multimeter and disconnect the negative terminal and test the milliamps. If it draws I believe more the 600 miliamps the then pull fuses until it drops below and that will tell you which circuit has a problem.

Thanks, I'll give that a try this weekend.

 

[miniedman]

Too late but Alternator would not cause issue like you describe.


But you said you already turned the key off...
You mean, turn key back on and turn it back of when you catch the problem?



Concur.
Sounds like the body ECU is getting stuck in on mode.

Yea, bummer that replacing the alternator didn't fix the problem. I think it needed to be replaced anyway. The mechanic got a "charging system test diode open", and the alternator was old (1998).

RE the A/C...I turn the car off, pull out the key, hear the A/C fan and see the light still lit---with the car still off, I simply slide the fan lever to the "Off" position. (see attached image of the 1998 A/C controls.).

Appreciate all the advise. I'm going to do some more diagnosing this weekend.

 

[jeremyc74]

Yea, bummer that replacing the alternator didn't fix the problem. I think it needed to be replaced anyway. The mechanic got a "charging system test diode open", and the alternator was old (1998).

RE the A/C...I turn the car off, pull out the key, hear the A/C fan and see the light still lit---with the car still off, I simply slide the fan lever to the "Off" position. (see attached image of the 1998 A/C controls.).

Appreciate all the advise. I'm going to do some more diagnosing this weekend.

The next time the A/C blower stays on, try turning it back on after you've turned it off.

With the issue showing up in random places on the dash, it sounds to me like a ground loop that's allowing certain relays to remain on when they shouldn't. Is there any aftermarket equipment on the vehicle other than the stereo? I'd be tempted to open the dash up and get a look at the stereo wiring first thing. If someone taped up the leads its possible it's come off on and shorting something out. I'm always suspicious of aftermarket wiring first when diagnosing strange electrical issues.

 

[miniedman]

Also, I was having a problem with the runner battery not holding a charge. Battery tested good and i was about to upgrade the alt when I took a good look at all my connections. Turns out the positive cables seemed tight but one wire (white) was haphazardly sandwiched. I rearranged the terminals to where they all have a better connection and success! Battery holds a charge and I no longer fear that my baby wont start.

Short version....check and clean your connections..couldn't hurt.

Great idea! I did replace the "positive" battery cable right after I got the car. Maybe something is loose or I didn't install it right. That would be sweet if it solves it. Thanks!

 

[miniedman]

The next time the A/C blower stays on, try turning it back on after you've turned it off.

I'll give that a try

Is there any aftermarket equipment on the vehicle other than the stereo?

Not that I know of.

I'd be tempted to open the dash up and get a look at the stereo wiring first thing. If someone taped up the leads its possible it's come off on and shorting something out. I'm always suspicious of aftermarket wiring first when diagnosing strange electrical issues.

Ugg. "open the dash"? I know your right, but it may be time for a professional.

 

[MONTYMTB]

Ugg. "open the dash"? I know your right, but it may be time for a professional.

Don't be intimidated by that, getting to radio wiring is extremely easy on a 3rd gen.

 

[jeremyc74]

Don't be intimidated by that, getting to radio wiring is extremely easy on a 3rd gen.

Exactly! I've done it several times, but at this point I can have the radio laying in the floor in about 5 minutes. I love how easy these things come apart.