Best way to learn?

rkymtnman

rkymtnman

New member
So this might be an odd question but as I read this forum - specifically as it pertains to trail running and more serious off road adventuring - I have seen what can happen when one gets in over their proverbial head. Gravity always wins :)

That said - what are some recommendations for some relative newbys interested in getting in to some more serious off road adventuring? Books? Clubs? Videos? Common sense has always been an ally but at some point, certain automatic reflexes can cause some bad things to happen if done at inappropriate times....like stabbing the brakes.

I really want to learn what I don't know....but not sure exactly how to go about it. This is more about technique and gaining experience as there are some really great threads on what to have along in terms of preparedness. Thoughts?
 
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This is actually not an easy question to answer. Different people will have different views on it so this is my view.

Get out and wheel. Nothing will prepare you for wheeling like wheeling. Reading and watching something can give you an idea of what to expect but nothing will prepare you for actually doing it other than doing it.

If you like other people clubs can be a great way to learn and have support if needed. Practice vehicle recovery skills either with a club or solo but know them before you need to use them. Nothing is worse than being stuck, not because your really stuck, but because you don't know the appropriate way to self rescue. This is the part where reading then practicing will really help.

If you've got common sense you should be fine. I wheel alone all the time on stuff that is pretty sketch. I have common sense, a very good sense of spatial awareness, the skills to self rescue if needed, and the hiking power to get out on foot if shit really goes south. Every time I pull up to something hard solo I analyze not only the obstacles but how far in I am. Do I have cell service? If not where is the closet spot to get it. Did I pack my go bag?

So combine that common sense with learning a bit about vehicle recovery then get out and get after it.
 
Try new stuff. I can now do the stuff I was scared of on the trail initially now that I know my rig and I got the tire psi perfect and blah blah blah. It takes time and you just gotta keep trying till you get over your head or learn how to do stuff better the next time.

I never thought it would happen but the local trial I run is now easy, and to make it more challenging I need to spend another 3k in armor to bounce off rocks. And in reality I'm running the same trail, just a slightly different line. So basically I'm over it until I move next year. I'll rather have new trails to run or I'll sell my runner and buy a truck. Depends where I transfer to.
 
Get a dirt bike. No joke. I've ridden motocross and off-road for a good part of my life yet I rarely spent time in the driver's seat of an SUV whilr offroading until I got my 4runner 6 years ago.

Riding a dirt bike makes you really capable of quickly picking lines and finding the smoothest route through sections. You get good at looking well ahead and making wise decisions. Also, you get really good about not locking up when things start to go pear shaped. Your reaction stays calm yet quick. Another thing is that you get comfortable with feeling a little loose on traction and still keep tracking the right direction.

The first few times I took my 4runner offroading a few of the guys I went with kept remarking how

A) surprisingly capable my truck was
B) how good I was at picking lines

The former I have little influence over since my truck isn't far off from stock other than a very mild lift and upgraded tires. The latter, however, I can completely attribute to nearly 2 decades of racing/riding off-road on my dirtbikes.
 
Great stuff...thanks. We (my Son actually) are presently building up a t4r. It should be pretty damn sweet when we are done. It is the "what next?" part I was thinking about last night...it will see trail use and I just want to make sure we are smart about how we go about that.

The "go bag" is a killer idea I never really though much about. We always have "survival stuff" along but that would be more for remaining with the truck. A pack for hiking out has been added to the list. We are all in excellent shape so a 10, 15, 20 mile hike out wouldn't be an issue IF we were properly prepared and equipped.

As far as the motorcycle idea - LOVE IT. We used to trail ride a lot as a family. Sold our bikes a few years back and have regretted it ever since. We do a shit ton of mountain biking which is not all that dissimilar aside from being able to power out of things. Picking lines while flying down a technical trail is second nature. We all race enduro events throughout Colorado and Utah. Never thought about the cross over but it makes perfect sense.

Seems like being well prepared and taking it slow...but diving right in is a reasonable plan - and spending some time practicing recovery skills. I don't mind people but coordinating schedules can some times be a PITA. I travel a ton for my job and end up in Europe most of the time for extended periods. I want to be able to equip my Son with the skills he (we) need so when I am gone, I don't have to worry as much about him.

thanks for the input....keep it coming!
 
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I agree with everything said here, including the dirt bike suggestion, and I would add mountain bike/skiing to the line-picking skill set. Visualizing the "run" before going down helps with pacing and timing. Getting out and walking down tricky sections and back up gives you a different perspective and view of the terrain that you cannot see from the driver's seat.

Look here on the forum for a thread/group in your state/area, say hello and ask when those guys are meeting up. Most guys here welcome new wheelers and will mentor you. Also, look at 4x stores in your area, they often have trail days and offer "free training" which is usually more of a sales op (this is why you need to buy this) but it get's you out and with other like-minded people.

Good luck and have fun
 
I definitely recommend the dirt biking advice but as this takes years to become good at, plus the purchase of a bike and gear, I agree that you just need to start wheeling. But, go with a group of people that are better than you. Learn how they drive, what lines they take, talk to them, etc. My first trip was by myself and one other guy who didn’t really offroad much. I didn’t learn much that day. Then, I went with a group, actually a So Cal group from T4R.org of about 15 trucks, and we did Cleghorn and 2N17X. I was psyching myself out on 2N17X’s Gatekeeper but once I saw everyone else do it with the same 4Runner that I had, I knew the truck could do it. It was if I could do it. I then committed to it after words of encouragement from the others and the rest is history. I’ve now been to really tough stuff (Sidewinder in Corral Canyon, Black Bear Pass in CO, Chicken Rock and Mengel Pass in Death Valley, etc.) and love it.

Also, this book is really good from driving with two feet (if you drive an automatic), navigating through sand, snow, rock, logs, etc. There’s also info on airing down, recovery, winches, winching, hi-lift jacks, etc. I have a copy in my truck when I wheel.

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I learned wheeling skills back before cell phones and youtube by getting out there with some buddies and seeing how far we could drive along certain tracks. It was all trial and error. Then we discovered offroading magazines and started seeing all the crap we could buy to improve our rigs and reading tips and tricks articles to give us new things to try out. Now, the internet has TONS of learning resources and you can get a great head start on things before you even hit the trails for the first time.
My point? I don't think there's a 'best' way to learn, there's just many different ways to learn. But I would recommend getting into it with some friends. It's always quicker to get towed out of a bog hole than using a winch :D
 
rkymtnman said:
So this might be an odd question but as I read this forum - specifically as it pertains to trail running and more serious off road adventuring - I have seen what can happen when one gets in over their proverbial head. Gravity always wins :)

That said - what are some recommendations for some relative newbys interested in getting in to some more serious off road adventuring? Books? Clubs? Videos? Common sense has always been an ally but at some point, certain automatic reflexes can cause some bad things to happen if done at inappropriate times....like stabbing the brakes.

I really want to learn what I don't know....but not sure exactly how to go about it. This is more about technique and gaining experience as there are some really great threads on what to have along in terms of preparedness. Thoughts?
Click to expand...

+1 on the Four Wheelers Bible. . .

Also, this video covers from very basic up a bit. It's pretty long, but has some good info in it. Worth the watch. . .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FcTTPV9JmIE
 
Get out there and do it. Don't get too aggressive though. If you are unsure get out and look. There's no shame in that. When you're looking think about how putting one tire somewhere can effect the rest of the truck, and the center of gravity. Don't be afraid to stack rocks if you need to. Doing a little reading and research is good, but it can only help so much. Getting out there and doing it is the best solution. Be smooth with all your actions too, gas and brake.

Read up on something like two foot driving with and automatic, and then next time you're out give it a shot. Keep things in mind also like going down it's better to let gravity do it's thing than stab the brakes. When you stab the brakes you transfer all the weight of the truck forward. The first time you do it though and you feel the truck start to get a little tippy, you'll learn to not do that again.
 
Common sense isn't common! Go with a mature group who is happy to take you under their wing. Teach you how to spot for someone. Leave the testosterone at home. It's always better to back out and live to ride/wheel or whatever another day. AND..............LEARN TO TREAD LIGHTLY...............It's about finesse, not noise and dust, and trail damage.
 
Simple and easy answer. Get with a club and wheel with them.....

There are so many clubs here in Colorado it's mind numbing lol.
 
I second that, find a good club. Most have personalities, and unfortunately politics. So find one that feels like they are a group you can enjoy being with. I think the ones I have enjoyed the most were; Guys and Gals who didn't mind helping you fix something after work, or on a weekend. Groups that were pretty layed back and easy going. The "run what you brung" crowd. And the Yankee ingenuity crowd were always the most fun for me. But I'm sure others might have other ideas. Larger clubs will have more options for friendships.
 
04rnr said:
what part of Colorado are you in?
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Thanks for all the replies! We are up in the Thornton area. I love all the advise - it really helps. I find most of it applies to everything in life :)

I prefer to learn from others as opposed to making my own stupid mistakes - not that I wouldn't make them anyway! As avid mountain bikers, we are all about the whole tread lightly philosophy. I also used to live in the back country on my snowmobile so I get the whole perception of the sport to the not-so-motorized-friendly crowds here in CO.

Sounding like a club might be the best approach. I'll have to dig around a bit. I mostly am hoping to find a great environment to help my Son learn - and me to a more limited extent. He is finishing up building a '98 and wants to do some wheeling. He wants to learn and I don't have the skills/experience to teach him.....hence the subject of my post. His '98 should be done next week and back on the road - then we'll get to shake out all the bugs. He has done 98% of the work with me getting him tools and offering hands and advise as needed (nice change for sure!). Better yet, it has been his money too!

Thanks for all the input. I have ordered up those books and will put them under the Christmas Tree along with some recovery tools :).
 
All great tips. I'll add one more that I kept in mind when I first started wheeling (always alone, cos I'm a dummy). Depending on how new you are: 2wd is for going in; 4wd is for getting home. In other words, as soon as you think you think you're going to *need* 4wd just to go further down the trail, time to turn around (unless you know the trail and know you can get through to the end in 2wd). It's the sissy way to wheel, but when you're alone it can save a lot pain and sorrow (ask me how I know!)

Alternately, high range is for going in, low range is for getting home. Same principle.

Once you've got some seat time, some recovery practice and confidence, you cane trade these guidelines for a couple extra pair of drawes - cos if you don't sh*t yourself you're not doing it right!
 
rkymtnman said:
Thanks for all the replies! We are up in the Thornton area. I love all the advise - it really helps. I find most of it applies to everything in life :)

I prefer to learn from others as opposed to making my own stupid mistakes - not that I wouldn't make them anyway! As avid mountain bikers, we are all about the whole tread lightly philosophy. I also used to live in the back country on my snowmobile so I get the whole perception of the sport to the not-so-motorized-friendly crowds here in CO.

Sounding like a club might be the best approach. I'll have to dig around a bit. I mostly am hoping to find a great environment to help my Son learn - and me to a more limited extent. He is finishing up building a '98 and wants to do some wheeling. He wants to learn and I don't have the skills/experience to teach him.....hence the subject of my post. His '98 should be done next week and back on the road - then we'll get to shake out all the bugs. He has done 98% of the work with me getting him tools and offering hands and advise as needed (nice change for sure!). Better yet, it has been his money too!

Thanks for all the input. I have ordered up those books and will put them under the Christmas Tree along with some recovery tools :).
Click to expand...

I live in Westminster (92nd & Wads). The only "club" i'm a part of is Rising Sum Land Cruisers. Other than that a few groups on FB.
Going wheeling this weekend if you want to join.
Probably hit Cony Flats, MSV on Saturday.
 
Some good interesting advice here. Much of witch I wish I had many years ago................So get out there, plan to get stuck a few times. Remember, its about the ADVenture. have some fun.
Learn what your other foot is for. You have two feet, use them, and not for walking. So as a matter of technique, this is a great one.
Throttle response is delayed,(exaggerated on newer vehicles with electric servos for throttles). So learn to bring the RPM up with the throttle, and hold the brake. Hold STEADY throttle and modulate the brake. this does several things for you. One........It is smooth, smooth is good because you brake less things, tear up the road less and generally finesse you way through better. Two, it tends to hold the wheel with less traction better. So forcing torque to the wheel with the most traction. It's no substitute for lockers, or better suspension flex, but helpful. Great little tip. Oh, I should say works best with automatics. Guess that just comes natural, in a society that can't drive manuals.
 
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