Buying Advice - 17' KDSS only comes in Two Colors?

[skimann20]

Hey Gang.
I currently own a 2007 4runner Sport Silver with Xreas suspension and the new 4runners are haunting my dreams and I'm really thinking about going to get a new one.
So I went and test drove a Off Road Premium w/out KDSS and I would say that i could feel NO difference between the two truck besides in the corners. The 2017 had body roll that my 07 does not. I was sad that my truck with 130K+ miles "drove" better. There are NO KDSS 4runners in the New England area for me to drive to compare. In all honesty I think i maybe slightly crazy for spending 40K for a new truck that really isn't any difference with my 07' truck.
The other thing that i came across when trying to find a KDSS is that you can only get the KDSS in dark blue and gray? that sucks. I mean i like the gray but i'm fairly set on Silver or White. Why would Toyota do that? completely stupid.
- I will be doing a lift on this truck so the stock suspension is gone, that will help with corning?
- 95% of this trucks life will be highway/backroads, trucking kids to soccer, and ski trips.

so... does anyone know what the 18' KDSS colors will be? (sounds like 16' had white and KDSS) suck it up and get a gray one with KDSS? or just forget the KDSS and depend on the aftermarket suspension to make me happy.

All thoughts and opinions are welcome.

 

[Engineer]

Have you gone to the Toyota website and configured models in different regions (states?) That is the first I have heard of only being offered in 2 colors. That was certainly not the case a couple years ago and I highly doubt they went to that model but I have been wrong before.

Regarding adding suspension, yes it will change how it handles but the primary benefit discussed here for changing is to eliminate the nose dive during braking, less so during cornering, although there will be a some positive benefit with regards to body roll if you move to a stiffer suspension

Depending on your area I would see if anyone with a 4runner with aftermarket suspension is available for a test drive. My understanding , although not backed up by data or first person testing is that for Flatness in Corners KDSS>XREAS>Standard , now where aftermarket setups fall is going to depend but I would say you would be hard pressed to get the level of flatness of a KDSS runner without having an overly stiff suspension for street use BUT just because its > does not mean its something most folks could tell the difference between (I would likely fall in that category)

 

[skimann20]

Have you gone to the Toyota website and configured models in different regions (states?) That is the first I have heard of only being offered in 2 colors. That was certainly not the case a couple years ago and I highly doubt they went to that model but I have been wrong before.

Just changed the zip code to Denver (old stoping grounds) I can get it in any color! what the heck is this all about?! Why would they only ship two colors to NE? Great now how do I shop for KDSS in other states? Anyone have a suggestion on this?

Engineer: great suggestion on trying to drive a local guys 4runner. Anyone want to offer. ;-)

 

[philsey]

It's not Toyota, it's what your region has decided to offer. If asked, they'll blame Toyota to keep you from looking, but it's the region. You could get lucky and find a dealer who'll swap outside the region. Lots of forum members travel to get what they want. Be aware tho, that you may catch shit over warranty work with a modified KDSS truck, especially bought elsewhere.

This may help:

Determining Your Region for Toyota Deals
Toyota divides the country into 12 regions, offering different deals in each. The territories are listed below. As you research your purchase, keep in mind that you’re not limited to the region you live in.
If there is a significantly better deal available in another region, it might be worth the trouble to travel and buy there. If someone offered you a few thousand dollars to drive to a nearby state and back, you might very well take the deal -- why not make the same drive to save that money on a new car? Once you know your region, make sure you check out the Best Toyota deals available to you.
New England Region -- Maine, Vermont, New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Rhode Island
Greater New York Region -- New York, New Jersey, Connecticut
Central Atlantic Region -- Pennsylvania, Maryland, Virginia, West Virginia, Delaware, District of Columbia
Southeast Region -- North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Florida
Western Region -- Missouri, Iowa, Kansas, Nebraska, South Dakota, North Dakota
Ohio Valley Region -- Ohio, Michigan, Kentucky, Tennessee
Midwest Region -- Illinois, Indiana, Wisconsin, Minnesota
Mountain Region -- Colorado, New Mexico, Arizona, Utah, Nevada, Wyoming
Gulf States Region -- Texas, Oklahoma, Arkansas, Louisiana, Mississippi
Northern CA Region -- California north of the Los Angeles metro area
Southern CA Region -- Los Angeles metro area, and areas south
Pacific Northwest Region -- Washington, Oregon, Idaho, Montana

 

[Muzzle of Bees]

The solution to your concern is to change driving behavior. I don't like speed limits, but our vehicles are examples of ones that should adhere to them closely.

Nose dive occurs when a vehicle enters a corner at a speed that it is not set up for, but attempts to enter it like a sports car. It also occurs in straight lines too. If you are applying your brakes late nose dive will occur, or you don't stop soon enough. These are free.
KDSS is probably really nice for off roading where the path is rutted and narrow. I would not use it for on road manners. That is baiting bad drivers.

 

[TEujunga]

The solution to your concern is to change driving behavior. I don't like speed limits, but our vehicles are examples of ones that should adhere to them closely.

Nose dive occurs when a vehicle enters a corner at a speed that it is not set up for, but attempts to enter it like a sports car. It also occurs in straight lines too. If you are applying your brakes late nose dive will occur, or you don't stop soon enough. These are free.
KDSS is probably really nice for off roading where the path is rutted and narrow. I would not use it for on road manners. That is baiting bad drivers.

My take is completely opposite from this.

If you read around the KDSS-related threads on this site, you'll find almost universal praise for the on-road handling improvement provided by KDSS. I personally am pleased with the way it limits body roll and provides stability and security when cornering.

Also, nose dive in 5th Gen T4Rs seems to be a universal compliant -- it's not limited to those who brake too hard going into corners. I notice it mostly when coming to a full stop from slow speeds, not during cornering.

Finally, I don't think using poor vehicle dynamics as a way to enforce speed limits is a very good idea. There is never a downside to improved on-road handling, in my estimation. Better is always safer.

For the OP, I suggest buying out of state. That's what I did, and I have no regrets. The sales tax and registration process was not as difficult as I feared.

 

[T5RUNNER]

Hey Gang.

So I went and test drove a Off Road Premium w/out KDSS and I would say that i could feel NO difference between the two truck besides in the corners.

Well, they basically are the same truck. The only way to improve cornering would be to get one with KDSS. It is a huge difference.

The strangest part of having KDSS is that it corners like a vehicle with a stiff sport suspension, but then when you brake there is still the massive brake dive that all the 4runners have. My 6112 kit helped significantly reduce the brake dive and the truck rides and handles much better now.

 

[Trixx]

When I bought my 2017 magnetic grey trd Off Road they also had a 2017 silver trd Off Road with KDSS, so they definitely exist, unless you're looking for a different trim.

I drove the two back to back and didn't notice a big difference so I went non-kdss.

 

[GearJunkie88]

Well, they basically are the same truck. The only way to improve cornering would be to get one with KDSS. It is a huge difference.

I don't have KDSS and resolved the lean/nose dive problems with better shocks and springs. That's probably not a 1-for-1 exchange for KDSS, but seems like a pretty good resolution and you don't have to drive to CO to get the color you want.

I was looking for a gray SR5 4wd without 3rd row seats and couldn't find it anywhere in TX... but they had billions in CO. Gulf States Toyota seems to dictate what we can buy here in the greatest state/country in the US.

 

[Friggin Idiot]

Just did a specific search on Cars.com using Boston Zip code. You've got a few within a half day drive.
At least you have some in your region, Gulf States won't even order any with KDSS! I ended up considering the cost of shipping it to me as part of the sales price. Figured if I was dropping $40k on a new vehicle I wasn't sacrificing a single thing that I felt important, not even to save $1500. Call some of the dealerships listed, drop a deposit over the phone if that's what it takes to reserve it.

 

[Drewski77]

Gotta be regional

I have a 2017 TRD Off Road w/KDSS in Super White and I live in Orlando

Best of luck on your purchase

 

[05Rrunner]

Why not just pick your favorite dealer near you and special order? I've been special ordering Toyotas since the 80s . Some people call it a special request but whatever you want to call it they build me exactly what I want.
Living out here in Southern California every trail edition I found came with KDSS. I'm not a fan of it so , I always special order takes approximately four months. But I have always had a great experience.

 

[Muzzle of Bees]

My take is completely opposite from this.

If you read around the KDSS-related threads on this site, you'll find almost universal praise for the on-road handling improvement provided by KDSS. I personally am pleased with the way it limits body roll and provides stability and security when cornering.

Also, nose dive in 5th Gen T4Rs seems to be a universal compliant -- it's not limited to those who brake too hard going into corners. I notice it mostly when coming to a full stop from slow speeds, not during cornering.

Finally, I don't think using poor vehicle dynamics as a way to enforce speed limits is a very good idea. There is never a downside to improved on-road handling, in my estimation. Better is always safer.

For the OP, I suggest buying out of state. That's what I did, and I have no regrets. The sales tax and registration process was not as difficult as I feared.

KDSS is not being questioned in regards to how it helps with on road handling, but it comes at a cost. Yep, nose dive is a universal compliant because universally there are a lot of stupid people driving. Finally, these are not designed to be driven as sports cars. But, some people are to dumb to get that too.

 

[skimann20]

Hello all,
thanks for all the feedback it is truly appreciated! After searching out to 250miles it looks like they are in NY and PA. Brad now has a happy face and my wife is now really in fear of this actually happening. The worst part of searching that far, the dealership that has a silver one with KDSS (and wife's request of sunroof) also has a cement PRO (only $1k more)... I love that cement gray color.

I've read "100s" of pages on KDSS and it seems to me that everyone is very happy with the purchase. This nose dive you are all describing sound horrible. I don't get this at all with my truck. The 4runner I test drove, I was "nice" to it. I had no intentions of buying it and it only had 2miles on the clock. I felt really bad but that's all they had.

Thank you all for your useful information. it looks like i may have to take a extra long lunch break one day to go get a cheese steak and a 4runner. Next thing to start search for is what people are paying for the new premiums. they already have one up on me because i'll be out of state. "o you know, I was just passing through and thought I'd see what you hadon the lot... o you have a KDSS silver/white 4runner on the lot. no kidding? what are the chances?" lol I'm screwed...

 

[Cymon]

Hello all,
thanks for all the feedback it is truly appreciated! After searching out to 250miles it looks like they are in NY and PA. Brad now has a happy face and my wife is now really in fear of this actually happening. The worst part of searching that far, the dealership that has a silver one with KDSS (and wife's request of sunroof) also has a cement PRO (only $1k more)... I love that cement gray color.

I've read "100s" of pages on KDSS and it seems to me that everyone is very happy with the purchase. This nose dive you are all describing sound horrible. I don't get this at all with my truck. The 4runner I test drove, I was "nice" to it. I had no intentions of buying it and it only had 2miles on the clock. I felt really bad but that's all they had.

Thank you all for your useful information. it looks like i may have to take a extra long lunch break one day to go get a cheese steak and a 4runner. Next thing to start search for is what people are paying for the new premiums. they already have one up on me because i'll be out of state. "o you know, I was just passing through and thought I'd see what you hadon the lot... o you have a KDSS silver/white 4runner on the lot. no kidding? what are the chances?" lol I'm screwed...

Check TrueCare, Edmonds and Costco pricing. You can find the prices to compare online with the trim and features you want and have the Internet sales people at the dealerships work for you. In my experience this is one of the better ways to do it as usually the internet sales people make comission on # of vehicles sold vs. price over bottom line like a lot of floor sales associates. Once you have a few internet sales people competing against one another you can usually get a pretty fair price.

Also keep in mind state sales tax. If you are buying from a state with lower sales tax than yours you will have to make up the difference between the two when you register your vehicle.

I used this approach when living in California and I was moving to Florida. SE Toyota didn't have any selection of what I wanted. I had internet sales people in California and Maryland (where I still own a property so I could register it there) competing. The lowest price was from a dealer in California, so I used their price to compete with the dealerships in Maryland and ended up getting the Maryland dealership match the California price but saved $1500 in taxes by buying in Maryland. My only regret was not being able to drive cross-country for my move in a new 4Runner.

Edit: FYI I used TrueCar for all of my price negotiations.