Choosing a suspension.

[SchmittyUSAF]

I've been all over this forum for the past week, slid onto a Tacoma forum for some info, and been in contact with a reputable local fab/offroad shop for help on this topic. I'm looking at upgrading my OME setup to an Icon, Fox or King setup in the near future and I'm looking to do this right. Talking and reading I've learned all about progressive (Fox and King), digressive (Icon) and linear and that I've seen some people mention to stick with progressive if you have KDSS but not why. I've also seen some threads that contradict each other when talking about the differences in progressive and digressive suspensions on different terrain (street, dirt/washboard, whoops, etc) and want to make sure I have good up to date info (a couple of the pages i read were dated to 2014 which im guessing the manufacterers of these suspensions have made changes since then). If anyone has any good info on this it would be appreciated before I spend 2-3k on a suspension lol. TIA

 

[Inv4drZm]

Buy whichever color you want, as long as it is properly set up for your truck with the right springs for your weight.

 

[MTN4RNR]

I've been all over this forum for the past week, slid onto a Tacoma forum for some info, and been in contact with a reputable local fab/offroad shop for help on this topic. I'm looking at upgrading my OME setup to an Icon, Fox or King setup in the near future and I'm looking to do this right. Talking and reading I've learned all about progressive (Fox and King), digressive (Icon) and linear and that I've seen some people mention to stick with progressive if you have KDSS but not why. I've also seen some threads that contradict each other when talking about the differences in progressive and digressive suspensions on different terrain (street, dirt/washboard, whoops, etc) and want to make sure I have good up to date info (a couple of the pages i read were dated to 2014 which im guessing the manufacterers of these suspensions have made changes since then). If anyone has any good info on this it would be appreciated before I spend 2-3k on a suspension lol. TIA

Doing a write up right now (to be released in the coming weeks) talking about this topic. Researching what you want and factors to consider when purchasing. One thing that I will say is check out if you have any local certified shops for either 3 brands that can install/adjust/rebuild/revalve whichever shocks you are looking to have installed. That might make a difference in your long term investment. FWIW, I installed Kings because of their reputation for quality and their customer service :thumb3:

 

[wfo9]

Nothing has changed.. The tech is all basically the same for the past 50+ years. Until something like spool valve technology gets to the aftermarket there is nothing ground breaking really. Just high quality versions of the same basic technology. There are internal bypass shocks along with piggybacks and the like.. but I doubt you want that complexity.

You are not going to go wrong with any of those 3 major brands mentioned.

It comes down to picking a color... There are differences though.

I like ICON because you can adjust them on the truck with no issues and order them with the correct spring for your wight at no extra cost. Those are two major issues when it comes to installation time and cost with the other brands, IMHO...

As far as progressive vs digressive and KDSS. The KDSS tends to be a bit harsh at speed (it's just what happens with a very stiff sway bar on uneven terrain). Anything that can make initial travel more compliant should help that a bit. That is the only reason I think progressive might be a tad better with KDSS. No real empirical evidence.. just an educated guess.

Customer service is a big part of it also. King is good and so is Icon. Can't really say anything great about Fox customer service. They do have the best tech for the dampening adjustment... I tried to get them for that reason, but the wait times for their LT stuff was too high to even consider them in the end. They do not have unseasonable lead times for their OEM stuff.

 

[Jetboy]

I think there's a bit of misunderstanding on ICON shocks. AccuTune stripped a set down and did a writeup a few years ago on them. They are not digressive in compression dampening. They are the same as all the others in compression. They are digressive only in rebound dampening. I'm not sure how that benefits or detracts from ride quality overall. Rebound in my mind should be a relatively constant force as compared to compression that has a very wide range of forces. They're set up softer than Fox. I haven't had a chance to compare to King.

Importantly - they are not digressive compression like some other shocks that are typically known as "digressive shocks".

I'm guessing that all 3 are pretty darn close.

The other things that may or may not matter are build materials and fittings.

An ICON shock is very comparable to a Fox Performance series rather than a Fox Factory series. I think King are closer to a Fox Factory series. Here's a good explanation of the differences. http://accutuneoffroad.com/articles/fox-2-5-factory-series-vs-2-5-performance-series/

For most people - it probably doesn't make a bit of difference. Personally - I prefer the ICON dampening better. And I have FOX shocks.

 

[wfo9]

I think there's a bit of misunderstanding on ICON shocks. AccuTune stripped a set down and did a writeup a few years ago on them. They are not digressive in compression dampening. They are the same as all the others in compression. They are digressive only in rebound dampening. I'm not sure how that benefits or detracts from ride quality overall. Rebound in my mind should be a relatively constant force as compared to compression that has a very wide range of forces. They're set up softer than Fox. I haven't had a chance to compare to King.

Interesting take on it. and interesting article.. but I don't think they are exactly like the others. I think they are saying they are basically liner on compression and mildly digressive on rebound. I think King and Fox tend to be more progressive, not linear. It's splitting hairs.. and probably not all that much different, but they do have a bit more on road stability IMHO, however the lines get very blurred with spring rates etc. I think you could literally put all three on a dart board and throw a dart and be happy in the end. I'm moving to Kings for my LT, but it had nothing to do with being disappointed in ICON. Just wanted to try something different and will actually still have ICON in the rear.

 

[Toffees]

The guy at Filthy has some good (and long) videos talking in detail about suspensions. He's a King guy (who wouldn't be, after hearing that?) but it may help listening to him describe the differences.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MsKf1lIYI0

 

[SchmittyUSAF]

Thanks everyone. This has been helpful and exactly what I wanted. People talking about the actual tech and not just 'I have this and like it'. The trend I'm seeing is that all three are good choices (which I already gathered from searching) with little differences in colors, cost, and small differences in performance.

Doing a write up right now (to be released in the coming weeks) talking about this topic. Researching what you want and factors to consider when purchasing. One thing that I will say is check out if you have any local certified shops for either 3 brands that can install/adjust/rebuild/revalve whichever shocks you are looking to have installed. That might make a difference in your long term investment. FWIW, I installed Kings because of their reputation for quality and their customer service :thumb3:

Cool, I'll be looking out for that. I am on a little bit of a time crunch but I might wait till I see that before I decide.

Nothing has changed.. The tech is all basically the same for the past 50+ years. Until something like spool valve technology gets to the aftermarket there is nothing ground breaking really. Just high quality versions of the same basic technology. There are internal bypass shocks along with piggybacks and the like.. but I doubt you want that complexity.

You are not going to go wrong with any of those 3 major brands mentioned.

It comes down to picking a color... There are differences though.

I like ICON because you can adjust them on the truck with no issues and order them with the correct spring for your wight at no extra cost. Those are two major issues when it comes to installation time and cost with the other brands, IMHO...

As far as progressive vs digressive and KDSS. The KDSS tends to be a bit harsh at speed (it's just what happens with a very stiff sway bar on uneven terrain). Anything that can make initial travel more compliant should help that a bit. That is the only reason I think progressive might be a tad better with KDSS. No real empirical evidence.. just an educated guess.

Customer service is a big part of it also. King is good and so is Icon. Can't really say anything great about Fox customer service. They do have the best tech for the dampening adjustment... I tried to get them for that reason, but the wait times for their LT stuff was too high to even consider them in the end. They do not have unseasonable lead times for their OEM stuff.

Can you not adjust the kings and fox while on the truck? That would make my choice easier. Lol

What I read about the KDSS was something like that but I couldn't find anything to back up the claim that the KDSS is stiff so progressive was better. If nobody else has worried about that I probably won't either.

I will be going remote reservoir if it's the best choice. I know it might be overkill for how I drive now but I want to buy the suspension and not ever regret not spending the extra money now. But I do see what you're saying about the complexity. The shop I'm working with recommended a remote reservoir in the rear due to the extra fuel and loaded down weight in the back but said I probably wouldn't need it in the front if I got a 2.5 to help. They are pretty sound on the terrain in Alaska, so I normally take into consideration their recommendation.

The guy at Filthy has some good (and long) videos talking in detail about suspensions. He's a King guy (who wouldn't be, after hearing that?) but it may help listening to him describe the differences.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MsKf1lIYI0

I've seen their site before and it's one of the first sites that made me think about kings. Reading the other posts, color is a deciding factor and seeing they do custom colors is a cool option if I went with kings. That blue just doesn't flow with my black/grey scheme haha. But that's not my deciding factor, as you can tell from me trying to research. I'll have to take a look at that video.

 

[JSparky]

I like ICON because you can adjust them on the truck with no issues and order them with the correct spring for your wight at no extra cost. Those are two major issues when it comes to installation time and cost with the other brands, IMHO.

Ordering with specific spring rates is what was most important to me this last go around as well. I couldn't get Fox to build them with 700lb coils directly, they wanted me to buy their off the shelf model and pay extra to have a different coil put it. That left me with King and Radflo, and I got something like 15% off during a Metaltech promo so went that route. By adjusting them on the vehicle, are you referring to preload?

 

[wfo9]

Can you not adjust the kings and fox while on the truck? That would make my choice easier. Lol

Depends. Technically there is a way to adjust the pre-load on the truck, you risk marring up the collar and skipping threads. The Kings specifically say not to adjust the ones with remote resi on the truck in the instructions, but people still do it sometimes with a punch and just chew it up a bit. However, many people have issues and bind up the threads by not having the exact right tension on the pinch bolt... The ones with remote resi are much more problematic since you can't get at at the holes easily (at least that is how the kings are)

The reason is that they use a pinch collar and it is thin with very few holes in it. it is best to pull them off, put a spring compressor on it and turn the collar then re-install.... The ICONs use a solid collar with lots of holes that is very easy to turn. I think Radflo is similar.... I was sort of shocked when I realized you could not adjust the Kings/Fox easy on the truck. Annoying to say the least, but at least you don't adjust them much (if ever) after they are set.