DHS raids couple's home to seize an imported old Land...

[4eigner]

It's not a T4R, or even a Toyota, but how likely could this have been one?

» Homeland Security Agents Raid Home to Seize Land Rover For Violation of EPA Regulations Alex Jones' Infowars: There's a war on for your mind!

Makes me wonder if getting an old Hillux or Surf when they are of age would subject me to the same treatment...

 

[Nervo19]

Did you read the comments? There is a plausible explanation. The couple needs to go after the eBay seller. I think I saw one for sale recently that was only about four years old. I do agree the DHS certainly has more important duties at this moment in history though.

Mr. FastPaws • 13 minutes ago:

"For anybody not familiar with the Land Rover Defender "game", let me explain it to you. The Defender is a vehicle that is illegal to import to the US. The safety devices, as well as emissions are not up to par with federal regulations, and haven't been for a good many years now. However, like the article says, a historic Defender (one made over 25 years ago) is legally allowed to be in the US.

People who want to import a Defender know this, however many of these same people want a newer version than one that's at least 25 years old. In order to skirt the law, these people have a newer version retrofitted in order to look like an older version. In this way, when the vehicle goes through US Customs, everything appears to be legitimate. However, US Customs agents have become a bit smarter, and are now privy to this common scheme.

My guess is that these people knowingly ordered a newer Defender and had it retrofitted to look like an older one. In fact, I can almost guarantee it. Anyone who truly knows these vehicle knows the game, and I find it extremely hard to believe otherwise.

Aside from this, I currently own 2 Defenders and they are some of the best true off-road vehicles money can buy."

 

[KCcarguy]

^^^all that aside, seems like a tremendous waste of resources to me. Especially considering our current border security issues, unrest in the Middle East, etc.

 

[fourwd1]

Moved to OT.

 

[BrianSD_42]

If you think that is a waste of resources you should read about the wasted Billions in Afghanistan. Anyone who has HBO GO I would suggest watching Vice s2e1.

Btw nothing in the comments properly explained the video/blog. Personally I don't think the Federal Government should be enforcing this type of thing. Yes there are better things they could be doing.

 

[T4R2014]

These guys should have better things to do than confiscating nice Land Rover's. You can find deathtraps legally registered on roads, yet an enthusiast owned Defender is a threat? These import laws are moronic and need to be axed.

 

[Omar RVA]

Let me start by saying I don’t agree with the government’s policy about importing vehicles (though I can understand why there’s some policy in place to begin with). After reading how the article was written and the comments I felt the need to note that this has been going on for 10+ years by DHS and its component agencies (Customs & Border Protection and ICE in particular). If the government really is bent on enforcing its vehicle importation rules, those agencies seem to be the most relevant to do so.

Though I’m unfamiliar with the Defender importation schemes, I’ve known, second hand, of many attempts to import foreign sports cars into the US and 9 times out of 10 those vehicles have been seized by Customs agents in a similar fashion or at the port (RS6 Avant, Lancia Delta, R34 Skylines, and S15 Silvias to name a few). As noted in the comment above – found by [MENTION=53465]Nervo19[/MENTION] – there’s a good chance that the couple either knew what they were doing or were duped by a seller (which is highly unlikely considering the cost/risk involved in shipping one of these over). There’s also the possibility that Customs got the wrong VIN.

My opinion on the whole thing is that it’s a HUGE waste of money. The government typically tries to auction the vehicles taken in the seizures to recoup cost, but the majority end up crushed since no one wants to buy a vehicle that can’t be driven here legally. Though it is almost entirely wasteful, this is probably just a small fraction of the money that gets pissed away by the feds every year.

OA

 

[lelandr]

I’ve known, second hand, of many attempts to import foreign sports cars into the US and 9 times out of 10 those vehicles have been seized by Customs agents in a similar fashion or at the port (RS6 Avant, Lancia Delta, R34 Skylines, and S15 Silvias to name a few). As noted in the comment above –

In the case of the Audi anyway, this is particularly stupid. From my understanding this is largely due to the fact that the RS6 is listed as a separate model from the A6 or S6 on which it is based & shares most of the non-driveline components. Audi decides not to crash test a bunch of cars which are pretty much the same as a bunch of cars that they have already crashed at the whim of regulators.

Though it is almost entirely wasteful, this is probably just a small fraction of the money that gets pissed away by the feds every year.

Wasting money does seem to be their forte.

 

[gaterose]

A friend of mine in FL had his D90 seized a couple of weeks ago, he said it was basically a tactical team with guns and vests and they scared the crap out of him.

I'm not sure if it's the same thing explained by the commenter quoted above, but my reading led me to believe that it is mostly over-refurbed older defenders that are being pursued rather than new ones "retrofitted" to look like an old one.

The stuff I read said that these are actual 25-year-old vehicles that are completely restored. The major problem is that some of the refurbishers are going overboard, as far as swapping in new aftermarket frames when the rust is too bad, then basically only reusing the frame VIN plates and brake boosters (or maybe it was steering pumps?) from the 25 y.o. models. The companies I read about would literally disassemble the old ones and replace anything necessary, not just start with a fresh(er) defender and simply replace the VIN plates and late-model components.

It's kinda the same thing but not exactly since it's a restoration/refurbishment and not retrofit. The one seized from my friend was definitely older.

edit- well his looked older, I must admit I don't know that I could accurately judge a 20 y.o. vs 25 y.o. vehicle of the same body style and configuration given the circumstances.

 

[Omar RVA]

This thread has lead me through a black hole of research into customs, vehicle importation, and a 70+ page thread on the Defender forums. I need to stop researching in depth everything that is intriguing to me.

Source

For the sake of updating the story, there seems to be a common denominator in the 40 to 60 Defenders that have been or are in the process of being seized. The majority all came from an importation company based in North Carolina and the word on the forum is that the company is known for importing later model Defenders and rebadging. It doesn't necessarily mean it's true, but it's food for thought.

[MENTION=108337]lelandr[/MENTION] you're mostly correct. The C6 RS6 Avant issues were because of Audi failing to crash test the Avant body style (which as you stated basically already existed) and largely due to EPA issues with the twin turbo engine. From the folks I knew second hand who tried to import other cars, the cost to test/meet crash standards alone were easily 10x the cost of the vehicle itself. Then you basically had to pray that the manufacturer would vouch for the engine.

[MENTION=50591]gaterose[/MENTION] Sorry to hear about your friend's D90. There are a few LR 90s that happen to live in my neighborhood and a US Spec Defender as well. Talk about eye candy. I hope his was an error and he's duly paid back.

OA

 

[gaterose]

Talk about eye candy.
OA

Yes, his was pretty sweet but well used

 

[Brian757]

This thread has lead me through a black hole of research into customs, vehicle importation, and a 70+ page thread on the Defender forums. I need to stop researching in depth everything that is intriguing to me.

Source

What's even crazier is the thread you posted start 15 days ago and it is already on page 78. I just started sticking my nose into this and its crazy. I also watched this 2013 video below, and thats just hard to watch. You'd think they'd pursue other issues of pollution rather than seizing and destroying people's vehicles.

And the guy at the end of the video sounds like a complete douchebag. He basically states, "Yeah, these people unknowingly purchase a vehicle that isn't the model year they thought and pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for them. Well, we come and seize them and make them worth $30. Mission success." Uh, yeah that's fair.

I also like how they destory every aspect of the vehicle, like popping the tires. Haha, are the tires illegal as well? I just don't understand this.

<embed src="http://static.dvidshub.net/media/video/1308/DOD_100886688/DOD_100886688-486x274-300k.mp4" height="290" width="490">

 

[Omar RVA]

What's even crazier is the thread you posted start 15 days ago and it is already on page 78. I just started sticking my nose into this and its crazy. I also watched this 2013 video below, and thats just hard to watch. You'd think they'd pursue other issues of pollution rather than seizing and destroying people's vehicles.

And the guy at the end of the video sounds like a complete douchebag. He basically states, "Yeah, these people unknowingly purchase a vehicle that isn't the model year they thought and pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for them. Well, we come and seize them and make them worth $30. Mission success." Uh, yeah that's fair.

I also like how they destory every aspect of the vehicle, like popping the tires. Haha, are the tires illegal as well? I just don't understand this.

What a clown. He's their program manager for public affairs too. You'd think you'd want someone who comes off as less of a jackass, but I'm sure everything he said is what he needs to tell himself every day to keep doing his job.

You were right though, that was kind of tough to watch.

OA

 

[LittleCaesar]

If Homeland is following such a murky line, then these boys will be quite busy busting down all the doors of the rich and shameless CEOs and such who have Cuban cigars in their humidors. After all it is a violation of the Cuban Trade Embargo. Heck, I think Americans can't even consume those cigars outside of America since 2004.

To all: caveat emptor when purchasing an automobile off Fleabay.

 

[lelandr]

[MENTION=108337]lelandr[/MENTION] you're mostly correct. The C6 RS6 Avant issues were because of Audi failing to crash test the Avant body style (which as you stated basically already existed) and largely due to EPA issues with the twin turbo engine. From the folks I knew second hand who tried to import other cars, the cost to test/meet crash standards alone were easily 10x the cost of the vehicle itself. Then you basically had to pray that the manufacturer would vouch for the engine.

I think it's even more stupid. My wife had an C6 A6 Avant, so Audi clearly crash-tested the C6 Avant for US certification. Us BMW fans saw this as well with earlier M3s. Many of the European versions even used the same block (meaning that the cars were nearly identical physically), but because the US govt wants EVERY model retested, smaller runs of cars never get to be imported, like M3 evolutions.

I know that the EPA probably also interferes, but that's also dumb. Let's face it, the RS6 comes from a country with a GREEN party. I'm sure that the couple hundred of these that US customers would have bought probably won't choke the air--additionally I'd suspect the RS6 to be cleaner than most cars. Hell, my 27 yo M3 passes current ATL- area emissions.

A shame too...There is just something cool about taking a midsize wagon & jamming a 570+hp twin-turbo V10 under the hood. We also never got any of the M5 wagons.

Just more of the nanny state protecting us from ourselves.

 

[lelandr]

I also like how they destory every aspect of the vehicle, like popping the tires. Haha, are the tires illegal as well? I just don't understand this.

Some real rocket science going on there. Like much on youtube, I feel more stupid just for watching it. This is CBP justifying their jobs.

I'd like to note, that this was about the stupidest way to break down a vehicle (aside from the basic crime of doing so). Anyone else notice that as they "crushed" the engine compartment that the vehicle basically dumped all of it's fluids on the ground? Most everything under the hood of a car is hazardous waste, and they've just dumped it for it to run into groundwater, etc.

I need to figure out how to send this to the EPA...

 

[fo' runnin']

some real rocket science going on there. Like much on youtube, i feel more stupid just for watching it. This is cbp justifying their jobs.

I'd like to note, that this was about the stupidest way to break down a vehicle (aside from the basic crime of doing so). Anyone else notice that as they "crushed" the engine compartment that the vehicle basically dumped all of it's fluids on the ground? Most everything under the hood of a car is hazardous waste, and they've just dumped it for it to run into groundwater, etc.

I need to figure out how to send this to the epa...

yes yes yes yes yes!!!!!!! ^^^^

 

[Brian757]

I need to figure out how to send this to the EPA...

You made a great point, but I think if you even got ahold of a DHS "representative" on the phone, they'd just put you on speakerphone, step back, and..:

 

[02SE]

What's even crazier is the thread you posted start 15 days ago and it is already on page 78. I just started sticking my nose into this and its crazy. I also watched this 2013 video below, and thats just hard to watch. You'd think they'd pursue other issues of pollution rather than seizing and destroying people's vehicles.

And the guy at the end of the video sounds like a complete douchebag. He basically states, "Yeah, these people unknowingly purchase a vehicle that isn't the model year they thought and pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for them. Well, we come and seize them and make them worth $30. Mission success." Uh, yeah that's fair.

I also like how they destory every aspect of the vehicle, like popping the tires. Haha, are the tires illegal as well? I just don't understand this.

<embed src="http://static.dvidshub.net/media/video/1308/DOD_100886688/DOD_100886688-486x274-300k.mp4" height="290" width="490">

It's a Government Agency.

Logic and common sense will not be tolerated.

 

[lelandr]

You made a great point, but I think if you even got ahold of a DHS "representative" on the phone, they'd just put you on speakerphone, step back, and..:

Plus with all of the foreign travel I do, I'm probably likely to make my own life more difficult...Uh, sir, we're going to need you to step over into THAT line....