Help me choose a 4th Gen

[carbon60]

Hi All,

Introduction:

I now have two years experience adventure glamping and wheeling in my 1996 80-series Land Cruiser, which is a rather old truck and has its share of rust and general age issues. So I'm starting my search for a replacement.

I do want to go out with the local off-road club every once and a while, so it needs to be capable. But I'm not going rock crawling or mud bogging.

I do several 2-3000 KM/12-1800 mile trips each year that include long sections of unmaintained dirt (and, of course, are 80% highway). Plus a bunch of long-weekend outings.

Questions:

- Which model years should I be looking at? 2005-2009?
- What options are important? Do they come in specific packages?
- I'm eventually going to want lockers front and rear, but that's just the cost difference between factory and after-market lockers, I think.
- KDSS sounds like it is very desirable!
- Only need to haul three people.

I would like to avoid the moon roof if that is possible, since I'm just going to cover it with a hard shell RTT, anyway.

What years are actually available without rust, low miles?

I think I want to spend between $15K and $20K.

Thanks for all comments, suggestions, etc.

A.

 

[MONTYMTB]

Welcome. Have you read through this thread? I'm sure folks will chime in on your questions, but it contains lots of good info. Good luck in your search.

 

[peebee]

If you want KDSS then you'll need to go for an '10 or newer Trail Edition. It's not available older than '10. These are the 5th gens and will be significantly more expensive than a 4th gen. You won't get one in your price range unless it's been wrecked/salvaged.

With that said, I love the 4th gen, and would suggest going for an '07 or newer V8 4x4. The V8's have full time 4x4, which makes me jealous.

I love the Sport Editions, but would only suggest getting them if you're wanting the aesthetics (scoop, running boards, roof rack, 2-tone cloth, etc.) because you're going to end up ripping and replacing the suspension in the long run. Most people know this and just go for the SR5 and dump the savings into a new suspension. Finding a low miles, well taken care of, 07-09 V8, 4x4 Sport is going to take some time and will likely cost you the entire $20k.

Overall, I think the best advice I can give you is to be patient. I looked for probably 3-4 months almost daily until I found my white '07.

I was pretty monotonous in getting a good clean vehicle with a great service history, but I finally found it. Previous owners were on the ball:

 

[carbon60]

I think KDSS is out, then!

SR5 is in…

I thought the V6 has a centre diff and disconnectable front driveshaft thingy? Making it even more flexible than the V8 with a 2-4 MPG savings?

 

[carbon60]

Welcome. Have you read through this thread? I'm sure folks will chime in on your questions, but it contains lots of good info. Good luck in your search.

I did read it, but I'm going to read it again and try to answer more of my own questions. I was still left confused as to what is available.

Thanks!

 

[carbon60]

With that said, I love the 4th gen, and would suggest going for an '07 or newer V8 4x4. The V8's have full time 4x4, which makes me jealous.

What changed in MY2007?

 

[wnelax04sr5]

I think KDSS is out, then!

SR5 is in…

I thought the V6 has a centre diff and disconnectable front driveshaft thingy? Making it even more flexible than the V8 with a 2-4 MPG savings?

all 4runners have a lockable center diff, v8 is full time 4x4, v6 is selectable 4x4 or 4x2. there will be negligent mpg differences, you won't notice it between v6 or v8.

 

[MarkinWMich]

Desireable options/equipment:

4-wheel disc brakes (vs. rear drums)
338mm front rotors (vs. 316mm)
17" wheels (vs. 16")
HD 21mm rear sway bar (vs. 17mm)
Electronic rear locking differential

Note: Toyota did it right when they installed the Detroit True-Trac/Torsen differentials front and rear. It is arguably the best torque sensing, limited slip differential available. No clutches, no friction modifier, etc.

 

[Sporin]

all 4runners have a lockable center diff, v8 is full time 4x4, v6 is selectable 4x4 or 4x2. there will be negligent mpg differences, you won't notice it between v6 or v8.

The on-board MPG readout in my '05 V6 consistently says 19-22mpg. The one in my '06 V8 consistently read 15-18. Though the gauge itself is not often thought of as "accurate" I'd still say the V6, at least in my driving area and in my hands, gets noticeably better overall MPG.

Obviously, once you start lifting and adding bigger tires all of this MPG talk goes out the window anyway.

 

[carbon60]

all 4runners have a lockable center diff, v8 is full time 4x4, v6 is selectable 4x4 or 4x2. there will be negligent mpg differences, you won't notice it between v6 or v8.

So, isn't a V6 in 4x4 with the diff unlocked running exactly the same way as the V8?

 

[Sporin]

So, isn't a V6 in 4x4 with the diff unlocked running exactly the same way as the V8?

Yes, same exact tcase. Though I think I may have read the V8's front driveshaft is beefier but don't quote me.

One of the things I love about the 4th gens is the tcase. Up here in snow land, it's nice to be able to pop it into 4Hi and leave it there all week when its snowy and not have to worry about binding or any of that other part-time 4WD crap.

 

[carbon60]

Wow, with the lady being 12" shorter than I am, maybe I want the seat position memory.

 

[carbon60]

What states have a good combination of lots of T4Rs and no rust? Trying to compare between buying locally in Ottawa, Vancouver or a US state.

 

[MarkinWMich]

What states have a good combination of lots of T4Rs and no rust? Trying to compare between buying locally in Ottawa, Vancouver or a US state.

The desert southwest (Arizona, New Mexico, Utah, Nevada, etc.). Keep in mind that a stock T4R of this age, is likely to have dry-rotted bushings on the OEM parts (dry heat). You may be trading one set of problems (rust) for others (the effects of prolonged dry heat, dust, rocky trails, etc.)

Most of the rigs that I have seen (of all makes, models, ages) in this area of the country had excellent bodies and modified suspensions to deal with desert and rocky terrain. Most appeared to have been well taken care of, though. So, like anything, do your research.

 

[olsen_karl]

Desireable options/equipment:

4-wheel disc brakes (vs. rear drums)
338mm front rotors (vs. 316mm)
17" wheels (vs. 16")
HD 21mm rear sway bar (vs. 17mm)
Electronic rear locking differential

Note: Toyota did it right when they installed the Detroit True-Trac/Torsen differentials front and rear. It is arguably the best torque sensing, limited slip differential available. No clutches, no friction modifier, etc.

This may be somewhat misleading to the OP.

1) All 4th gen 4Runners have 4-wheel disc brakes.
2) All "Sport" 4th gen, and some "Limited" 4th gen, have the larger front rotors.
3) 17" wheels are required with the larger front brake rotors, but were available with the smaller rotors. In other words, the presence of 17" wheels on a 4R does not necessarily mean that it has the larger rotors.
4) I have no idea on which years/option packages/etc. have a larger rear sway bar.
5) The only 4th gen 4R with a locking rear differential -- fully locked, switch activated -- is the 2009 "Trail" package.
6) There is no factory TrueTrac or Torsen carrier in the front or rear differential on any 4th gen 4R. There is a factory Torsen differential in the transfer case, which is lockable (pushbutton) to a 50/50 front/rear split. There is also Toyota's computer-controlled traction assistance, called "ATRAC," which I believe is standard on all 4WD 4th gen 4R -- I do not know if there were any revisions in ATRAC over the course of the 4th gen. It uses the ABS brake system to operate.

 

[MarkinWMich]

This may be somewhat misleading to the OP.

1) All 4th gen 4Runners have 4-wheel disc brakes.
2) All "Sport" 4th gen, and some "Limited" 4th gen, have the larger front rotors.
3) 17" wheels are required with the larger front brake rotors, but were available with the smaller rotors. In other words, the presence of 17" wheels on a 4R does not necessarily mean that it has the larger rotors.
4) I have no idea on which years/option packages/etc. have a larger rear sway bar.
5) The only 4th gen 4R with a locking rear differential -- fully locked, switch activated -- is the 2009 "Trail" package.
6) There is no factory TrueTrac or Torsen carrier in the front or rear differential on any 4th gen 4R. There is a factory Torsen differential in the transfer case, which is lockable (pushbutton) to a 50/50 front/rear split. There is also Toyota's computer-controlled traction assistance, called "ATRAC," which I believe is standard on all 4WD 4th gen 4R -- I do not know if there were any revisions in ATRAC over the course of the 4th gen. It uses the ABS brake system to operate.

Hmmm. My '06 SR5, per my VIN code came with the larger 21mm rear sway bar, the 338mm rotors, the 17" wheels...so, obviously, this was optional equipment on the SR5's. The VIN decoder also states that I have the "Torsen LSD w/locking feature"...but perhaps, as you say, it is referring to the transfer case.

 

[olsen_karl]

Hmmm. My '06 SR5, per my VIN code came with the larger 21mm rear sway bar, the 338mm rotors, the 17" wheels...so, obviously, this was optional equipment on the SR5's. The VIN decoder also states that I have the "Torsen LSD w/locking feature"...but perhaps, as you say, it is referring to the transfer case.

Interesting... do you have the "Sport" package? (X-reas, hood scoop... I'm sure there are other items, but I don't remember what they all are.) IIRC, the Sport shows up as an SR5 on the codes, but has quite a bit of different equipment.

Did you run the VIN through a dealer, or is there an online search tool that can show all that info?

Also -- I think my post below is wrong on all "Limited" models having the larger brakes. I think some did, but not all. But all "Sport" models did get the larger brakes and required 17" wheels.

 

[MarkinWMich]

Funny you say that. I just checked another VIN decoder site, there are many, but it decoded mine as the "Sport" model, but mine is clearly badged as an "SR5". When I ordered my brake rotors a few weeks back, I found I had to put mine as a "Sport" model in order to find the 338mm rotors I needed. Perhaps I've got the SR5 trim, but with some of the Sport running gear...no XREAS system.

Addendum: After doing some more searching, it would appear that there were many different option packages available for the 2006's (and probably other model years, as well). So, it doesn't look like I have some "rare hybrid". It was likely just what particular package that particular dealership decided to order for their lot.

I've got that GKAGKA code. I need to confirm exactly what that means with regards to the front and rear differentials. I believe it is a 3.73 ring and pinion.

 

[carbon60]

Are there reasonable after-market front and rear lockers available?

 

[carbon60]

The desert southwest (Arizona, New Mexico, Utah, Nevada, etc.). Keep in mind that a stock T4R of this age, is likely to have dry-rotted bushings on the OEM parts (dry heat). You may be trading one set of problems (rust) for others (the effects of prolonged dry heat, dust, rocky trails, etc.)

Seems to me that these problems would be easier to deal with than rust, no?

Thank you very much for the responses!