KDSS worth it?

[iDRiVaT4R]

KDSS is the only reason I even bought a new 4Runner. Well that and that its almost an FJ with 4 real doors.

Up front I think the suspension travel is the same as a non-KDSS 4Runner.
Out back, the down travel is all dependent on shock travel. Remove your shocks and the axle will drop another 2-3". Since I have KDSS I decided to not get long Radflo shocks, don't want to over extend the KDSS piston. Shocks are probably cheaper to repair than the KDSS system. And with A-Trac, a locker, KDSS, traction control and etc. there is no reason for me to even bother with extended travel rear shocks or front extended travel Coilovers for that matter.

 

[Falls]

I don't really know if it is a must have . It's really depends what you wanted to do with the truck and where you want to go. My truck has it but I have not tried it out yet. Ive been driving off road for 32 years , never had a need for it then. It's all what suits your needs. I will try it soon though. I'm just old school.

AS FAR AS THE COMMENTS ON "SEARCHING" . Don't worry about that , if you cant find it then ask. There are alot of topics and questions that have been asked over and over. Not a big deal , and besides someone might have some new ideas or options that did not come up in your search.

No worries and welcome to TR4

Mike

 

[iDRiVaT4R]

I don't really know if it is a must have . It's really depends what you wanted to do with the truck and where you want to go. My truck has it but I have not tried it out yet.

Mike

You're technically using it every time you drive it around. Its essentially acting like a larger sway bar so your ride is more controlled compared to an SR5 or Limited without it. Just wanted to make you aware of that.

 

[SeattleMike]

Well some of us did buy our SUVs for four wheeling, and I will try and get some measurements for you about down travel front and rear. (buddy just got an SR5).

thanks, I'm interested because it seems like if you were planning on upgrading a trail's suspension to lift it, the handling would improve and make kdss active on road.

/hijack
I didn't say that the 4Runner can't be used for "four wheeling". I took the question in the context of the OP's question, which was "is KDSS worth it?", and not "should I skip the KDSS because I am planning XYZ upgrade?". Then I expressed my opinion: If something as technical as the amount of downtravel was of primary importance to me, I would have gone with something better suited for customization and hardcore wheeling... like a truck.
/end hijack

mgrande, from what I understand KDSS operates when one side is compressed more than the other and that triggers the uncompressed swaybar to disconnect. Driving at normal speeds on the street, that kind of compression would only occur in the course of an accident or as the precursor to one. So the aftermarket suspension would be unlikely to affect the performance of KDSS at all.

 

[osin]

I don't want to start new thread on this so I figured I will post here.*

Does anyone know the price of adding KDSS later on - perhaps by the Toyota dealer? Is it even possible? (I couldn't find the answer but I think I saw a thread on this couple months ago - search didn't give me an answer at this time).

 

[diver110]

fwiw, i hope you don't "shut up" after making your decision. folks would be especially interested to hear about the 4G Trail if you end up going that way. and another 5G Trail owner is a good addition to the forum too.

but coming on the board, posting a bunch of new threads for every pre-purchase question you have, and then "shutting up" and going on your merry way would pretty much justify all the "SEARCH, noob!" frustrations, imo. and you'll get little sympathy when you post a new thread next month complaining that your rear wiper is broken. (i'll save you the trouble: the window's not up all the way.)

I promise to stay involved, though perhaps not daily.

 

[sandcrawler]

no worries, diver. i hope you find the rig you want. good luck! :cheers:

 

[T4Fun]

I don't want to start new thread on this so I figured I will post here.*

Does anyone know the price of adding KDSS later on - perhaps by the Toyota dealer? Is it even possible? (I couldn't find the answer but I think I saw a thread on this couple months ago - search didn't give me an answer at this time).

dont think ive seen anyone add that to their vehicle. It may be unlikely you can add that later.

 

[Falls]

I don't want to start new thread on this so I figured I will post here.*

Does anyone know the price of adding KDSS later on - perhaps by the Toyota dealer? Is it even possible? (I couldn't find the answer but I think I saw a thread on this couple months ago - search didn't give me an answer at this time).

The KDSS was a $1750.00 option on my window sticker.

 

[nikobimmer]

Yes

Improves handling on and off road--must have option.

 

[BFLAN]

If suspension is going to stay stock, I think its also a must have!

If you are going to modify suspension with aftermarket coil overs, becomes less and less desirable IMO.

Depending on how high you go, you are really pushing the limits of the system, it was designed for stock height.

 

[Thai]

Does it lower the clearance underneath? I have only seen it on my friend's GX470...and it does have parts hanging a little lower than the frame.

 

[sandcrawler]

If suspension is going to stay stock, I think its also a must have!

If you are going to modify suspension with aftermarket coil overs, becomes less and less desirable IMO.

Depending on how high you go, you are really pushing the limits of the system, it was designed for stock height.

perhaps that's so if you're looking to install a long-travel setup, but for most lifts KDSS is a pretty damn nice piece of kit.

 

[BFLAN]

perhaps that's so if you're looking to install a long-travel setup, but for most lifts KDSS is a pretty damn nice piece of kit.

Maybe your right?????

Time will tell in a couple years how well KDSS is holding up with anything lifted over 2 inches.

I also dont think there is any difference on road or off with KDSS once a decent set of coilovers is put on. Dont get me wrong, with a stock setup its a must have, but once you change everything out, i dont think any of you guys would notice the difference! The suspension just gets stiff enough the sway goes away!

 

[Hawkdog21]

Maybe your right?????

Time will tell in a couple years how well KDSS is holding up with anything lifted over 2 inches.

I also dont think there is any difference on road or off with KDSS once a decent set of coilovers is put on. Dont get me wrong, with a stock setup its a must have, but once you change everything out, i dont think any of you guys would notice the difference! The suspension just gets stiff enough the sway goes away!

Well I am not sure if I agree 100 percent but id say you are pretty close. One thing I would say is the first sentence^^^, with stock sway bars attached on a non-KDSS truck, you WOULD be able to tell a difference off-road based on the fact that KDSS would disconnect. As far as on road, I cannot comment because I have not been in a lifted non-KDSS 5th gen, but I bet your pretty much right.

 

[T4Fun]

here is a pic of the KDSS on my GX
It does NOT really protrude below vehicle more than other components.]
The larger 'bladder' is the air suspension. The KDSS is the thinner bladder attached to the thick sway bar...This is a view of the back, spare tire underneath

 

[Thai]

Maybe your right?????

Time will tell in a couple years how well KDSS is holding up with anything lifted over 2 inches.

I also dont think there is any difference on road or off with KDSS once a decent set of coilovers is put on. Dont get me wrong, with a stock setup its a must have, but once you change everything out, i dont think any of you guys would notice the difference! The suspension just gets stiff enough the sway goes away!

From my little knowledge of how suspension works, i am not sure that you're right. If that is the case, then why do sports cars need anti-roll bars for?!! They could just stiffen the shocks and springs and throw away the anti-roll bars...obviously, this is NOT the case.

Shocks, springs, and anti-roll bars have separate & distinct function that work together to give an end product (ride & handling competence). Coilovers and lifts only address one issue of the suspension...it is not an answer to everything regarding ride & handling.

A stiff coilover or lift kit may help with handling (to some degree), but at what cost to your kidneys?? Ride comfort over bumps or highway expansion joints? The nice thing about the Trail Edition stock suspension is that it rides smoothly on-road all the while being stable around corners. Bumps & highway joints all get absorbed nicely without jolting passengers. But, the thick anti-roll bars (in KDSS 4runners) allows for better stability around corners. You can't get this balance with most (if not all) aftermarket suspension systems, unless you're prepared to spend mega bucks. KDSS is all automatic (aka invisible in how it works)...so, you don't have to get out of your truck at the beginning of the trail and crawl underneath with a wrench to disconnect the sway bars (as you would do with an aftermarket anti-roll bar discos).

BTW, KDSS is a PROVEN technology in off-road racing ALL OVER THE WORLD! It is NOT a 2010 technology that just came out...it has been around for many years! So, durability nor reliability is not gonna be its weakness.

*****My soap box...why is everyone so quick to dismiss the stock setup?? You guys seem to think that Toyota engineers are a bunch of idiots who can't design a decent setup. Instead, you guys trust small companies who have tight budget (and knowledge in some cases!) and only designs one-size-fit-all kits...and in most cases, these small outfits don't even specialize in Toyotas, much less 4runners! Good luck relying on these folks...i will stick to the manufacturer's engineers. :hatsoff:

 

[Thai]

here is a pic of the KDSS on my GX
It does NOT really protrude below vehicle more than other components.]
The larger 'bladder' is the air suspension. The KDSS is the thinner bladder attached to the thick sway bar...This is a view of the back, spare tire underneath

Cool...thanks. Not bad at all...how about the front suspension...i remembered seeing that this was lower?????

 

[BFLAN]

From my little knowledge of how suspension works, i am not sure that you're right. If that is the case, then why do sports cars need anti-roll bars for?!! They could just stiffen the shocks and springs and throw away the anti-roll bars...obviously, this is NOT the case.

Shocks, springs, and anti-roll bars have separate & distinct function that work together to give an end product (ride & handling competence). Coilovers and lifts only address one issue of the suspension...it is not an answer to everything regarding ride & handling.

A stiff coilover or lift kit may help with handling (to some degree), but at what cost to your kidneys?? Ride comfort over bumps or highway expansion joints? The nice thing about the Trail Edition stock suspension is that it rides smoothly on-road all the while being stable around corners. Bumps & highway joints all get absorbed nicely without jolting passengers. But, the thick anti-roll bars (in KDSS 4runners) allows for better stability around corners. You can't get this balance with most (if not all) aftermarket suspension systems, unless you're prepared to spend mega bucks. KDSS is all automatic (aka invisible in how it works)...so, you don't have to get out of your truck at the beginning of the trail and crawl underneath with a wrench to disconnect the sway bars (as you would do with an aftermarket anti-roll bar discos).

BTW, KDSS is a PROVEN technology in off-road racing ALL OVER THE WORLD! It is NOT a 2010 technology that just came out...it has been around for many years! So, durability nor reliability is not gonna be its weakness.

*****My soap box...why is everyone so quick to dismiss the stock setup?? You guys seem to think that Toyota engineers are a bunch of idiots who can't design a decent setup. Instead, you guys trust small companies who have tight budget (and knowledge in some cases!) and only designs one-size-fit-all kits...and in most cases, these small outfits don't even specialize in Toyotas, much less 4runners! Good luck relying on these folks...i will stick to the manufacturer's engineers. :hatsoff:

Never was implying that a stiffer suspension didn't need swaybars, nor was I implying that KDSS is some sort of new technology. Just saying that with a decent suspension, in the 5th Gen, most roll and sway go away with or without KDSS!

And yes I agree it is nice to not have to crawl underneath and disconnect sway's at the trailhead, but without disconnecting sways an aftermarket suspension without KDSS has more travel than stock suspension with KDSS and with the sway's off, an aftermarket suspension blows KDSS away with travel.

My only point is if you are going to mod your 4runner's suspension, KDSS becomes less and less fabulous!

Sorry if my post implied things I was definitely not tying to convey.

BTW what kind of 5th do you have.....your signature just says minivans, a prius and a G wagon?

 

[Thai]

BTW what kind of 5th do you have.....your signature just says minivans, a prius and a G wagon?

No 5th gen...just a fan of 4runners for a long time....